Bloody Sunday

#1
Didn’t the Paras also panic and screw up in Kosovo by shooting dead some non-threat civilians? It seems as though we can’t send these imbeciles anywhere without later becoming embarrassed by their unprofessional behaviour.
 
#5
closest thing i could find to this tossers crap
Child murder in Kosovo puts US force on trial
Child murder in Kosovo puts US force on trial - Europe, World - The Independent
You didn’t try very hard. It took me about 10 seconds to find the following using Google search.


Paras could face trial over Kosovo shootings; Once again, a legal nightmare for young soldiers we send into danger and train to defend themselves.



THERE was outrage yesterday after it emerged that three British paratroopers who killed two Albanian gunmen in Kosovo are likely to face a court martial COURT MARTIAL. A court authorized by the articles of war, for the trial of all offenders in the army or navy, for military offences. Article 64, directs that general courts martial may consist of any number of commissioned officers, from five to thirteen, inclusively; but they shall not .

Investigators say they believe there is enough evidence to bring charges against a corporal and two privates from the 1st Battalion, the Parachute Regiment Parachute regiment can denote

Army investigators delved into the case despite there being no complaints at the time from the Kosovo Liberation Army The Kosovo Liberation Army or KLA (Albanian: Ushtria Çlirimtare e Kosovës or UÇK) was an ethnic Albanian paramilitary extremist group which sought independence for the province of Kosovo from Yugoslavia and Serbia in the late 1990s. - the paramilitary group to which the men belonged - the United Nations, or the authorities in Pristina.

In the days following the shooting, Ministers gave assurances that the Paras would not face murder charges.

Yesterday, however, the Ministry of Defence said that this had not been ruled out, although a spokesman did dismiss reports that a decision to press charges had already been taken.

Last night, Shadow Defence Secretary Iain Duncan Smith George Iain Duncan Smith MP (born 9 April 1954), often referred to as IDS, is a British politician. He is Member of Parliament for the constituency of Chingford and Woodford Green. He was leader of the Conservative Party from 12 September 2001 to 6 November 2003.

'This is terrible news,' he said. 'In future, soldiers may hesitate before defending themselves or others while carrying out their duties because they will be worried that they could be prosecuted.' The two KLA KLA Kosovo Liberation Army
KLA Key Learning Area (NSW Department of Education)
members were riding on the roof of a packed car as Albanians celebrated their Independence Day in the provincial capital Pristina on July 3 last year.

At least one was firing a gun into the air. The Paras shouted warnings, ran into the road, firing their weapons into the air, but the KLA men either did not hear them, or took no notice - and the soldiers opened fire.

The Army insists the Paras, who were guarding a building full of Serbs, believed their lives were at risk.

But onlookers have told investigators they do not believe the soldiers did enough to warn those in the car.

One of the key witnesses is Muhamed Bici, 24, a cousin of the dead men, who was shot in the jaw. He was later flown to Britain for treatment and has been awarded legal aid to sue the MoD.

Court martial proceedings will be extremely embarrassing for the Government at a time when it is promoting the peacekeeping role of the Army.

The 1st Battalion not only spearheaded Nato forces in Kosovo, but also efforts to safeguard the Sierra Leone capital Freetown in May.

Elements of the battalion were sent back to West Africa in September to rescue British soldiers held hostage by the West Side Boys militia.

The battalion is also embroiled in the Bloody Sunday inquiry The Bloody Sunday Inquiry, also known as the Saville inquiry, was established in 1998 by Prime Minister Tony Blair after campaigns by families of those killed and injured in Derry on Bloody Sunday for a second inquiry. , and soldiers have spoken of their sense of 'betrayal' by the Government.

The three men have insisted they acted in accordance with the rules of engagement in Kosovo, which are similar to those in Northern Ireland.

Soldiers carry a green card telling them they can kill in self-defence, but only after a verbal warning.

One of the three men told friends at the weekend: 'We warned them three times and in the end we believed our lives were in danger and we had to do it.' All three, who are based at Folkestone, Kent, were said yesterday to be attending a preliminary hearing of the evidence, described by the MoD as 'plea and directions'.

A spokesman stressed that neither the UN or Nato was involved in the decision on whether to bring charges and under no circumstances would the soldiers be required to face a trial in Pristina.

Army investigators travelled to Pristina and talked to both the UN and civilian authorities during a yearlong inquiry.

The Paras were told to adopt a 'robust' stance when they arrived in Pristina last year.

Although involved in clashes that left both Serbs and Albanians dead, they were credited with keeping the peace and sending the 'right message' out to the people.

They regularly patrolled on foot and were hugely popular among the Albanians, who welcomed them as liberators.

Mr Duncan Smith will table a question to the Government over the case tomorrow.

He accused Labour of allowing the European Convention on Human Rights to dominate policy in relation to the military.

The MP pointed to the Bloody Sunday inquiry - which is investigating the events of 1972 in which 14 civilians died in Londonderry after a civil rights march turned into a riot.

'The Government has pursued a politically correct politically correct Politically sensitive adjective Referring to language reflecting awareness and sensitivity to another person's physical, mental, cultural, or other disadvantages or deviations from a norm; a person is not mentally retarded, but
..... Click the link for more information. agenda, forcing the armed forces to change and weaken their disciplinary rules Precepts, such as the Code of Professional Responsibility, that proscribe an attorney from taking certain actions in the Practice of Law.

Proceedings can be instituted to disbar an attorney who violates the disciplinary rules. ,' he added. 'We are in danger of producing Servicemen whose only purpose for the Labour government will be to deliver tea and sympathy, rather than carry out their proper combat duties.' Tory MP Gerald Howarth, whose Aldershot constituency was once the home of the Paras, added: 'We are in very very dangerous territory.

