Brexit - The Final

Oh push off with that reasonable attitude. Your kind make me puke.

You have a higher view of the public than I do. Besides, any pragmatists have to be funneled into a party system and post-Brexwhatever the motivated are going to come out in an orgy of self-righteous activism.

The quiet pragmatists are going to be busy making things work, whilst the motivated chase whatever shiny object supports their cause leaving others to tidy up their mess.

The lesson of our current politics is that they prefer to campaign rather than administer - all of them.
Ain't that the truth.

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Yep. And everyone in the CS got that memo.

I read the Yellowhammer leak in the Times in the pub and thought 'Oh how sad. They are OTE and don't know it.'
What does OTE mean?

ETA: are you saying that last evenings revelations were a leak and not the official HMG release? That would explain why there were no Best Case and Middle Case scenarios published; not hysterical enough.

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What does OTE mean?

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"Over the Edge"?

As opposed to OTS (Over the side) which is a totally different sort of self-inflicted crisis.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
We’ve all done operational tour. Although I don’t see how that should change your view of the EU. Brian Guy for instance (RIP) was pro-EU and said as much here before the referendum. With great foresight apparently because some of the stuff he said would caused by leaving appears to be in Yellowhammer.
It doesn't change one's view of the EU, it simply gives the lie to your strange idea that Brexiteers are motivated by a love of World War Two and a desire to have things as tough as their parents did - a view you expressed in the post and the view that I responded to.
 
It doesn't change one's view of the EU, it simply gives the lie to your strange idea that Brexiteers are motivated by a love of World War Two and a desire to have things as tough as their parents did - a view you expressed in the post and the view that I responded to.
It is more seeing the whole process as a purifying fire that concerns me.

Liable to get out of control, I suggest.
 
Oh push off with that reasonable attitude. Your kind make me puke.

You have a higher view of the public than I do. Besides, any pragmatists have to be funneled into a party system and post-Brexwhatever the motivated are going to come out in an orgy of self-righteous activism.

The quiet pragmatists are going to be busy making things work, whilst the motivated chase whatever shiny object supports their cause leaving others to tidy up their mess.

The lesson of our current politics is that they prefer to campaign rather than administer - all of them.
Much truth in what you say, though I would add a view, that the trouble with pragmatists is they tend to be sluggish and act within the confines of what they know.... Our relationship with Europe is organised by your pragmatists, and alternates between an accumulation of little steps, without proper democratic assent. With occasionally an ideologue like Heseltine or Blair who drove the thing forward, then handed the problems back to your pragmatists.
 
A sobering article here, for those who are pro-Leave, from a contributor to Conservative Home website:

It isn't Leave that have created this mess.

Please bear in mind, he's firmly in the Remain camp.
 
Well, hang on, I share Mr Benns scepticism, especially in the face of Mr Gove’s attempts to be economical with the truth. Did you catch this exchange at the select committee last week?

View attachment 416499
View attachment 416500

So frankly, I wouldn’t trust Gove as far as I could throw him, and lest you think this is a Brexit bias, distrust is actually my normal approach to anything he says. :grin:

And actually, when it’s public knowledge that every Dept has contributed to the Op YELLOWHAMMER planning, of course five pages isn’t all. As you like logistics, here’s an extract from the DfT one:

View attachment 416501

He knows more exists. Everyone knows more exists. The Government should publish it or face a second contempt of Parliament motion, because nothing quite says “we’re trying to bluff you” like the forced publication of five pages of text with a hastily scrawled note that says “but we’ve totally fixed it honest guv!”
And all if which eats into the calendar.

Anyone for Penn and Teller?
 
A compliant press, judiciary and cowed parliament? GTF. HTH.
Rubbish, a judiciary separated from politics is desirable, less fake news and spinning is desirable and a rump parliament blocking a general election in it's own interests is corrupt, cynical and cowardly.... not cowed.
Edited to add: A compliant electorate is much, much more dangerous....so long live the revolting peasantry who are too stupid to know what is good for them.
 
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It isn't Leave that have created this mess.

Please bear in mind, he's firmly in the Remain camp.
His headline isn't a million miles out, but I think that Boris is aiming to improve slightly on May's deal and I suspect that the EU in not against this in principle, despite what they say, largely because they want BREXIT done.

Where Remain is prolonging the mess is in encouraging the EU to think that they will somehow engineer continued membership, causing further foot dragging in Brussels.

