Bloody BAe at it again!

#1
Just how much of the defence manufacturing sector are these clowns going to get? British WasteOfSpace looks set to buy Alvis now that General dynamics have all but given up.

http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentS...y&c=StoryFT&cid=1085944500087&p=1012571727085

Wish they paid their Engineers and Techs half as much as they pay their contracts lawyers - we might start getting kit on time, to budget and that works - that would be a shock!
 
#2
Just think, if they had ploughed the Al Yanamah project Bribery and Whoring fund in to R and D... :twisted:
 
#3
Those bar stewards are still in the running for Project Falcon, the new comms system which is due to replace Ptarmigan. Apparently the "deselection" process is goin on this month between BAe and Marconi.

Either way, smart procurement is an oxymoron.

And, either way, the British public will be ripped off and the military will be left furrowing our brows in frustration. On the plus side, it will provide loads of jobs for guys leaving the Royal Signals!! :)

PD
 
#4
Yeah - for 6 to 12 months on contract, then they get dumped, and when theres a problem that needs sorting when it's coming into service theres no one withy the experience to deal with it - real forward thinking and commitment - not!
 
#5
MikeMcc said:
Just how much of the defence manufacturing sector are these clowns going to get? British WasteOfSpace looks set to buy Alvis now that General dynamics have all but given up.

http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentS...y&c=StoryFT&cid=1085944500087&p=1012571727085

Wish they paid their Engineers and Techs half as much as they pay their contracts lawyers - we might start getting kit on time, to budget and that works - that would be a shock!
Big problem is that the MoD is a truly lousy customer who buys less and less so no-one else is really that interested in their business. Hence no-one else is really that interested in Alvis. Just consider that BAE has evolved over the years to be an organisation that makes money from the MoD - there are two sides to everything.

You'll note that when US companies sell us stuff it's very much take it or leave it on the contractual side, as they can afford to live without the business. Funnily enough, BAE, as they expand in the US, are starting to think about leaving the UK defence market for good.
 
#7
good at least we wont get crap foisted on us cos it maintains uk jobs
bae only product i tust is the plastic bags the rounds come in very handy
and even those are just a bit too small .
Rember when i was a kid used to go to farnborough and grab leaflets
from the bae stand
years later went back now a stab and it was "why dont you make something that works ?"
Think the Mod should tell them bae that is too get our flag off your crap :lol:
 
#8
One_of_the_strange said:
Big problem is that the MoD is a truly lousy customer who buys less and less so no-one else is really that interested in their business.
Too true. Story from 1991; I worked for Ferranti, and the lads along in the Electro-Optics Division were working on this cute stabilised, TV + IR, airborne laser designator pod called TIALD. State of the art stuff, no-one else has a two-channel system, RAF is still flying PAVE SPIKE (a 1970s-vintage piece of US first-generation kit) on Buccaneers.

Gulf kicks off; RAF asks Ferranti very nicely "can we borrow the trials kits and try them out?" and the two development pods go sandside on Tornados. For those of an engineering bent, these were prototype sets, electronics made with wire-wrap......

Anyway, the two pods work stunningly well by all accounts, lots of engineers breathe sighs of relief, Ferranti looks forward to the production order coming through. "No problem", says MoD, "it'll be along in a month or two". Now, this means that you have to staff and maintain the production line, start ramping up people and stores to make them.

It took over a year for the order to come through, and MoD expected the firm to just keep all of the assembly line and stores sitting around at company expense for that time until they deigned to sign on the dotted line. I think "Options" was the justification for the delay, so no surprise that the order was a bit skimpy as well.

Nowadays, if you go to MoD(PE) at Abbey Wood, you can see one of the pods on a plinth, complete with felt-pen nose art and spray-canned paint sand-blasted away in flight to reveal preproduction shiny white (can't remember whether it's "Sandra" or "Tracy" on the plinth). It's almost as if they're proud of it.....

Not to mention the late-1980s / early-1990s stramash over the radar for the Eurofighter; competition is between a chopped APG-65 led by the Germans, and a redesigned Blue Vixen led by Ferranti. We had about three rounds of "best and final offers" as the customer tried to screw the price for the bid. That one was another "politics enters the fray" as the Germans tried to foist a crap US system hacked by Germans onto us, on the grounds that British firms were already design leads on the airframe, the engines, the flight control system, and the ECM system respectively......

It's interesting that GEC-Marconi thought so much of the defence sector and its customers, that Lord Simpson chose to flog its entire defence arm to BAe in the mid/late 1990s ..... not a great business decision as it turns out (understatement) but at least it shoes how highly the customers were thought of.
 
#9
woody said:
good at least we wont get crap foisted on us cos it maintains uk jobs
bae only product i tust is the plastic bags the rounds come in very handy
and even those are just a bit too small .
Rember when i was a kid used to go to farnborough and grab leaflets
from the bae stand
years later went back now a stab and it was "why dont you make something that works ?"
Think the Mod should tell them bae that is too get our flag off your crap :lol:
Two things: The DPA usually manage things so badly that they are contractually obligated to pay for crap. And the flag has gone, officially BAESYSTEMS (not BAe any more) is not a British company.
 
#10
Ahh , buying stuff, Nimrod MR4A let's extend the life to 50 yrs old passenger jet (Comet circa 1950/60) to 2025 and sell it as new. Don't think so. Nimrod went belly up before. US companies are after one hits-Bowman- CDC turned in to General Dynamics UK. Little company bids in big company in the back ground- not UK. Read MOD in house mag "FOCUS" biggest load of back slapping bollocks around.
 

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