Building a country pile on the cheap

#1
I am asking about the planning issues involved in building an Eco-Home. From what I can gather if I can prove over a number of years that the land is providing an agricultural income sufficient to live off, then I can live in a caravan or a temporary structure until I can apply for planning permission. I am obviously going the Eco-Home route. In truth I couldn’t give a toss about MMGW, Kyoto or Cameron’s windmill. But I would like to know if anybody here has experience of this business and can share some pointers.


I have found a six acre plot of woodland consisting of deciduous and pine, which is already being used for small scale industrial production of firewood . It has frontage to a main road and lane, but is thankfully in the middle of a great expanse of countryside. The view across the fields is undisturbed by chav huts in every direction for miles.


My plan is to build a thatched roundhouse on said land. The walls would be of a straw bale infill, wood supported structure, finished with earthen stucco. The roof thatched with Norfolk reed, all mod cons supplied off grid, which is a major problem I’m looking at.


I am asking about the planning issues involved in building said Eco-home. From what I can gather, if I can prove over a number of years that the land is providing an agricultural income sufficient to live off, then I can live in a caravan or a temporary structure until I can apply for planning permission. I am obviously going the Eco-home route. I have heard it’s between four and eleven years, dependent on the structure you dwell in.

[FONT=&amp]I am looking at having a thatched, modern roundhouse, with a few stables and the already established wood business. I hope it might be worth a couple of hundred grand with outline planning permission for a brick pile[/FONT]




I know this is by far the worst place to post this; I don’t need a military installation building. But I figure if you cast your net far and wide you catch more fish. Plus after reading Arrse for a while I know there are many bright people, who I hope will understand my lack of green credentials, yet advise me anyway.
 
#2
Grand designs? get yer mush on the box along with how much under the thumb you are with the missus for all to enjoy?
 
#3
**** Grand Designs I don't think they really agree with 12v bulbs and stir your own shit toilets. What I'm talking about is using governments love of all things green to eventually get outline planning permission for a house in the middle of green belt land. In this case, sat in it's own six acres of woodland.

I'll build my straw house by ******* hand if through arguments with the local planning committee, I'm allowed to develop the land. It will be worth £300,000 with outline permission.

Has for the missus, she ******* hates the idea of a composting toilet you no imagination, lacking inspiration, no mark ****.
 
#7
No bullshit but straight answers you shall get....lets see...

just joined

first post some innane drivvel about an eco lefty, cardigan wearing liberal vegetarian shiote

i never bit back but the desperation to inflame the thread is effervescent

....let me sum this up...

sorrrrreee

already have, bore off...I'll leave this to the jury


your first reply was a clear 'bite'
 
#8
Best of luck getting a small living let alone enough to live off on six acres. As for getting planning permission on designated agricultural land, slimmer than a slim chance eco or no.
 

napier

LE
Moderator
Kit Reviewer
#9
A friend of my brother did similar (woodland, timber lodge, etc) his excuse being a small fish farm. Turns out the business was profitable enough so he didn't need to fudge the books.
 
#10
A friend of my brother did similar (woodland, timber lodge, etc) his excuse being a small fish farm. Turns out the business was profitable enough so he didn't need to fudge the books.
In the middle of a self-build at the moment. The 'agricultural tie' is a way to gain planning permission in an area of rural land. The crux is that once built and operating your rural business - the home and business are intrinsically linked to the point that if the business closes- the home is demolished- or at least there are challenges in selling afterwards- as this is to stop people starting a pencil whittling business to build a stately home etc.

I would focus on researching the agricultural tie and you local planning authorities view of it. God luck
 
#11
Ive always fancied this, huge expanses of land here in aus, all i need is a coastal fronted plot of land and a pile of cash to build my own mini harbour and water tight house on the break water. Something like this:

Porthgain-harbour-in-Pemb-008.jpg

But mine.
 
#12
How are you going to get water? ie are you drilling/sinking a well onto the property or using rain water capture system?

where does the local water table sit in relation to your proposed property? Will you be using a reed bed system in order to dispose of your waste water so is doesnt contaminate the local water table?

