British security contractor. Death penalty - Iraq.

#4
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav twat who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
 
#5
All he has to do is make himself pregnant and the FCO will get him back to the UK toot sweet, as they say in...well somewhere.
 

Schaden

LE
Book Reviewer
#6
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
Ex Para some reports were saying - 2 Para I think...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/10/iraq-armorgroup-shootings-confession-fitzsimons
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article6789098.ece?token=null&offset=12&page=2
Mr Fitzsimons posted details about his military past on a Facebook page set up to honour fallen service personnel. He tells of his time in 2 Para and his 3½ years in private security work. He advises soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan: "Stay safe and to those who will return to fight a different battle ... A war inside your head
 
#7
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
Apparently he spent 8 years in 2 PARA

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...tings-sent-anguished-messages-to-friends.html
 
#8
baboon6 said:
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
Apparently he spent 8 years in 2 PARA

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...tings-sent-anguished-messages-to-friends.html
Not quite, seeing as he was in 2RRF in the late 90's (and was widely regarded as being a cnut)
 
#9
Social_Handgrenade said:
baboon6 said:
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
Apparently he spent 8 years in 2 PARA

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...tings-sent-anguished-messages-to-friends.html
Not quite, seeing as he was in 2RRF in the late 90's (and was widely regarded as being a cnut)
Article I read said he was ex-para, but later mentioned ex-fusileer. Sounds like you know of him , social?
 
#11
para-dox said:
Social_Handgrenade said:
baboon6 said:
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
Apparently he spent 8 years in 2 PARA

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...tings-sent-anguished-messages-to-friends.html
Not quite, seeing as he was in 2RRF in the late 90's (and was widely regarded as being a cnut)
Article I read said he was ex-para, but later mentioned ex-fusileer. Sounds like you know of him , social?
Only vaugely (was in the same company) but several mates remember him very well....

My Mate said:
Should have beasted him more often. Looking forward to watching the execution on YouTube
Pretty much sums it up i think!
 
#12
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
It was a circus when the cheque books first came out.
Doormen, event security types, civvys with cornflake box quals went, and as mad as it sounds all manner of support arm experienced soldiers.
You had the unenviable situation whereby clients were being 'protected' by ex drivers, VM's, TA bods, all unfamiliar with the AO, untrained, badly sourced kit/weapons/vehicles. The individuals who were of the 'ilk' were tasked with managing teams that had little to no base level skill, contact drills, basic trauma management, evasive driving were all taught 'in theatre' in some cases, and the need to earn money pretty much ensured that within a couple of days of you tipping up you were out on tasking.
It got pulled into line somewhat, try and bluff your way into Aegis and you'll see what I mean, but I still had the pleasure of having a wet in Kabul with a Gordon Highlander who had been out 18 years and had been working in a power station since, nice bloke but that last time he took his safety off was in Derry when bomber jackets were de riguer.
If you havent the background, skillset or experience then forget it. A lot of redfaces have gotten as far as KAF and the COB only to be whistled back out of theatre next day.
 
#13
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
I guess you haven't been following this tale of woe:

http://www.arrse.co.uk/Forums/viewtopic/t=124516.html

For some, if they don't have military experience or training just make it up.
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#15
lofty_lofty said:
'The Circuit' by Bob Shepard is a cracking read and covers exactly the subject that Reni touched upon-no experience in CP type skillls.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0330471929/?tag=armrumser-21
Relatively few contractors out there are doing true CP work. Convoy protection, static guards, general FP duties etc make up a lot of the work.

The reputable firms have very stringent recruitment criteria now, much tighter than they were in the Gold Rush of 2003/2004.
 
#16
I have no idea about Iraqi law, the requirements for proof and whether there is a distinction between murder and manslaughter (and the difference in sentencing if there is a distinction), but given the following, there could be a case of reasonable doubt for him to be convicted of murder.

