Brexit Phase Two - Trade

Auld-Yin

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It's the increasing noise of people's jobs and pensions going over the approaching waterfall.
Which is why the EU elite are pushing hard brexit. They don't have to bother about little irritations like being elected so are a bit detached from the pain of job losses, and basically don't care just as long as their Pogram carries sailing on.
 
Changed yer tune girly.
Healthy living, read the bible, think pure thoughts. it's easy. You've got no chance. Oh, what about happiness? Eh?
It seemed futile wishing you such a thing. But happy pun day to you
 
I think your spidey-senses need a recalibration. The EU (Commission) are working their socks off to get a hard brexit.
Not sure how you figure that. Is it the "how dare the EU not give us what we demand!" school of blame, or the "those cunning b**tards are running a massive media disinformation campaign to let swivel-eyed morons convince the merely ignorant that a no-deal Brexit won't really be a problem" school of blame?
 

Auld-Yin

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Not sure how you figure that. Is it the "how dare the EU not give us what we demand!" school of blame, or the "those cunning b**tards are running a massive media disinformation campaign to let swivel-eyed morons convince the merely ignorant that a no-deal Brexit won't really be a problem" school of blame?
No!
 
Which is why the EU elite are pushing hard brexit. They don't have to bother about little irritations like being elected so are a bit detached from the pain of job losses, and basically don't care just as long as their Pogram carries sailing on.

Is this the evil EU dictatorship causing what you voted for or the shape-shifting ineffectual Eurocrats?
 

Auld-Yin

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So how do you think that those "EU elites" got their jobs, then?

Obviously you can't be talking about those directly-elected MEPs. Or the members of the commission, appointed by directly-elected Governments.
The word appointed says it all.
 
Which is why the EU elite are pushing hard brexit. They don't have to bother about little irritations like being elected so are a bit detached from the pain of job losses, and basically don't care just as long as their Pogram carries sailing on.
But, they are not. They are pushing the WA, and other options. The only ones pushing hard Brexit, is the ERG, and they are fading fast.
 
So how do you think that those "EU elites" got their jobs, then?

Obviously you can't be talking about those directly-elected MEPs. Or the members of the commission, appointed by directly-elected Governments.
Kinnock managed to become a commissioner by turning the Labour Party from anti Europe to pro Europe. TCB decided to be the EU poster boy because he wants to be its President. Power corrupts.

It’s a little bit like medieval times when somebody got rewarded with titles and land for saying what the king wanted to hear and not what he should’ve heard.

You can tell how much the EU don’t give a toss by the lack of critics who get into the gravy train.
 
But, they are not. They are pushing the WA, and other options. The only ones pushing hard Brexit, is the ERG, and they are fading fast.
I suspect elements within the EU would like a hard brexit (the French) whilst others such as the Germans would like us to follow the withdrawal agreement.

Either way it’s been badly handled by both sides compounded by the pond life we have in the commons who have got Blair and Sorros’s hands so far up gheir arses it’s becoming apparent that there’s something fundamentally wrong in the calibre of the politicians currently elected.
 
I sniff a growing sense of acceptance, by the site fantasists, that No Deal Brexit is what it always was, a fantasy. TM in stocking and suspenders is more real.

Is there something in the air?
As frequently pointed out before, the easiest way for the Tories to lose the 2022 election would be to stop Brexit or to agree to a deal that gave the EU control over our tax levels, regulations and tariffs post Brexit.

Stopping Brexit altogether would leave them out of power for a generation. May fought the 2017 GE to 'get a mandate for Brexit' and has been saying 'Brexit means Brexit' ever since. Were Brexit to be stopped, the electorate would lose all faith in the Tories and they'd be out of power for a generation.

Sign up to a deal that gave the EU control over our tax levels, regulations and tariffs post Brexit, the opposition would make hay - repeatedly engineering circumstances where the Tories were forced to admit or look shifty denying bit. In those cases, I suspect the Tories would be out of power for at least 10 years. 10 years when an increasingly hard left Labour government would transform our economy into a good impersonation of Venezuela's.

I don't think the Tory party is into committing electoral suicide.

