Bosnia On the simmer

#2
Perfect excuse for us to establish another “presence” in the area...
 
#4
We are going no where. No money. Let some other member of NATO or the EU take its turn.
Wasn't it the case though that EUFOR came across as a paper tiger with no actual teeth....although the Austrian MPs were seen as the A-H Empire
 
#5
We are going no where. No money. Let some other member of NATO or the EU take its turn.
We always seem to find money when the humanitarian card gets played though. If it does, I’d wager Trump grabs the opportunity with both hands to demonstrate altruism.
 
#6
We are going no where. No money. Let some other member of NATO or the EU take its turn.
Seconded. Popcorn, comfy chair and nice pint of kabinet Supernova.
 
#7
We always seem to find money when the humanitarian card gets played though. If it does, I’d wager Trump grabs the opportunity with both hands to demonstrate altruism.
Because it self funded our own economy, we now pay others for our war fighting materials.
 
#9
Unless the Yanks start pushing like they did first time round, and only when the Yanks were able to show mass graves, etc, did the EU deign to consider doing anything, then nothing will happen.
 
#10
I remember the Int briefing before we deployed. It made no sense whatsoever. The Serbs, Bosnian Serbs, Croats, Bosnian Croats, Serbian Croats, Mujahideen, all these factions that were somewhat aligned with some others, but not really. I think the only combination that didn't exist was Serbian Bosniaks. But that was probably only because the Serbs had already offed any.

A true case of "if you think you understand the situation, you haven't been briefed properly".
 
#11
As the UK is negotiating its departure from the EU, it could be described as hypocritical and rather cynical of the UK to (now) become associated with any efforts to frustrate an "entity" - such as Republika Srpska - that is trying to resist being consumed, subsumed, by the overtly expansionist ambitions of Brussels.

Republika Srpska is also determined to resist the persistent move to/influence of, the "Multiculturalism" encouraged by, and which characterises, Sarajevo.

It is suggested that such attitudes within Republika Srpska, might (now) earn the admiration and support of some of those who failed to recognise all the factors at play - and, that were influencing - the last "unpleasantness".

(Was that subtle enough?!).
 
#13
As the UK is negotiating its departure from the EU, it could be described as hypocritical and rather cynical of the UK to (now) become associated with any efforts to frustrate an "entity" - such as Republika Srpska - that is trying to resist being consumed, subsumed, by the overtly expansionist ambitions of Brussels.

Republika Srpska is also determined to resist the persistent move to/influence of, the "Multiculturalism" encouraged by, and which characterises, Sarajevo.

It is suggested that such attitudes within Republika Srpska, might (now) earn the admiration and support of some of those who failed to recognise all the factors at play - and, that were influencing - the last "unpleasantness".

(Was that subtle enough?!).
Too subtle for me mate!

I blame Tito. If he hadn't died, they'd still be Yugoslavia and there wouldn't have been a war :)
 
#14
The past is the past but I never really understood why the Serbs - who supported us before and during WW1 and WW2 - are the bad guys and the Croats and Bosnians, who had pro-German regimes, are now the good guys.
I appreciate that some Serbs were forced by events to de facto support of the Germans, but that was mainly for self preservation.

Anyway, hopefully there's some reflection before we step into a situation of middle east-like complexity, and risks (Uncle Vlad).
 
#15
As an author whose name I can't remember said of the Yugo unpleasantness of the 90s - there are no guys wearing white hats, just two in black hats and one in a very dark grey hat.

Edited for accuracy now I've checked the book "Slaughterhouse - Bosnia and the Failure of the West" by David Reiff, quoting an American colonel with UNPROFOR "There are two black hats and one very grey hat in this war".
 
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#16
The past is the past but I never really understood why the Serbs - who supported us before and during WW1 and WW2 - are the bad guys and the Croats and Bosnians, who had pro-German regimes, are now the good guys.
I appreciate that some Serbs were forced by events to de facto support of the Germans, but that was mainly for self preservation.

Anyway, hopefully there's some reflection before we step into a situation of middle east-like complexity, and risks (Uncle Vlad).
I think in large part it was because the Serbs occupied the high ground around Sarajevo, laid siege and mortared the shit out of it, effectively shooting fish in a barrel. That alienated the big boys at the UN as it was indiscriminate killing that took a lot of innocent lives.
 
#17
The past is the past but I never really understood why the Serbs - who supported us before and during WW1 and WW2 - are the bad guys and the Croats and Bosnians, who had pro-German regimes, are now the good guys.
I appreciate that some Serbs were forced by events to de facto support of the Germans, but that was mainly for self preservation.

Anyway, hopefully there's some reflection before we step into a situation of middle east-like complexity, and risks (Uncle Vlad).


I think its stretching it to say the Serbs ever supported us, rather than just happen to be fighting everyone around them, most of whom happened to be on the other side...

Today the Serbs are just one of a number of conduits for the hostile and deliberately destabilising initiatives from Russia.

Russia's malignant actions are the reason why its probably not a good idea for grown-up countries to ignore the conflict and hope it'll go away.
 
#18
I think in large part it was because the Serbs occupied the high ground around Sarajevo, laid siege and mortared the shit out of it, effectively shooting fish in a barrel. That alienated the big boys at the UN as it was indiscriminate killing that took a lot of innocent lives.
That was definitely a large part of it. The civil wars also gave the West a way into a formerly non-aligned area, and reduced the influence of the pro-Russian Serbs.
It is a region with much potential for trouble, sadly.
 
#19
I think its stretching it to say the Serbs ever supported us, rather than just happen to be fighting everyone around them, most of whom happened to be on the other side...

Today the Serbs are just one of a number of conduits for the hostile and deliberately destabilising initiatives from Russia.

Russia's malignant actions are the reason why its probably not a good idea for grown-up countries to ignore the conflict and hope it'll go away.
Noted. I think it is still legitimate to ask whether there's an eastern limit to the role of grown up countries? There's obviously no direct border between Russia and the UK but I can understand why Russia is unhappy with western influence in Ukraine, the Baltics, etc.
 
#20
I think in large part it was because the Serbs occupied the high ground around Sarajevo, laid siege and mortared the shit out of it, effectively shooting fish in a barrel. That alienated the big boys at the UN as it was indiscriminate killing that took a lot of innocent lives.
It started before then IIRC, the allegations of "genocide", "ethnic cleansing", etc were going from before Sarajevo, and I remember a documentary with the likes of Albright saying how Washington was a tad upset at the EU not agreeing to do something, anything, until the US provided solid evidence of the likes of mass graves, etc, which tipped the balance even though the signs of such were not merely there, they were fecking huge neon ones pointing to what was going on.
 

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