Former paratrooper Daniel Fitzsimons claimed he shot his colleagues in self-defence during a drunken row.
Last night Fitzsimons told The Times: 'I got into a fight with two colleagues and they had me pinned down. I received a real beating.
'They beat me and that's when I reached for my weapon. I was drunk and it happened very quickly.'
Interior Ministry spokesman Maj Gen Abdul-Kareem Kalaph said: 'The British guard admitted his crime of killing the two men.
'He remains under investigation in the Green Zone on charges of premeditated murder.'
Maj Gen Kalaph said the row broke out after the men had been drinking.
He said: 'They got into an argument and he started shooting his colleagues.'
 
#17
UK PLC seems to have a random approach to UK nationals in various bother round the world. At least the US are consistent with their protection of US nationals from "less developed" legal systems

I disagree with the death penalty for anyone, especially when dished out from less than "Balanced" systems

Weapons, vodka and soldiers don't go well together

What happened to the other contractor murder up north at the powerstation. All kept very quiet, That was armour group as well
 
#18
reni_77 said:
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
It was a circus when the cheque books first came out.
Doormen, event security types, civvys with cornflake box quals went, and as mad as it sounds all manner of support arm experienced soldiers.
You had the unenviable situation whereby clients were being 'protected' by ex drivers, VM's, TA bods, all unfamiliar with the AO, untrained, badly sourced kit/weapons/vehicles. The individuals who were of the 'ilk' were tasked with managing teams that had little to no base level skill, contact drills, basic trauma management, evasive driving were all taught 'in theatre' in some cases, and the need to earn money pretty much ensured that within a couple of days of you tipping up you were out on tasking.
It got pulled into line somewhat, try and bluff your way into Aegis and you'll see what I mean, but I still had the pleasure of having a wet in Kabul with a Gordon Highlander who had been out 18 years and had been working in a power station since, nice bloke but that last time he took his safety off was in Derry when bomber jackets were de riguer.
If you havent the background, skillset or experience then forget it. A lot of redfaces have gotten as far as KAF and the COB only to be whistled back out of theatre next day.
Wow Reni...must have been tough for you mate.... :roll:
 
#19
On the news today - he is ex-Para, traumatised by service in Afgn, lists his hobbies as drinking, being depressed and taking drugs. He sounds like another one of life's victims - poor thing.
 
#20
Rarden_reaper said:
reni_77 said:
supermatelot said:
My question is..

The article makes no mention of any former service. Is he just some tw@t who loves guns and glory? Is he an fine example of ambition without training?

I don't know anything about the security circuit. Thought some here will though. Dont the firms require ex-service as a pre-requisite?? To my 'uneducated in these matters' mind he seems like a chav t**t who just wanted to "large it". Inan environment, not totally without risk but where he thought he could pull it off.

I stand by to be corrected.
It was a circus when the cheque books first came out.
Doormen, event security types, civvys with cornflake box quals went, and as mad as it sounds all manner of support arm experienced soldiers.
You had the unenviable situation whereby clients were being 'protected' by ex drivers, VM's, TA bods, all unfamiliar with the AO, untrained, badly sourced kit/weapons/vehicles. The individuals who were of the 'ilk' were tasked with managing teams that had little to no base level skill, contact drills, basic trauma management, evasive driving were all taught 'in theatre' in some cases, and the need to earn money pretty much ensured that within a couple of days of you tipping up you were out on tasking.
It got pulled into line somewhat, try and bluff your way into Aegis and you'll see what I mean, but I still had the pleasure of having a wet in Kabul with a Gordon Highlander who had been out 18 years and had been working in a power station since, nice bloke but that last time he took his safety off was in Derry when bomber jackets were de riguer.
If you havent the background, skillset or experience then forget it. A lot of redfaces have gotten as far as KAF and the COB only to be whistled back out of theatre next day.
Wow Reni...must have been tough for you mate.... :roll:
Must be even tougher for you,finding out Reni's been taking the p1ss out of you all this time :D
 

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