Brexit Phase Two - Trade

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I cannot see where the problem is the Euro and the EU is the way forward

How the EU saved Greece from disaster

Three years austerity and now out of special measures

We have had 10 years of austerity under the Conservatives and there is no end in sight other that diminished living standards

Archie
you need to visit Greece before you go comparing Greek austerity with UK austerity
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
Well paying taxes and seeing deteriorating services for start - poor roads and transport infrastructure, poor or no existent maintenance of public space

How about a shit economy, which cannot sustain normal operating levels and is driven by personal credit - through QE

Archie
How about having the leve of services we can afford - as determined by the UK's tax rvenue base.

One of the reasons for austerity was that Gordon (no boom of bust) Brown ended yup landing us with the greatest ever peacetime spending deficit - some £150 billion a year.

In this thread, we're flagging the benefits of not paying £8.6 billion a year to the EU - about a twentieth of the money Brown didn't have but was still spending.

Wordsmith
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
Excellent article. And argued on the basis of fact rather than hysteria.

Another first-class analysis on why the UK will prosper outside of the EU.

Wordsmith

Edited to add:

I can imagine the joy that the news that the UK's food prices have fallen 5% - 10% upon leaving the EU will be greeted by shoppers in many EU countries. They'd also start asking why their prices couldn't be similarly reduced, causing a massive political headache for the EU.
 
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How about having the leve of services we can afford - as determined by the UK's tax rvenue base.

One of the reasons for austerity was that Gordon (no boom of bust) Brown ended yup landing us with the greatest ever peacetime spending deficit - some £150 billion a year.

In this thread, we're flagging the benefits of not paying £8.6 billion a year to the EU - about a twentieth of the money Brown didn't have but was still spending.

Wordsmith

I expect the same level of services as I received in the past - my taxes have not decreased,

Trouble is too many people have paid the price for austerity - but the elite still seem to be unaffected

Archie
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
It earned me a smashing 'Dumb' from the SPOTY 2018 frontrunner.
Pathetic, isn't it? Blanket smashing of the mong buttons when Baggy sees something that he or she disagrees with undermines the Remain case on here. Better to attempt to refute the argument with facts and figures, etc.
I regularly get SABC's or similar from Baglock or a few other suspects. They're on ignore because they seem incapable of constructing a polite case - or in the case of Baglock any case at all.

Other Remain supporters won't go on ignore. I don't agree with what they post, but they do at least make an effort to make their point - and sometimes cite links in support of that case.

Wordsmith
 
Firstly, that I don't believe he's as clever as you imply. Secondly that reaching a position where someone like Johnson is considered a realistic Prime Minister shows the lamentable state of UK politics.

Corbyn or Johnson at the next GE, a truly depressing prospect.
That's for him to know and you to find out. Unfortunately our society doesn't work like that. ISTR that when Pitt the Younger was Lampooned in his time and latterly by Blackadder, he never the less affected our Foreign policy, some would say for the better. It is the concept of Politics and empire building that is the result that is lamentable. Those in a position to climb bandwagons do. If those Bandwagons chime with electorate so much the better.
 
I expect the same level of services as I received in the past - my taxes have not decreased,

Trouble is too many people have paid the price for austerity - but the elite still seem to be unaffected

Archie
And that dear chap..... is the effect of having tax collusion between the wealthy and the EU. despite this our personal tax thresholds have gone up and tax take has stayed level at 20% here but we've had to pay for an EU that nett is only for redistributing what goes in. The EU pays for nothing; the countries do they just add an EU logo. So just to get this straight. Louis Hamilton is based in Monaco-for tax issues. He buys a private Jet and then there's something to do with the VAT side. What's his Salary? 14 odd Million a year? Yet it's costing 10 Million for a revision program of the MOJ. Now here's the Gauntlet. Let all these celebrities fund a pet project in terms of Building, defence, LE, Education etc and put their money where their mouths are.
 
That's for him to know and you to find out. Unfortunately our society doesn't work like that. ISTR that when Pitt the Younger was Lampooned in his time and latterly by Blackadder, he never the less affected our Foreign policy, some would say for the better. It is the concept of Politics and empire building that is the result that is lamentable. Those in a position to climb bandwagons do. If those Bandwagons chime with electorate so much the better.

Thats the EU for you… tax efficient vehicles for the wealthy to buy tax write off Learjets at the little mans expense.
 
Excellent article. And argued on the basis of fact rather than hysteria.

Another first-class analysis on why the UK will prosper outside of the EU.

