British war debt to US due to be paid off by 31 Dec

#1
"Bob Spink: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) what outstanding liabilities there are to the United Kingdom of lend-lease loan facilities arranged during the Second World War; [38441]…"

"Ruth Kelly: The information is as follows."…

"Under the Agreement the loans would be repaid in 50 annual instalments commencing in 1950. However the Agreement allowed deferral of annual payments of both principal and interest if necessary because of prevailing international exchange rate conditions and the level of the United Kingdom's foreign currency and gold reserves. The United Kingdom has deferred payments on six occasions. Repayment of the war loans to the United States Government should therefore be completed on 31 December 2006, subject to the United Kingdom not choosing to exercise its option to defer payment.
Perfect timing eh?

Another reason to raise a glass come Hogmanay!
 
#2
so does this mean we have spare cash again???? if so how are the Government going to spend it?
 
#4
A bit more info from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease:

Large quantities of goods were in Britain or in transit when Washington suddenly and unexpectedly terminated Lend-Lease on 2 September 1945. These were sold to Britain for about 10 cents on the dollar with payment to be stretched out for 50 years at 2% interest. [3] Debate in the Commons on 28 February 2002 shows that Britain expected to complete its repayment of its monetary debt to the USA on 31 December 2006, over 61 years from the conclusion of World War II:

"Bob Spink: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) what outstanding liabilities there are to the United Kingdom of lend-lease loan facilities arranged during the Second World War; [38441]…"

"Ruth Kelly: The information is as follows..."

"Under the Agreement, the loans would be repaid in 50 annual instalments commencing in 1950. However the Agreement allowed deferral of annual payments of both principal and interest if necessary because of prevailing international exchange rate conditions and the level of the United Kingdom's foreign currency and gold reserves. The United Kingdom has deferred payments on six occasions. Repayment of the war loans to the United States Government should therefore be completed on 31 December 2006, subject to the United Kingdom not choosing to exercise its option to defer payment.

As at 31 March 2001, principal of $346,287,953 (£243,573,154 at the exchange rate on that day) was outstanding on the loans provided by the United States Government in 1945. The Government intend to meet its obligations under the 1945 Agreement by repaying the United States Government in full the amounts lend [sic] in 1945."

Similarly, Hansard records from a debate that took place in the House of Lords on 8 July 2002:

"Lord Campbell of Croy: My Lords, is this payment part of the lend-lease scheme under which the United States supplied munitions, vehicles and many other requirements including food and other provisions that were needed badly by us in the last part of the war?
Lord McIntosh of Haringey: My Lords, I referred to lend-lease in the context of the generosity of the United States throughout that period. However, the debt that we are talking about now is separate; it was negotiated in December 1945.
Lord Stoddart of Swindon: My Lords, will the noble Lord remind me as to exactly how much the loan was, and how much we have repaid since then in principal and interest?
Lord McIntosh of Haringey: My Lords, the loan originally was £1,075 million, of which £244 million is outstanding. The basis of the loan is that interest is paid at 2 per cent. Therefore, we are currently receiving a greater return on our dollar assets than we are paying in interest to pay off the loan. It is a very advantageous loan for us."
On 3 May 2006, the British Treasury Minister, Ivan Lewis in a commons reply said "Repayment of the war loans to the US Government is expected to be completed on December 31 2006," The final payment will be £45 million (as reported by the BBC [1]).
So its only £45Million a year, a drop in the ocean when considered as part of the over all budget. Though I'm sure it will be put to good use, no doubt at least in part to furnish some ministers with a Jag or 3 each.
 
#7
Maybe we can now afford for a few more Chief Constables to have their shower facilities brought up to scratch ;-)
 
#10
Mr Happy said:
i thought we paid it off under thatcher...
I'm sure this is the second, or perhaps third, similar story I've seen under this government.
 
#11
Why can't we recoup these repayments from the Germans? They started it? :twisted:

not quite true, technically we started it, but they had invaded Poland before the UK issued the fateful ultimatum
 
#13
G_D_Q_D_G said:
Any other country's still owe money from ww2 era' ?!?!
Most other countrys had theirs written off, I know both the Germans, French and Soviets had massive chunks of their debts slashed as it was obvious they wouldnt be able to keep up with payment.
 
#14
What took you feckers so long?
 
