Britain pulls the plug on Zambia

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
#23
#24
Working there a few years ago, the govt and assorted officials prided themselves on their claim of being incorruptible. As it turns out, all that means in African terms is that the price is higher.

Meanwhile, forlorn hope in SA occasionally surfaces under the onslaught of corruption...

By Alec Hogg

It’s known in legal circles that Judge Moroa Tsoka is one of the fittest to ever join the bench, having completed 11 Comrades and 12 Two Oceans ultramarathons. Less documented is how this galloping adjudicator reads books that some leftward leaning peers would prefer had never been written.

Independently-minded Mr Justice Tsoka was entrusted with one of the more controversial recent commercial cases. He didn’t hold back in a scathing judgement for VBS Mutual Bank against its former CEO Andile Ramavhunga, his wife Zanele and the CEO of Vele Investments Robert Madzonga.

The bald-faced theft by these fraudsters moved the judge to quote a passage from Atlas Shrugged, a masterful novel by free-market icon Ayn Rand: “….when you see that men get rich more easily by graft than by work, and your laws no longer protect you against them but protect them against you…..you may know that your society is doomed.”

Judge Tsoka did his bit to rebuff that ghastly prospect by ordering the sequestrations of these high flying fraudsters, which VBS reckons stole an astonishing R1.5bn. First, we hear a judge quoting Ayn Rand. Then the Springboks beat the All Blacks in New Zealand. Maybe the tide really has started to turn for SA.
 
#25
One thing to remember is that the difference between 3rd and 1st world political corruption is that the 1st world has a system in place to make the corruption legal.
I'm a fan of aid as I've seen how it can impact on the fight against terrorism first hand. But I do believe in safeguards need to be in place - look at the road from Nairobi to Nanyuki for example.
 
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#26

Cutaway

LE
Kit Reviewer
#28
#29
I doubt it, or it's completely 180-degree out thinking by the FCO. All this will do is drive Zambia further into China's clutches, with their 'aid and investment without moral conditions; just sell us your country's primary production capability'. I was in Zambia in 2004 and there was already a very prominent Chinese presence then. I didn't think much of the pollies I met, but their military were a decent bunch and their para-military engineering capability quite impressive. Flying in a Chinese-built, African-maintained aircraft had a bit of a pucker factor to it though!

My bold.. The Chinese being a very pragmatic people have been in Zambia since they built the Tan-Zam railway. Initially they sent engineers & skilled workers but after a while of watching the pathetic way the locals worked sent thousands more, the African was only left to do the most menial of tasks. Furthermore they also sent out farmers to grow food for the ever increasing number of Chinese who own & work there in almost every mining & industrial concern there.
While there may be the odd African placeman at the top, normally someone with political connections, they do little or nothing except take a fat salary whilst the Chinese do the actual work.
The Chinese farmers are now causing concerns amongst the Africans as they are producing & selling food on the local markets and undercutting the local growers because as most know the Chinese work harder & have a better business brain.
From what a friend who has been to Malawi a few times in the last couple of years, its the same there.
 
#30
Not quite, wrote Mumbai instead of Nairobi,

Funding has been given 4 times to pave the road along its whole length. In an attempt to support local businesses, each time a local company was given the contract. Despite there being enough money to complete the whole road each time, only a section of about 10 miles was paved. This section being at the home towns of the contractors. After the section was complete each contractor then stated that they needed more money! So enough money for 480 miles used to pave 40 miles!
 
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#33
My bold.. The Chinese being a very pragmatic people have been in Zambia since they built the Tan-Zam railway. Initially they sent engineers & skilled workers but after a while of watching the pathetic way the locals worked sent thousands more, the African was only left to do the most menial of tasks. Furthermore they also sent out farmers to grow food for the ever increasing number of Chinese who own & work there in almost every mining & industrial concern there.
While there may be the odd African placeman at the top, normally someone with political connections, they do little or nothing except take a fat salary whilst the Chinese do the actual work.
The Chinese farmers are now causing concerns amongst the Africans as they are producing & selling food on the local markets and undercutting the local growers because as most know the Chinese work harder & have a better business brain.
From what a friend who has been to Malawi a few times in the last couple of years, its the same there.

That's about right. Oil camp in these parts needed fresh veg so spoke to local folks about growing it for them. Seeds and tools supplied free of charge and market prices paid for the veg by the camp cooks. No interest from the villagers in doing it so they brought in a couple of farmers from China and set up their own veg producing operation which now supplies the camp and then some.

Meanwhile, the farm area is now regularly broken into and veg and tools are stolen. The whole mindset is completely alien to western culture or one with any kind of work ethic.
 
#34
Must not forget the Indians, some of the mines that I visited in Zambia not so long ago are owned by Sub- continentals. Unfortunately, they have an aversion to maintenance costs.
 
#35
One wonders what the Chinese's long-term goal is in Africa. I doubt it's just about trade or diplomacy. After all, it was one of their guys who re-wrote Clausewitz to state that "all diplomacy is the continuation of war by other means".
 
#36
It's just business with the Chinese. Unlike the philanthropic west, there's no ambition to spread their philosophy or improve the lives of anyone except themselves. They'll bring in their own people to do pretty much everything if they can as they find local labour to be unreliable. That's why locals end up with the menial tasks unless there's pressure on them from govt to promote nationals.

I've seen them import containers of empty bags to store cement because they can't be arsed dealing with fuckwitted local suppliers. At the end of the day, the only people they suck up to are those in govt they own in order to facilitate their business dealings. Even schools and roads are built with self serving motives - name a road after the Pres and you have a hook you can use. Build a school where you can train folks to work for you later and come across as the good guys while taking care of future employees.

Sharp buggers on the whole but sometimes you do wonder...
 
#37
Must not forget the Indians, some of the mines that I visited in Zambia not so long ago are owned by Sub- continentals. Unfortunately, they have an aversion to maintenance costs.
That's because god takes care of stuff. If it's your time to f-off from this planet, it's your time then, no maintenance can prevent it. Good ol Karma in play here.
 
#38
That's because god takes care of stuff. If it's your time to f-off from this planet, it's your time then, no maintenance can prevent it. Good ol Karma in play here.
What often happens in Safferland is that a 'friend' of somebody in a govt department is given a maintenance contract, worth millions, and then proceeds to do bugger all maintenance.
Recent case in point in Johannesburg: Multi-storey building catches fire. Three firefighters die in blaze.
Later it emerges:
Power points were overloaded and often got hot, start sparking
Aircons not working, so fire doors were propped open to get airflow into offices
Water pressure to top floors inadequate/non-existent
All this had been reported, nothing had been done.
Happens a lot with water processing plants, power stations, roads, bridges etc etc etc.
 

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