Breakup of the UK - where do your loyalties lie ?

Following the victory of the SNP and Alex Salmond becoming first minister of the Scotland - their has been much speculation about the future direction of the SNP government - steam rolling Scotland towards independence by the end of the decade.

A recent public opinion poll carried out in Scotland confirmed - the majority of Scots no longer feel much affinity to the United Kingdom or being British and the same poll reckoned that most Scots are of the opinion that Scotland will be an independent country by 2010.

For many of us on this forum - this should come as no surprise and perhaps a natural development bearing in mind the UK would only be following the natural evolution of nation states in Europe where over the past 100 years alone - countries have merged - only to be broken up into separate nation states later.

Of course the home nations of England, Scotland, Wales & Northern Ireland have always had a head start with separate football teams, rugby teams, etc.
Then of course the English have really taken the flag of St George to their hearts and have no inhibitions to flying the red cross of St George in preference to the Union Jack which has nose dived in popularity over recent years.

Finally the British army has not been immune to the rising tide of nationalism within her forces with newspaper pics of regiments like the Welsh Guards? flying Welsh flags from their tanks in Iraq.
Not that I'm against that sort of thing at all - but it does beggar the question.

The obvious question being - where do your loyalties lie if the United Kingdom should breakup like the Soviet Union did in the 1990's - how should the armed forces of the United Kingdom be divided up between say England and Scotland and will the Scots be entitled to a fair share of the UK's Royal naval ships when she finally becomes independent.
Looks like a journo post to me but I'll bite.
Alex Salmond (as well as all other politico's) should be put against a wall and shot. Breaking up the UK is the single most idiotic idea (after opening our borders to all and sundrie) that has ever came about.
And yes, Im Scottish.


Book Reviewer
ROCpostman said:
regiments like the Welsh Guards? flying Welsh flags from their tanks in Iraq.
Not that I'm against that sort of thing at all -
Me neither. I once saw the flag of Narnia flying from a Household Cavalry Scimitar. It could have been the Life Guards. Or it could have been somebody's laundry drying in the breeze. Hard to tell.
In 1959 while in CFyprus, and probably ever since, the Black Watch always flew the Saltire and the Union Jack at the camp entrance, as I presume did all the other Scottish Regiments this did not mean they were not British .


Book Reviewer
I'm not a racist but no doubt some one wil squeal it about this
Instead of wondering whether Welsh,Scottish or English Regiments flying their national flags from there camps and their vehicles will break up the UK
Should we not wonder wether the 'enclaves' that apear to be springing up in our cities and towns are more likely to lead to the UK as we know it falling apart?
If youv'e been here 30 years and you can't speak a word of the queens english and all your neighbours are the same and everything must be done to your ways and religion never mind where you live you want a mini India/Pakistan etc
Likewise children who are born here but prefer to align themselves with countries they have never even visited but are willing to die for whilst fighting against the country of their birth?

English,Scots and Welsh are the least of the worries at the moment
I like the whole idea of the UK.

However, if the member nations wish to seperate then they should be allowed to provided the vote is >50% of the population and not the turnout.
It would be sad but possibly inevitable.

It will be a bad day if the Scots, Welsh and N.Irish leave the union. So many shared historical moments blown away (kinda).

As someone with two English, a Scot and an Irishman for grandparents, I have to say, I consider myself British first and foremost and English second.

Nothing wrong with some regional pride. Its what has made Britain strong.

But will the union last forever? Doubt it.

I guess in the end it'll come down to wether Scotland, Wales et al, see their future as British or fully integrated into the EU.
If we go back far enough we could even be East Anglians, Northumbrians or Mercians or whatever but we're British, the majority of us, even those like me with English/Welsh parents etc, are proud to be British. What we must ensure is if it ever comes to a Yes/No vote on independence for any part of the UK we don't just talk about it but we get out and make our views known and vote against it.


Book Reviewer
guards1231 said:
Why would the Welsh Guards who are infantry be in a tank :? Maybe a AFV, but not a tank you turd stabber!
Because maybe they had a constituent battalion in Guards Armoured Division?
My loyalty is to HM The Queen and Her Heirs and Successors.

I imagine many, if not most, posters on here are bound by the same Oath.

This does not apply of course to the unprincipled filth even now hounding a young man and a young woman simply because of an accident of birth!
The Goon said: I don't think it would be anything LIKE the break up of the Soviet Union. That's a strange comparison.

Well Yugoslavia broke up as well as Czechoslovakia comparing it to the breakup of the USSR was just an example but their again . . . . . .

British tanks and armoured vechicles flying nationalistic flags - reminds me of a recent documentary on the History channel - about the attempted Soviet coup against Gorbachev in August 1991.

As you know Boris Yeltsin and his deputies defied the coup d'etat by barricading themselves in the Russian white house while russian tanks surrounded the parliamentary building. Only to be engulfed by many outraged citizens of moscow who tried to befriend the russian tank crews blockading the approaches to the White house.
On August 20th the coup leadership ordered special forces of the KGB's elite Alpha group with the support of paratroopers, to attack the White house and arrest Boris Yeltsin - but the commander of Alpha group General Viktor Karpukhin after carrying out an 'on the ground assesment' of the situation, refused to attack ( as the operation was impossible ) without much bloodshed.
The big question mark being the loyalty of the Soviet tank crews surrounding the russian White house as many tanks were flying the Russian tricolour handed over to them by the protestors.
My loyalty is to the Queen as Sovereign head of the United Kingdom.
We need a strong external enemy who threatens our collective existance (not a deranged rabble of die for Allah jihadis) this will serve to bind the UK together for another few generations, increase defense spending and harden social attitudes generally. Back to the cold war in other words.

So...who can we pick a fight with?
Isquared, happily bond by that oath, I'm proud to state. I have only ever expressed my alliagance to The Crown and I will continue to do so whatever the political situation.

Edited to add. Even if it means taking arms against a government that was opposed to HM or Her heirs.
Of course my loyalty is to the queen as head of state of the UK.

Like the rest of you - I'm pissed off that labour played nambie pambie to the nationalists and started the rot at all by granting devolution to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland in the first place.
In fact I couldn't believe labour carried out 2 referendums in Scotland to ensure that they got the necessary majority they needed to setup the Scottish parliament in the first place !!!
Lets not be cow towed and coerced by the nanny state again and vote a resounding NO to any referendum that would see the breakup of the United Kingdom.

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