Brexit - The Final

sumo2

Old-Salt
Don't forget Dear Oliver Letwin and his minor amendment, or Dominic Grieve and his noble stand against the machinations of the hated ERG and Boris 'he will never get a deal' Johnson.... The media also keep referring to Parliament versus Boris, when in point of fact almost half of parliament supported him. The media are overplaying their remainer hand big style and Nicky Morgan should be looking to save her comments about ditching the licence fee for a future bill.
are you referring to the not bitter and twisted sacked conservatives, whom appear to be not running in the next election, was that before or after they were sacked?
 

Tool

LE
This thread moves along at a rapid pace, take your eye off the ball and a dozen pages will go by. Now if this has already been posted I apologise but it has become clear that the standards of ARRSErs are falling because, whatever side of the debate you are on, one of the most important things to discuss has been neglected. That is, who is that little blonde clerk in the HoC? May I, in the absence of any evidence to persuade me otherwise, be the first to say 'I would'.
On topic(ish) - there's also a rather pleasant-looking blonde in the EU, whose job appears to be meet-and-greet and general "you go there" type stuff. She's always in the background when Bojo is in Brussels and is filmed going into one of the buildings.

And back to the slating/praising/damning politicians on all sides of the divide.
 

Auld-Yin

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Shit sticks, even a new face in the chair cannot change the dynamics at this point. They have dug their own grave.
Labour are in too bad a state to elect a new leader. They have more factions now than ever. There are anti brexit MPs who want to completely overturn Art 50, then there are those that want to respect the referendum and leave the EU, and am8g that are the 'herd' who follow the loudest shouter.

Once that has been sorted they then have Momentum supporters, anti Momentum MPs, extremely anti Momentum MPs.

Once that is sorted there is the small mater of the Unions who sponsor many MPs but are rapidly being sidelined by Momentum.

And those are the factions that we publicly know about.

On top of all this there are the really thick Labour MPs who think, totally incorrectly, that they are quite intelligent like Abbott, Lanny, Phillips and who are perfectly capable of f*cking up ant Labour internal politics and not even realise the damage they are doing.

And there are people who think this Party could run the country!
 
Seconds after the defeat last night, the labour back benches were making digging actions at the tories and the SNP were acting as if the tories are in cahoots with fascists. At the weekend, outside of Parliament, lots of people were giving the MPs high fives...…They are simply way too busy enjoying the giddy heights of pushing around governments, winding up the tories and getting so much attention, to even care how it looks further afield and what its doing to our economy.

From my seat and talking to other people of different political persuasions. I am actually shocked at the levels of disgust directed at parliament.. Its unsure to me, how that will pan out over the next month or so, how many of those will abstain, or switch to Boris as the only candidate actually trying to move this stalemate forward will be very interesting.

No GE and a third referendum, will not go down at all well with the public. In a sense, another referendum after the GE might fly, but before I fear for our democracy.
I dont believe we have a democracy. Lisbon and Blair finished it.
 

Brotherton Lad

LE
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Boris has no option but to pull the deal last night.

Dominic Grieves Legion D’Honnouer intended to tack on a referendum ammendment that would have effectively killed off Brexit.
He didn't pull it. He paused it.
 

Auld-Yin

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are you referring to the not bitter and twisted sacked conservatives, whom appear to be not running in the next election, was that before or after they were sacked?
To be absolutely fair most of the top rebels like Letwin, Grieve, Clarke had said they were standing down - their actions would probably been a lot different had they not declared that! The others are the ones who will struggle, Gauke, Stewart, Hammond, Gregg Clark who will want to be allowed back as Tories or they are out.

Fatty Soames has been very very quiet since his bit of drunken bravado and I expect he is spending a lot of time with his local constituency committee to try and save his political neck. If Tory HQ declare the rebels are out, end of, then he is toast, and there are so many bottles of wine still to be drunk in the Palace that he won't be able to get his greasy paws in.
 
Clarke on breakfast BBC being allowed to speak bolox without challenge! He was saying all they were asking is for a few days to scrutinise the Bill. It is passed the second reading and just needs tim Be to look at it, then he casually dropped in getting rid of the NI border down the Irish Sea; so he is not looking at just scrutinising the Bill and tidying it up, he is looking at completely rewriting the agreed deal. He was trying to make Remain Lok docile and doing what they are for the good of the agreement. Lying barsteward!

What a fecking snake but what a useless waste of space the BBC reporter or rather presenter as no way is he a journalist.

ETA, Dan Walker - couldn't remember his name!
The point is the demarcation line down the Irish sea can't be enforced, moreover there is little point. What Frontex Launch is going to pop up, stop a ferry mid passage in British territorial waters? Opps sorry never saw it. It doesn't need to be ammended, it's totally impractical. How are Frontex staff going to ensure that NI goods only are going to remain in NI? If Irish Customs enter and set up borders the PIRA will shoot at them as a matter of principal. He's not a lying B, here merely highlights the stupidity of people like him who know little of practicalities. Legally enforceable is one thing, doing it is quite another. If the DUP can't see that they deserve each other. And then there's still the little matter of Veradker signing the MOU re the CTA. A border for goods but not people-it's totally Irish.
 