'We expect a tremendous amount of our young soldiers sent to the front lines.' Mr Howarth said the Paras are deployed to the most difficult trouble spots because of their reputation, discipline and professionalism. The Government is now in danger of damaging this, he added.


[ Paras could face trial over Kosovo shootings; Once again, a legal nightmare for young soldiers we send into danger and train to defend themselves. - Free Online Library ]
 
#6
Didn’t the Paras also panic and screw up in Kosovo by shooting dead some non-threat civilians?
Dunno. But I do know a few ex-members of the Parachute Regiment. Why don't you PM me your home address and they can come round and chat to you about it?
 
#8
Roger99
Didn’t the Paras also panic and screw up in Kosovo by shooting dead some non-threat civilians? It seems as though we can’t send these imbeciles anywhere without later becoming embarrassed by their unprofessional behaviour.

When one learns one goes from a state of ignorance, to a little learning, to a moderate amount of knowledge, on to a better understanding and more knowledge of a subject, then one perhaps spends years or decades becoming as near expert as possible.

Is is sadly easy to stop along the way, especially at the "little learning stage", and announce oneself as expert.

The internet has helped with the availability of "facts" and "opinions", which can now be gleaned so much more easily than ever before; again sadly, "fact" is not always fact but often biased opinion; and "opinion" is rarely matched with a name to whose opinion was quoted, thus giving little credence to anything.

By and large intelligence cell threads on here draw a wide variety of opinion on subjects, but it is rare to see such astoundingly ill-researched and totally bland criticisms as in your "can't send these imbeciles anywhere".

We do not tend to send The Paras, on the whole, to intenational conferences on peace, or debates on the environment, or sit them behind desks to answer questions from the public about their partner's right to legal aid or benefits; and in any of those situations I would be the first (not as a group I may add, but by criticising the behaviour of individuals), to leap to your side, and criticize over-violent action or reaction.

To even a "Sun" reader on a bad picture day, it would though seem apparent that we send them to violent areas and situations potentially lethal to themselves and innocent parties. We even send them, oddly again perhaps to some, to wars, which have no relation to "normal" life whatsoever.

I have not served Regular Army, but was born in Belfast, with family on both sides of the disputes of the last forty odd years, and I have been caught up there in situations of violent assembly. I have been afraid of who might or might not have weapons around me and that someone may be shot, and particularly that it might be me. Whether the shot may have come from a republican terrorist, a loyalist, or even had I moved in front of some rightful target, by our forces. Had I been armed and serving on two of those occasions, with a duty to protect the mass of those around me, and my comrades, I honestly do not know that I might not have been the cause of some unfortunate and even inappropriate death; once evidence had been swept away, and the white collar boys moved in later to investigate, well after the white heat of the minute had dispersed.

I suspect I may, had I been in The Queen's uniform on those two occasions, have been far more likely to use my weapon than any of the soldiers there.

Mr Roger99, I simply put it to you, that you rather obviously do NOT know that of which you speak.

Save your true ire, Mr Roger99, for those who start wars for profit, for power and for position; they kill thousands without a backward glance.
 
#9
Once again some ********, probably a "student" has come onto the site to have a dig at the military! When will tossers like him realise that it is just because of men like the Paras he seems to despise, who fought and gave their lives so that he can have the FREEDOM to make nonsensical comments without the fear of the knock on the door in the night and the hauling off to the re education center or worse!
Show some respect for your BETTERS (that is any serviceman) you total waste of sperm!
 
#10
Don't you just love it when people with no apparent military service rock up at this site and start pontificating upon events that they obviously have no experience of, unless Roger99 has served in NI which I doubt very much.

Maybe we should adopt the same motto as the Hells Angels Motor Cycle Club.

"When we do right, nobody remembers. When we do wrong, nobody forgets".

How very true.
 
#11
You didn’t try very hard. It took me about 10 seconds to find the following using Google search.
But he is right first time "Your a fucking prat"
 
#12
Didn’t the Paras also panic and screw up in Kosovo by shooting dead some non-threat civilians? It seems as though we can’t send these imbeciles anywhere without later becoming embarrassed by their unprofessional behaviour.
Bit of a sweeping statement there.
So Rog' - before the maroon outrage bus pulls up. Why do you hate Paras?
Failed P Company perchance? Or are you just a lazy journo out for a bite?
 
#13
Perhaps the MODs should put this thread to bed.

FWIW I always check the date the poster joined ARRSE and how many times he's posted before responding to posts like these. It is pretty obvious who the trolls and t*ssers are...

Rodney2q
 
#14
Fire up the outrage bus. FFS lads, flaming isn't a new sport - posting a full page diatribe isn't going to make a troll go away.
 
#15
It is remarkable how quickly a tread will fill with military fantasists and wannabes when certain high profile regiments are mentioned.

It is telling that most of those replying to the OP have chosen to either insult or threaten me rather than countering what was alleged with serious argument.
 

the_boy_syrup

LE
Book Reviewer
#16
Bit of a sweeping statement there.
So Rog' - before the maroon outrage bus pulls up. Why do you hate Paras?
Failed P Company perchance? Or are you just a lazy journo out for a bite?
His grandad had just opened a Falafel stall at Suez in 1956.................................
 
#19
It is remarkable how quickly a tread will fill with military fantasists and wannabes when certain high profile regiments are mentioned.

It is telling that most of those replying to the OP have chosen to either insult or threaten me rather than countering what was alleged with serious argument.
Perhaps you might furnish us with details of your military service then.
As for me : Royal Artillery 1975-1987, on second thoughts maybe that does make me a military fantasist.

Say something in Squadili to me.

Your turn Roger.
 

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