Except that I think Brussels patience is finally running out....
 

MrBane

LE
Moderator
Kit Reviewer
Reviews Editor
Was talking about this last night. I've long since lost all interest in this, however I was always of the opinion that with no deal, the PM was simply playing a game of chicken to see who'd swerve first.

Unfortunately, the passengers in the Sunshine Club bus we're driving keep using their mong strength to break free from their restraints and try to grab the wheel.
 
It isn't Leave that have created this mess.

Please bear in mind, he's firmly in the Remain camp.
It is very irritating that Brexit is blamed on the people who voted against our membership and I think to separate the moral and political, is childish evasion of responsibility by the establishment who supported remain.

If you note, remain is fixed on an idea that everybody who voted out did so out of bitterness or migration. Some probably did, but most made a political choice that merely reflects a wider disconnect felt wildly across the western world.
 
A telling statement that, clearly shows the democratic deficit endemic within the EU from Claire Fox
The same can be said of the selection of MP's in many cases, particularly Labour these days. I don't think the Tories or even the LibDims would have let "this" through the process....
omara.png
Jared O'Mara.
 

bill121koln

Old-Salt
Making up issues? I'm just reporting the issues qualified medial doctors have said. I'm sure they'll be pleased to know some random bloke on a small corner of the web has said its a non-issue, he knows better than people who are world experts in this kind of thing, and actually it's all very simple - we just put it on the flower planes instead.

BTW - flight requires we must train personal to deal with it and the infrastructure to deal with it.


And erm, who said they will refuse to sell it to us? It seems like you haven't really grasped the problem before offering your solution.
Actually, these "qualified medical doctors" and "world experts" are only experts in the practical uses of the element not the logistics of getting it to and from the required destination which is left to transport managers.
Since reading your post yesterday I visited and chatted with our "qualified medical doctors and world experts" at the nuclear medicine/ research departments at my place of employ, they expressed no concerns about any delays in the delivery of these elements or any other medical radionuclides used in the event of a no-deal (WTO) Brexit.
 
Actually, these "qualified medical doctors" and "world experts" are only experts in the practical uses of the element not the logistics of getting it to and from the required destination which is left to transport managers.
Since reading your post yesterday I visited and chatted with our "qualified medical doctors and world experts" at the nuclear medicine/ research departments at my place of employ, they expressed no concerns about any delays in the delivery of these elements or any other medical radionuclides used in the event of a no-deal (WTO) Brexit.
It’s known as third party reinforcement.

Get somebody people trust to tell them your message. Use carol Vorderman to sell you dubious equity release products. Likewise, use a doctor to push your anti democratic agenda.

They’re called useful idiots.

Blair’s done quite well with Sorros funded remain campaign. He knows he’ll struggle to be the face man
 
Actually, these "qualified medical doctors" and "world experts" are only experts in the practical uses of the element not the logistics of getting it to and from the required destination which is left to transport managers.
Since reading your post yesterday I visited and chatted with our "qualified medical doctors and world experts" at the nuclear medicine/ research departments at my place of employ, they expressed no concerns about any delays in the delivery of these elements or any other medical radionuclides used in the event of a no-deal (WTO) Brexit.
What, not even the ones with a shelf-life of 6 hours?
 
Actually, these "qualified medical doctors" and "world experts" are only experts in the practical uses of the element not the logistics of getting it to and from the required destination which is left to transport managers.
Since reading your post yesterday I visited and chatted with our "qualified medical doctors and world experts" at the nuclear medicine/ research departments at my place of employ, they expressed no concerns about any delays in the delivery of these elements or any other medical radionuclides used in the event of a no-deal (WTO) Brexit.

Why don’t they publish their opinion? If they are research active, then they should speak up. Some would say they have a duty to do so even.
 
Then might I refer you to @dogmeat post 54803.

ETA I’ve now seen your response to dogmeat. TBP replacing labour I can live with. Whilst I take your point re the rest, I firmly believe it will be labour that are the party that get squeezed by the Limp Dems & TBP, as long as PMBJ delivers Brexit the Tories will remain the biggest party.

As I’ve said before cutting you loose would allow the rest of us some piece & quiet & turn us into a very stable centre right democracy.
We then just have to return the Scousers back to Ireland. And good riddence to them too!
 
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