I take being off grid you will be using photovoltaic solar cells in order to generate electricity, couple with a massive battery bank? also will you be using a solar furnace idea for heating of water, some countries use solar furnaces to cook also, but bng in woodland will it work?

Wind/water turbines may also be used in order to produce energy pump water but in a woodland area do you have enough 'wind' in order to power a turbine or vawt? you could build high but will you get permission to.

if close to a river or stream you might be able to install a water powered turbine or water wheel to power your dwelling, however think of the flood plain area. You may not be able to alter the course of the steam/river due to any ecological impact.

a 12v system is viable for lighting etc, plus its cheap, led lighting would be ideal to use in garages and almost any area of the build.

as for sustainability i take it you will be using polly tunnels, which also require a lot of light in order to grow crops all year round?
 
#13
How are you going to get water? ie are you drilling/sinking a well onto the property or using rain water capture system?

where does the local water table sit in relation to your proposed property? Will you be using a reed bed system in order to dispose of your waste water so is doesnt contaminate the local water table?

I take being off grid you will be using photovoltaic solar cells in order to generate electricity, couple with a massive battery bank? also will you be using a solar furnace idea for heating of water, some countries use solar furnaces to cook also, but bng in woodland will it work?

Wind/water turbines may also be used in order to produce energy pump water but in a woodland area do you have enough 'wind' in order to power a turbine or vawt? you could build high but will you get permission to.

if close to a river or stream you might be able to install a water powered turbine or water wheel to power your dwelling, however think of the flood plain area. You may not be able to alter the course of the steam/river due to any ecological impact.

a 12v system is viable for lighting etc, plus its cheap, led lighting would be ideal to use in garages and almost any area of the build.

as for sustainability i take it you will be using polly tunnels, which also require a lot of light in order to grow crops all year round?
Thanks for your questions.


I am expecting to be able to use rain water capture for much of my non-potable water needs, with a tank for potable water delivered by a local company. On average in the UK only 3% of the water we use is drinking water, a third of it goes down the loo, and the next largest use is the washing machine. I’m planning on installing a composting toilet so there goes a third of the water use straight away. I also live in Lancashire and it never stops raining. I’ll use a soak away for disposing of the waste water.


The woodland is surrounded on three sides by arable fields. I plan to build on the southern edge of the woods to ensure plenty of light. So yes, I will be using solar for power generation. By using lower power 12v lighting and sacrificing the desktop for a laptop etc. I expect to be able to manage fine. I built a canal barge a few years ago, for that I used a bank of five leisure batteries, connected to a 3000w pure sine wave inverter. Although in that instance power was provided by a diesel engine, I don’t expect the set up to be particularly different and we are used to living with limited power.


The benefit of living in a wood is a plentiful supply of fuel. I would be planning to use a wood burning stove with back boiler to supply hot water for heating, washing etc.


I don’t like turbines for power generation, there is no source of running water on the property and I consider wind power, whether a small turbine at home or a massive turbine on a hill, a waste of money.
 
#14
Am I gettin this right, you want to build a house in the middle of a forrest, which they haven't alowed for getting on a 100 yrs? You've more chance of getting noshed off by the Queen, no matter how "Green" you make it you will be f**ked off.
 
#15
Am I gettin this right, you want to build a house in the middle of a forrest, which they haven't alowed for getting on a 100 yrs? You've more chance of getting noshed off by the Queen, no matter how "Green" you make it you will be f**ked off.
I'm not really bothered about green, it's nice and all that but in this instance it will help me to finally get planning permission somewhere down the line.

First off, if you can live off a business that is connected to said land and your permanent presence is required then you can live there. This land is already felled commercially.

Admittedly you can't just turn up and build your house on that alone. You could put a static on the site and live in that no problem, eventually they will give you planning permission for a house. Or you go down the sustainable eco-habitat route, build your house with bales, make sure no butterflies were harmed in construction and you will eventually end up with acres of woodland in the countryside with planning permission. And all for less than the price of a terraced house.
 