#15
Drago_Drake said:
G_D_Q_D_G said:
Any other country's still owe money from ww2 era' ?!?!
Most other countrys had theirs written off, I know both the Germans, French and Soviets had massive chunks of their debts slashed as it was obvious they wouldnt be able to keep up with payment.
- The Soviet Union reached an Agreement in 1972 on repayments of US deliveries to the USSR;

The list below is the amount of war matériel shipped to the Soviet Union through the Lend-Lease program from the beginning of it until 30 September 1945.

Aircraft 14,795 -B25's, A20's, P39's, P63's, C47's, for the most part

Tanks 7,056- Granted most of these Tanks were M3 Grants of little practicality, but were in Frontline use by US/UK as well at that time. They did also recieve the M4A2,76mm(w) in some numbers.

Jeeps 51,503
Trucks 375,883
Motorcycles 35,170
Tractors 8,071
Guns 8,218
Machine guns 131,633
Explosives 345,735 tons
Building equipment valued $10,910,000
Railroad freight cars 11,155
Locomotives 1,981
Cargo ships 90
Submarine hunters 105
Torpedo boats 197
Ship engines 7,784
Food supplies 4,478,000 tons
Machines and equipment $1,078,965,000
Non-ferrous metals 802,000 tons
Petroleum products 2,670,000 tons
Chemicals 842,000 tons
Cotton 106,893,000 tons
Leather 49,860 tons
Tires 3,786,000
Army boots 15,417,000 pairs
 
#16
On conclusion of WW2 Great Britain no longer ruled the waves and was no longer number one world super power, that mantle was taken up by the US and has remained ever since. Surely that was payment enough.

Military historians, can you tell me, were the US planning to overthrow Great Britain prior to the WW2? And was it the timing of WW2 that 'saved us'?
 
#17
O2Thief said:
On conclusion of WW2 Great Britain no longer ruled the waves and was no longer number one world super power, that mantle was taken up by the US and has remained ever since. Surely that was payment enough.

Military historians, can you tell me, were the US planning to overthrow Great Britain prior to the WW2? And was it the timing of WW2 that 'saved us'?
-"Overthrow" I dont believe so. Now as does any Military there was a Contingency plan for wars with various Countries;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Color-coded_War_Plans

Everything from War Plan Emerald(Ireland) to War Plan Red (Britain & Canada)
 
#18
O2Thief said:
On conclusion of WW2 Great Britain no longer ruled the waves and was no longer number one world super power, that mantle was taken up by the US and has remained ever since. Surely that was payment enough.

Military historians, can you tell me, were the US planning to overthrow Great Britain prior to the WW2? And was it the timing of WW2 that 'saved us'?
Really WW1 was the beginning of the end for the Empire, we expended massive resources and basically exhausted it by the end of WW1, at the breakout of WW2 in order to ensure safety and victory the Empire had to be pushed to its very limits taking it to and later beyond breaking point, and in doing so we made the conscious choice of stopping 'evil' or maintaining 'empire', the former won out. After WW1 there was a requirement for time, reorganisation, re-investment etc to resecure it as an institution and revitalise it, unfortunately because of WW2, if we wanted to fight we wouldn’t be able to do that. Instead it would be the choice that if we fought WW2 and brought the Empire to bare then it would be as its last great act, because doing so would eventually break it.
It was the shield and sword that protected the world from both world wars, and in doing so had to be sacrificed

Although the process was quite deliberately sped up by the yanks who forced us to give up assets in order to receive aid after ww2, claiming 'anti-imperialism'. Which is part of why we essentially cut and ran from Africa and the Middle East, which contributed to why they are absolute hellholes today. Because of the position we were left in, it essencially created a vacume, and the US being the only country not to be directly effected (razed to the ground) by the war, still had massive wealth and industry, so it was able to assert itself in our old position.

At the end of WW2 however, Churchill was rather set on the idea of using our rather large conscript Army to go and do a bit of 're-conquering' in the name of the crown, but was later dissuaded as it would have been likely to start another large war.
 
#19
Thank you very much LineDoggie and Drago Drake for that very useful information. So really the US is little more than an animal willing to fight with any other animal, regardless of size and threat, in order to stay alive.

Have any such plans been declassified which show the UK had similar plans against other countries including the US?
 
#20
O2Thief said:
Thank you very much LineDoggie and Drago Drake for that very useful information. So really the US is little more than an animal willing to fight with any other animal, regardless of size and threat, in order to stay alive.

Have any such plans been declassified which show the UK had similar plans against other countries including the US?
Basically the US just exploited a very beneficial situation, as any other nation would have done.

As for war plans, from memory there were some declassified a while back, try one of the newpapers sites I'm sure a search or two would pick something up.
 

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