Wordsmith

Edited to add:

I can imagine the joy that the news that the UK's food prices have fallen 5% - 10% upon leaving the EU will be greeted by shoppers in many EU countries. They'd also start asking why their prices couldn't be similarly reduced, causing a massive political headache for the EU.
It would appear that EU shoppers won’t ask that question for fear of getting a SABC from @Baglock
 
The clue was you seemed to be linking the inefficient bureaucracy to the tax credits system in the UK....

Wordsmith
Nope; I was merely pointing out as an aside that the tax credits system is another shining example of bureaucratic bullshit - just like the EU administrative machine. Why have a raft of proven-to-be error-prone civil servants taking money out of peoples wage packets then giving them some back in tax credits when it would be more efficient and less wasteful to merely adjust their tax code to allow them to keep more of their income at source...?
 
The creepy wretch is stalking me round Current Affairs smashing his favourite button.
Remember, Whilst he’s doing that he’s not on a pre teen chat room.

It’s what worry’s me about @Higgs_bosun. He’s probably stalking school kids using a puppet unicorns and Pedro the Peopophile to explain why the holocaust never happened
 
I know it's only Facebook, but . . . hey !!

 
I know it's only Facebook, but . . . hey !!

I’d have thought that anybody with an ounce of common sense would’ve stopped putting their head above the parapet.

Alleged sex pest and Caribbean tax exile Richard Branson had to do a massive U turn when he decided to try and ban any pro brexit newspapers from his taxpayer subsidised railway.

Pro brexit politicians and business people are being put through a targeted smear campaign by establishment backing media claiming they’re Russian spies.

We had a vote on our continued membership of the EU after waiting almost two decades for a referendum to be delivered after it was promised.
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
Beeb this morning stated that today [sic] Greece took control of it's own economy and is "no longer controlled in terms of the Bailout terms. What makes you think the ECB is clearing the decks?
Greece's problems were both home grown and euro-related.

The home grown problem was wide spread tax evasion and corruption. As such, the Greek government collected only a fraction on the money it was spending on public services.

The euro related problem was that Greece lied its way into the euro by concealing the trued size of its budget deficit and then went on to borrow further money is couldn't repay at low interest rates because of its euro membership. Which became apparent when the Lehman recession started. (Worst case, some investors would only lend to the Greek state at 30%rates of interests for a 1 year loan).

Greece was bailed out, not to save Greece, but to save the euro. Greece can never (in practical terms) pay back its debt (180% of GDP and starting to rise again) and the burden of paying back the money is stopping Greece from investing in its economy (which is still 25% smaller than before the Lehman crash).

In addition, Greece is certain to default on its sovereign debt in the next recession. That in turn will spook investors, who will refuse to lend to Italy (debt 133% of GDP and set to rise even more), causing a too big to fail euro state to fail.

Greece is not in control of its own economy. Growth is being hindered by the value of the euro - the exchange rate is effectively far too high for the Greek economy in its present state - and by debt repayments. (Had Greece still had the Drachma, it might have recovered faster as the Drachma would have fallen in value and boosted both exports and tourism).

The Greek economy remains on life support - waiting the next recession to finish it off.

Wordsmith
 
Greece's problems were both home grown and euro-related.

The home grown problem was wide spread tax evasion and corruption. As such, the Greek government collected only a fraction on the money it was spending on public services.

The euro related problem was that Greece lied its way into the euro by concealing the trued size of its budget deficit and then went on to borrow further money is couldn't repay at low interest rates because of its euro membership. Which became apparent when the Lehman recession started. (Worst case, some investors would only lend to the Greek state at 30%rates of interests for a 1 year loan).

Greece was bailed out, not to save Greece, but to save the euro. Greece can never (in practical terms) pay back its debt (180% of GDP and starting to rise again) and the burden of paying back the money is stopping Greece from investing in its economy (which is still 25% smaller than before the Lehman crash).

In addition, Greece is certain to default on its sovereign debt in the next recession. That in turn will spook investors, who will refuse to lend to Italy (debt 133% of GDP and set to rise even more), causing a too big to fail euro state to fail.

Greece is not in control of its own economy. Growth is being hindered by the value of the euro - the exchange rate is effectively far too high for the Greek economy in its present state - and by debt repayments. (Had Greece still had the Drachma, it might have recovered faster as the Drachma would have fallen in value and boosted both exports and tourism).

The Greek economy remains on life support - waiting the next recession to finish it off.

Wordsmith
There seems to be indications that the next recession may not be too far off.
 
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