#16
I'm not really bothered about green, it's nice and all that but in this instance it will help me to finally get planning permission somewhere down the line.

First off, if you can live off a business that is connected to said land and your permanent presence is required then you can live there. This land is already felled commercially.

Admittedly you can't just turn up and build your house on that alone. You could put a static on the site and live in that no problem, eventually they will give you planning permission for a house. Or you go down the sustainable eco-habitat route, build your house with bales, make sure no butterflies were harmed in construction and you will eventually end up with acres of woodland in the countryside with planning permission. And all for less than the price of a terraced house.
what exactly is it you're after? from your last two posts you seem to have all your answers or are you just making it up as you go along?
 
#17
Piggery to start , then a caravan as the pigs need attention 24/7 , then ask for dwelling PP in a few years , otherwise stop dreaming , you cant do this eco BS house in the UK , if you ever get PP which is very unlikley the house would have an agricultural tie which means it can only be inhabited by people who earn their living from agriculture so its value who be much less than normal.
If you want to be a rural hippy twat go to somewhere like Spain and buy a small farmhouse with some land , you will get one from £60k.
 
#18
You want to live in a beautiful, unspoilt rural location and all the while not being seriously minted?

I'm afraid that's just not the thing, old bean, not the thing at all. As you will discover.
 
#19
You want to live in a beautiful, unspoilt rural location and all the while not being seriously minted?

I'm afraid that's just not the thing, old bean, not the thing at all. As you will discover.
You could be a pikey and pull up on Exmoor :)
 
#20
Somebody is living in “Electric Moo-Moo Land”………. However, whilst I know ZERO about UK planning law, I do know more than most about constructing a ZERO carbon footprint, eco-friendly property at the EU’s expense having spent the last ten years doing just that. Yes three derelict barns are now a seven bedroom property complete with all modern conveniences, including an indoor swimming pool and a kitchen that is bigger then the ground-floor of an average three-bedroomed detached house .

EU guidelines
Section C1: Development should not be permitted in an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty
Section C2: Planning permission should not be granted where SSSI’s and SINC’s are to be found
Section C10: Planning permission should not be granted for a development that will lead to an irreversible loss of fertile land

Section C13: Planning permission will only be granted if the proposal forms part of a farm diversification scheme:

  1. The scheme where possible re-uses existing building
  2. Where a new building is required and no existing building is available for conversion, it is sited within an existing group of buildings
  3. It does not harm the character of the local landscape or other local amenity: and
  4. The traffic generated is not of a type or volume that would cause inconvenience or danger on the public highway, or would require improvements that would harm the character of rural roads.

My husband and I were fortunate as our development was deemed to meet the criteria of Section C14:


  1. A structural survey showed that the building was of sound, permanent construction, and could accommodate the proposed use without substantial reconstruction
  2. The form, scale and general design of the building was in keeping with its surroundings
  3. The conversion work respected local building styles and materials
  4. Our proposal would not harm rural amenities by reason of noise, smell, dust, smoke, lighting, vibration, or any form of water, soil or air pollution or operations at unsocial hours,
  5. That traffic generated was not of a type or amount inappropriate to the local rural roads or requires improvements which will harm the character of rural roads in the area
  6. The scale and location of the development would not lead to unsustainable travel patterns through excessive use of the car or delivery vehicles
  7. There was sufficient room in the curtilage of the building for any external storage required and the parking and turning of vehicles without detriment to the visual amenity of the countryside
  8. No new fences, walls or other structures associated with the use of the building or the definition of its curtilage or any sub division of it would be erected if they would harm the visual amenity of the countryside
  9. The scale of development, by itself or together with other employment proposals in the area, would not have an adverse effect on the viability or vitality of existing or proposed employment areas within a nearby settlement

My sincerest advice would be to talk to your local planning authority to see if there is “permitted development rights”. If our local authority are anything to go by – they could not have been more helpful, obtaining grants on our behalf for “Ground-source Heating”, Solar and Photovoltaic Panels, Water pump and filtration system, and a Mini Sewage Treatment Plant.
 

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