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Britain's policing is amongst the worst in the world...

Now chaps, the use of the word 'Force' suggests the Police aren't nice politcally correct guys and gals, Police 'Service' is the buzzword as the Police are there to serve all members of the community - not to en'force' the law. Don't want to be seen as oppressive now do we :?
 
I agree with ORC that the police seem to be getting ever more distant from the people, partly this is a matter of perception where they appear to find it easier to go after minor speeders than burglars or muggers, when you want a plod you can't get one for hours yet there's dozen waiting outside the pub for the closing-time fight or pulling you for 65mph on an open road in the middle of the night.
I would illustrate this by the tale from a friend. He lives in a fairly out of the way cottage with his fiance. He deals in various things including horses and sporting guns all of which are kept at home in proper storage. About midnight one night when he was out his fiance (who was at home with a broken leg) thought she heard something and spotted a couple of men watching the house. So she 'phoned plod and was eventually put through to someone who told her that the nearest available officer was about 45mins away. When she pointed out that there were half a dozen valuable guns in the cabinet and she was a lone injured female she was simply asked if she could access the weapons whan told no, plod said that was good as if she could he would be in breach of his FAC conditions and as there was nothing they could do would she please hang-up.
Meanwhile at exactly the same time, on the main road less than ten minutes away a plod had pulled my friend for the heinous crime of having a duff brake-light, the whole process took 25mins and at no time did either plod receive a radio message about the prowlers at his house. Police HQ had just ignored the call.

There is also the fact that the police are literally geting ever more distant from people in many areas. In Staffordshire the nearest regularly manned station to the south of the County is an hours drive away. It's not even as if South Staffs is a particularly sparsely populated area containing as it does the large commuter villages to the west of Birmingham and Wolverhampton. In Shropshire anyone arrested in Ludlow (where there is a newly built station) must be driven 20 miles to Telford for processing (because the new station has no cells).

On the other hand every Friday and Saturday night the police must deploy dozens of officers in towns to cover closing time fights. Why not just give a couple of officers a small water-cannon and hose down any fight that breaks out?
 

doctordeath

Old-Salt
I would have suggested that the chap informed the local and national papers of the situation but then there's a fairly good chance that in pointing out the failings of the local police he would find himself being visited by them on a regular basis. Not that I'm sinicle or anything!!!!! Tell your friend to get some very large rotweilers a big gate and a sign with a picture that says "I LIVE HERE" that may solve the immediate problem. Don't know of too many burglars who want to play with 20 stone of dogs looking for a free and moving meal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :twisted:
 
I agree that the police appear to be becoming less accessible to the public they are meant to serve. Whilst the endless paperwork and PC attitudes of government and management are mostly to blame, I sometimes despair at the attitude of some police officers I see.

Where I am currently located, Cambridgeshire, the police are rarely seen patrolling. If you see them out of their cars in the town centre, it's at McDonalds or an ATM. They are usually scruffily dressed with an unapproachable demeanour. I do not doubt that the job must be at times boring or frustrating, but this sort of thing will not improve it. At a recent unit welfare meeting it was reported that there had been complaints that a cluster of break-ins that had occurred on the patch (this seems to have increased since Annington Homes flogged about a third of them off) had not been well responded to by the local police. The perception of the victims was not helped by being told by the police that a few burglaries was not high on their priority list.

Interestingly, when the police were called a Force they were friendly and accessible; now they call themselves a Service they have become remote and inaccessible.
 
ViroBono said:
Interestingly, when the police were called a Force they were friendly and accessible; now they call themselves a Service they have become remote and inaccessible.

Moral......
 
I always view the policing issues on here (and elsewhere) with interest. They seem to be a good indicator of the way our society is going. My views correspond with the posts by Bladensburg and ViroBono.

It seems to me that the armed forces and the police should share some common bond, but we don't. A friend of mine (a SNCO) was arrested and filled in in the cells, along with comments like "think you're hard, soldier" and "you're a disgrace to the British Army".

In previous postings I worked very closely with the police. I often despaired of the attitudes of some officers. I appreciate that the nature of their job brings them into contact with some of the worst members of society and this must strain their view of human nature, but some seemed to think that the public as a whole were the enemy and that their powers as a constable were just 'power'.