He will do so next time the Bill returns, and will get a lot of support from the 'I respect the EU referendum result' Labour MPs like Starmer and Thornberry whose task is to delay, confuse, alter but most importantly overturn Art 50 and the EU result. They are lying scum.
Not sure about the Legion d'Honneur actually. The last thing that France wants is UK repealing Article 50 just as the Eurozone goes into recession. In any recession, the aims of France and the Olive Belt are likely to diverge sharply from those of Germany and the North - this could well leave UK in our traditional (and long sought) position of the Kingmaker. Without us, France has a better chance of winning through.

That said, I'm assuming (probably unwisely) that following any repeal of Article 50 the Government would continue to act in Britains interest. Takes me back to my central, unanswered question - to what extent does the Remain lobby in Parliament consist of ardent Federalists and how much power would they wield in that Government? I suppose that one upside of the current shenanigans is that this is going to be progressively exposed. With each obstacle Boris crosses, a smaller, harder core of remainers will withdraw to the next one, exposing their real agenda as they do so.

My bet is still that we will leave with a deal endorsed by Parliament, although that depends on how many opposing the timetable last night genuinely want time to scrutinise it, as opposed to more nefarious aims...
 

Auld-Yin

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He didn't pull it. He paused it.
I would not be surprised, in the least, if the traitor Remainers try to get the Bill resubmitted for second reading. This corrupt Speaker would probably allow it.

It was good watching Bercow get abused from the back benches on both sides of the House, being told he is under investigation by a parliamentary committee and being held in contempt by many MPs. He was obviously ready for the attack he knew was coming as he knows he had been biased but he did look taken aback and definitely not chuffed. He had facts and dates to hand so the detailed preparation was obvious. The man is a sh!t.
 

Auld-Yin

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Not sure about the Legion d'Honneur actually. The last thing that France wants is UK repealing Article 50 just as the Eurozone goes into recession. In any recession, the aims of France and the Olive Belt are likely to diverge sharply from those of Germany and the North - this could well leave UK in our traditional (and long sought) position of the Kingmaker. Without us, France has a better chance of winning through.

That said, I'm assuming (probably unwisely) that following any repeal of Article 50 the Government would continue to act in Britains interest. Takes me back to my central, unanswered question - to what extent does the Remain lobby in Parliament consist of ardent Federalists and how much power would they wield in that Government? I suppose that one upside of the current shenanigans is that this is going to be progressively exposed. With each obstacle Boris crosses, a smaller, harder core of remainers will withdraw to the next one, exposing their real agenda as they do so.

My bet is still that we will leave with a deal endorsed by Parliament, although that depends on how many opposing the timetable last night genuinely want time to scrutinise it, as opposed to more nefarious aims...
Re your last paragraph. Ken Clarke this morning said it. They just want the chance to scrutinise the Bill, then casually dropped in, mid sentence, that they would be looking to get rid of the border down the Irish Sea, which would kill and mean renegotiate the deal! All done with a sly smile on his face. Lying Scum!
 
Does anyone want to join me on the Hokey Cokey Party.
We will have 1 leg in & 1 leg out on Brexit.
 

Blogg

LE
Johnson has requested a deal. It’s out of his hands now. It’s already been stated they will grant the extension.
Tusk has stated he will recommend an extension. He has no power to grant one.

Macron is pushing for a "technical extension" of a few days.

There is little appetite for months of delay
 

Auld-Yin

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Tusk has stated he will recommend an extension. He has no power to grant one.

Macron is pushing for a "technical extension" of a few days.

There is little appetite for months of delay
The EU will give any extension, at any time and for any length of time. The whole period we are in this quagmire the country's trading stance is weakened so their main competitor is kept at bay.

Remember, regardless how many times they are referred to as such, the EU are NOT our friends!
 
Indeed. But as Greive stated earlier he was aiming for an amendment to ensure a second referendum.

It pains me to say it but currently the EU are playing with a straighter bat than the chimp collective in westminster.

During the lengthy Grieve interview many groups were mentioned, but at no point did he mention the voting public.
Which is why I think that Boris will take the three month 'flextension' supposedly on offer and go for a GE on the grounds that he is trying his level best to get Brexit done but is being stymied at every turn by Parliament. He will also make much of the fact that he has fully complied with the terms of the Benn Act and is now expecting the opposition to do the same and support a GE. Corbyn is in a bit of a pickle here.
 
Re your last paragraph. Ken Clarke this morning said it. They just want the chance to scrutinise the Bill, then casually dropped in, mid sentence, that they would be looking to get rid of the border down the Irish Sea, which would kill and mean renegotiate the deal! All done with a sly smile on his face. Lying Scum!
It has always been my view that Clarke is an ardent Federalist, who would be happy to see Britain subsumed as a rule-taker in a Federal Europe. To Brussels, that makes him a useful idiot....
 
I would not be surprised, in the least, if the traitor Remainers try to get the Bill resubmitted for second reading. This corrupt Speaker would probably allow it.

It was good watching Bercow get abused from the back benches on both sides of the House, being told he is under investigation by a parliamentary committee and being held in contempt by many MPs. He was obviously ready for the attack he knew was coming as he knows he had been biased but he did look taken aback and definitely not chuffed. He had facts and dates to hand so the detailed preparation was obvious. The man is a sh!t.
A yet the whole proceedure/exchange was conducted with a veneer of remarkable politeness and civility!!
 

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