Labour could combine with the other opposition parties and some Tory dissidents to stop Brexit - the votes are definitely there to do that. The reason they haven't done it is that May will immediately call a GE and the opposition will get shafted as the parties denying the will of the electorate.

The opposition parties are not into committing electoral suicide either.

What you are seeing is a game of "pass the blame parcel". May invites Corbyn to talks to discuss Corbyn's proposals, Corbyn will say May's not accepting his proposals and so on. This particular game will go on until March 29th as all the parties try to saddle the other with a portion of the blame .

The practical problem the opposition face is Brexit turning out successful/popular after a few months of hiccups. The Tories would be a shoe in for 2022 and all the opposition attempts to stop Brexit would be lovingly trotted out by them.

Wordsmith
 
As frequently pointed out before, the easiest way for the Tories to lose the 2022 election would be to stop Brexit or to agree to a deal that gave the EU control over our tax levels, regulations and tariffs post Brexit.

Stopping Brexit altogether would leave them out of power for a generation. May fought the 2017 GE to 'get a mandate for Brexit' and has been saying 'Brexit means Brexit' ever since. Were Brexit to be stopped, the electorate would lose all faith in the Tories and they'd be out of power for a generation.

Sign up to a deal that gave the EU control over our tax levels, regulations and tariffs post Brexit, the opposition would make hay - repeatedly engineering circumstances where the Tories were forced to admit or look shifty denying bit. In those cases, I suspect the Tories would be out of power for at least 10 years. 10 years when an increasingly hard left Labour government would transform our economy into a good impersonation of Venezuela's.

I don't think the Tory party is into committing electoral suicide.

Labour could combine with the other opposition parties and some Tory dissidents to stop Brexit - the votes are definitely there to do that. The reason they haven't done it is that May will immediately call a GE and the opposition will get shafted as the parties denying the will of the electorate.

The opposition parties are not into committing electoral suicide either.

What you are seeing is a game of "pass the blame parcel". May invites Corbyn to talks to discuss Corbyn's proposals, Corbyn will say May's not accepting his proposals and so on. This particular game will go on until March 29th as all the parties try to saddle the other with a portion of the blame .

The practical problem the opposition face is Brexit turning out successful/popular after a few months of hiccups. The Tories would be a shoe in for 2022 and all the opposition attempts to stop Brexit would be lovingly trotted out by them.

Wordsmith
I agree the Tories are stuffed.
 
I suspect elements within the EU would like a hard brexit (the French) whilst others such as the Germans would like us to follow the withdrawal agreement.

Either way it’s been badly handled by both sides compounded by the pond life we have in the commons who have got Blair and Sorros’s hands so far up gheir arses it’s becoming apparent that there’s something fundamentally wrong in the calibre of the politicians currently elected.
Andy, I agree about the French, but that is because those French elements believe it will cause the most harm to the UK.
 
The practical problem the opposition face is Brexit turning out successful/popular after a few months of hiccups. The Tories would be a shoe in for 2022 and all the opposition attempts to stop Brexit would be lovingly trotted out by them.
This is where Brexiteer logic can be as contradictory as their referendum campaign.

Either a) Theresa May knows only too well that a successful Brexit will keep her, and her Party, in power - and she's working as hard as she can to achieve it, including some fairly scary brinkmanship to get the ERG to support her

Or b) Theresa May is a closet Remainer who has been working to sabotage the honest efforts of the relevant Ministers of State (Davis, Fox, and Johnson), and the utter failure to achieve the "easiest deal in history" is all down to her, and definitely not because Davis / Fox are incompetent twats and the Brexit campaign was promising an undeliverable outcome.

You can't have both.

She's either working to secure the Tories' survival (in the face of an unrealistic set of promises), or she's seeking to sabotage both her own Party and the will of the people. Guess which is more realistic?
 
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The practical problem the opposition face is Brexit turning out successful/popular after a few months of hiccups.
Define "hiccups" - Empty shelves? Insufficient medicines? Several hundred thousand extra unemployed? Major employers moving out of the UK? Recession far worse than seen in 2008?

I mean, if it's just a few weeks of queues on the M20, it's a hiccup. If it's the Bank of England assessment of the impact of a disorderly or disruptive Brexit, it's a f***ing nightmare.
 

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