Perhaps the best illiustration is the tendency of the police to term the public (including me with 17 years in the army) 'civilians'. I prefer the police to be called a 'force' but to remember they are public servants.
 

doctordeath

Old-Salt
I remember being burgled in the early 90's while I was in Ripon, the things that were taken were very recognisable as we had photo's of the jewellrey and it was all 21kt brought back from Saudi. I was told by the SOCO what ever that is? I should go to Redcar race course at the weekend the chances are it would be my stuff will be on a stall there. I was astounded!!!! and told you'll be fine your insured aren't you. The fact was, I was insured but that didn't stop my wife telling me that she would not set foot in the house again as she felt violated and I had to pleed for another MQ!!! As a victim I can honestly say they don't give a crap!!!! And I'm sure if I had gone and found my stuff and kicked the crap out of the git who knicked it I'd have been locked up very quickly!!!!!! :evil:
 
when I got attacked by a drunk at the hostel where I worked it took the coppers about 6 hours to do the paperwork. drunk was out on the streets again before all the paper work was done. took approx 18 months to come to court 3 days in court before it was settled some form of probation and £50 quid compensation order in 2 years think I've had £15. Bloke is still a punchy drunk been in trouble with the law repeatidly .
to be honest I'd lost interest in the case by midnight but went on with it as the police wanted to charge him. How anyone could keep at a job where to deal with one minor jerk takes most of a shift .
bring on judge dredd !
 
Takes a deep breath...

I've got some stories about Cambirdgehsire police.

Once I had couple of kids on site throwing things at my head, I called the cops and the dispatcher (possibly at huntingdon?) pretty much said "so what do you want us to do about it?"

However this one takes the biscit: A couple of years ago there was a bomb scare on Kings hedges road, I was working at Cambridge Regional College as a security guard. One policeman approached me and asked me to help out on a roadblock as they didn't have enougth manpower to prevent member's of the public from getting near the suspected package. they did their best but they just didn't have the number's. The guy on the roadblock with me said that we might have to evacuate as the bomb was about 60 yards away.

All the time he was on his mobile chassing up other stuff for other case's.
 
Listy said:
I was working at Cambridge Regional College as a security guard. One policeman approached me and asked me to help out on a roadblock

And i find security guards are usually happy to help....

Listy said:
didn't have enougth manpower to prevent member's of the public from getting near the suspected package. they did their best but they just didn't have the number's.

Home office.... but at least there will be plenty of Community Saftey Officers soon.

Listy said:
The guy on the roadblock with me said that we might have to evacuate as the bomb was about 60 yards away..

Probably sensible

Listy said:
All the time he was on his mobile chassing up other stuff for other case's.

That'll be because of the manpower thing again and his handling of far too many cases than he should have to
 
In my neck of the woods...

From BBC Website
Police move to ignore minor crime

Vandalism would no longer be a matter for police, under new plans
Police should stop responding to small-scale call-outs such as arguments between neighbours and minor car accidents, senior officers have said.
The Association of Chief Police Officers (Acpos) argued the move would cut bureaucracy.

A police report has focussed on problems such as vandalism, parking disputes and fires in which nobody is injured.

The study says police time is not being used effectively.

It stresses that dealing with minor problems is a drain on resources.

Instead, top police officers want specially-trained community support officers to deal with low-level incidents.

They say this would reduce paperwork, free up police time, and allow them to put more bobbies on the beat.

Spokesman David Mellor said: "We want to ensure we deploy police resources intelligently so we can do things the public feel are most important to them, such as seeing more police officers in uniform on patrol."

The Scottish Executive said it supported any moves to slash red tape and make police more visible in communities.

A spokesman said: "We are in regular contact with Acpos on a range of matters, and are working with them to keep police bureaucracy to a minimum.

"Policy on deployment of police officers is of course a matter for chief constables."

But senior Scottish National Party figures are concerned incidents may escalate if police officers are not present to deal with them.

Holyrood group leader Nicola Sturgeon said: "This also raises questions about the level of responsibility that will be given to community wardens to cope with the added workload.

"We all know that the police are overstretched already and the executive should start addressing the real issue of getting more bobbies on the beat."

Conservatives insist a zero tolerance crackdown is the only effective way of dealing with crime.

Spokeswoman Annabel Goldie said: "This has proved to be tremendously successful in New York where every crime is prosecuted and the result has been a sharp decline in the crime rates.

"Obviously we need police in our communities to carry this through so we need a bit more ambition from this lacklustre Labour-Lib Dem executive."

So if I see Wayne spray painting his tag on my fence, or if he throws a bottle at my window in a drunken haze, then the cops will do nothing. The solution would therefore appear to be the "eye for an eye" approach. If Wayne messes with me or my property then I will mess with him and his in the full knowledge that I act with immunity from police interference! Wayne will therefore find the windows of his Chavmobile sitting in pieces on his burberry upholstery, along with his large bore exhaust! :twisted:
 
And no doubt that because it's not reported as an offense that warrants investigation it won't go into the crime statistics so we appear to be living in an increasingly 'safer' Britain (not that I'm a cynic really!).
 

Seadog

ADC
The manipulation of society’s fabric is very obvious and to the benefit of the Princelings of Neu Arbeit. Manipulating the police is part of that strategy. I’d not be surprised if NA are here to stay. Enabling Act to follow after winning a fourth term????

I like a major session the same as the next matelot but HMG wants to introduce more disorder and unpleasantness so it can claim to protect us from it, while neutering the police and not offending those responsible for the mayhem ( many Labour voters). So long as Islington is well policed.
An article in today’s Telegraph identifies and articulates Neu Arbeit’s strategy well.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/...xml&sSheet=/opinion/2005/01/04/ixopinion.html

Of course, the Government claims to believe that, by allowing drinking establishments to open 24 hours a day, it will reduce public drunkenness. If it really believes this, it is a terrible indictment of the British nation: that it can allow itself to be led by such a collection of hopeless fools. As to the suggestion that we might develop here the kind of civilised Mediterranean café culture if only drinking outlets were open long enough, you might as well preach the comforts of the igloo and the tastiness of whale blubber to the Masai of Kenya.

More likely, of course, the Government is hoping to raise revenue, which it will spend, at least partly, on the vast apparatus of ''social care'' that the mass misbehaviour of the British population makes necessary. This is the politics of clientelism: those who misbehave will vote for you because they have grown fond of the licentiousness that you have allowed them, as will those whose livelihood depends on the mass misbehaviour whose effects they are supposed to ameliorate.

In France, there are notices in many places specifying the provisions of the Law for the Repression of Public Drunkenness. What is reassuring about this is not that the repression is heavy-handed - the problem is far less serious in France than in Britain - but that there is an awareness that repression is necessary, desirable and publicly acceptable.

This is no longer so in Britain: the young people I have described are no longer even aware that they are doing anything wrong. Just as the Government is so corrupt that it does not know that it is corrupt, so these young people are so lacking in self-respect that they do not know that self-respect is desirable.

By its changes to licensing laws, and the proposed further changes, successive governments have endorsed this psychological switch: for there is nothing bad and power-seeking governments fear more that a virtuous and self-controlled population. Therefore, let them drink alco-pops. Then they will be dependent upon us.

Radical and credible opposition to Neu Arbeit is urgently required.
 
I know the home office has been stiffing the police forces for manpower, belive me I wasn't aiming any bad coments at the police men, I'm sorry if it came out like that.

manchestercop said:
And i find security guards are usually happy to help....

Yup, it passes some very boring shifts. Gets me outside, perfect. At that site it was a 16 hour duty.


manchestercop said:
Home office.... but at least there will be plenty of Community Saftey Officers soon.

Heh, I've heard and seen varying things about them. To me it seems they're just Security Guards on the street but without the legal powers that I get from protecting private property. That would make I belive, the CSO's useless as they can't do anything apart from call the cops.

Of course if there's a CSO or someone who knows more about them out there who can correct me....
 

Firehorse

Old-Salt
Seadog said:
The manipulation of society’s fabric is very obvious and to the benefit of the Princelings of Neu Arbeit. Manipulating the police is part of that strategy. I’d not be surprised if NA are here to stay. Enabling Act to follow after winning a fourth term????

I rather thought the Civil Contingencies Act suffices as an enabling act. It just hasn't been invoked yet.
 
I know several coppers (mostly quite senior) in a very differant area to the one in which I live. The senior coppers (DAC and two Insp) are as every bit as frustrated as the rest of us.

In my area I have had several dealings with the local boys and they are all very p@ssed off with what they term management.

Look at the list of Chief Constables and their eduacation, and then wonder why.

The management is far too concerned with watching its back against the Home Office and the troops on the ground are busy watching themselves against management.

Oh and anyone that uses the word Police Service should instantly be sacked and told to work for a pension.
 
I think MrPVR's article sums it up really:

"We can't be bothered to deal with the dull mundane stuff." and then they trot out the old "more Bobbies on the beat" chestnut.

However I would say that what those "bobbies on the beat" (read sat in a layby in car) should be doing is making vandalising little scrotes lives as miserable as they make everyone elses, going to RTAs and checking everyones MOT, licence and insurance (the lack of which causes untold misery for those hit by chavs in crappy Novas) etc. That is what I would call being "Visible in the community" otherwise what's the point?
 
doctordeath said:
I remember being burgled in the early 90's while I was in Ripon, the things that were taken were very recognisable as we had photo's of the jewellrey and it was all 21kt brought back from Saudi. I was told by the SOCO what ever that is? I should go to Redcar race course at the weekend the chances are it would be my stuff will be on a stall there. I was astounded!!!! and told you'll be fine your insured aren't you. The fact was, I was insured but that didn't stop my wife telling me that she would not set foot in the house again as she felt violated and I had to pleed for another MQ!!! As a victim I can honestly say they don't give a crap!!!! And I'm sure if I had gone and found my stuff and kicked the crap out of the git who knicked it I'd have been locked up very quickly!!!!!! :evil:

I was burgled in 2002, returned from a holday to find house contents gone including the car. When plod turned up he gave me the same line about being insured.

Two days later I went into Cash Convertors in my town to carry out a "recce". How suprised was I to see my power tools, video camera etc on sale to joe public! Not as suprised as the store manager after I had abused his parentage, penis size and masculinity. The police were called, I was warned off, my belongings were left where they were and my insurance company paid up.

My point is this, why did I have to go out and check the most obvious place in the area for stolen goods? I'm sure I pay my council tax for a reason.

Oh, and if anybody thinks it may be slander by mentioning CASH CONVERTORS and SELLS STOLEN GOODS in the same sentance then fcuk off and prove otherwise.

Ranting maybe but I still get pleasure imagining what I could do to the tw*t who robbed me blind and gave the wife nightmares for weeks.
 
The_Sloping_Wire said:
chocolate_frog said:
Subject of Star Ship Troopers, I recall you had to serve in the Forces if you wanted citizenship. What a good idea, maybe not forces, but people should serve the society before getting the all priviledges, like free NHS and, of course, Legal Aid.

Good drills all round.

Service = Citizenship

PS Service of all kinds: HMF, Police, NHS...even the FBU! (Pause for the inevitable slagging!) :D

PPS And being an MP doesn't count. In their case, I believe all their property should be handed over to the state. In this way, if they failed to maintain a buoyant economy, they get hit where it hurts - in their pockets. I wonder how many grossfully wasteful procurement projects or Millennium Domes would be built if the MPs had an actual monetary stake in their own governance? :twisted:

No slagging from me SLW; I've been quoting Heinlein's 'Starship Troopers' as a model on several posts for some time now, mostly in connection with voting; ie, 'Service earns the right to vote because what comes free is never valued!'
When 'Starship Troopers' came out in the middle sixties it got slagged off by the 'social theorists' as a fascist fantasy. The leftist director of the movie continued the slur with a gung-ho special-effects extravaganza complete with rebadged Nazi dress uniforms.. Crap film but an excellent book. If you haven't read it, get a copy because it has a lot to say about our present condition and the causes.

What can we do about the sh*t we're in? I'm not sure. Maybe the rot has gone too far but I'd rather not think about the consequences of that too deeply... But, then again... :(
 

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