Blood sports ahead - Pirates capture 4 Americans

Uzbeck

War Hero
Has the side effect of massively good PR for the Pirates with the locals as well. A few of 'the lads' decided to get millitant and have a)made themselves a packet and b)The fishing is good again for those that dont want to be Pirates. And c) they now have a well armed source of secular gun toting businessmen who have told the Islamic Fundies to go take a hike when they tried to move in.
 
Call me old fashioned if you like but the yanks do tend to dig themselves deeper into the shite when things like this happen.....

US naval sources have said that two skinnys were onboard a US Naval vessel for negotiations when their colleagues still aboard the yacht decided (for no apparent reason) to fire an RPG at the naval vessel. Then shots were heard on the yacht and the seals boarded it killing two skinnys (one with a knife!!! why if it had all gone noisy anyway?) and found the hostages and two other skinnys dead (well one hostage still alive but she expired soon afterwards)

Skinny sources have told a BBC reporter in Nairobi (and how do these sources know unless they were onboard and also had access to a phone to let the BBC know before the yanks 'arrested' them!) that the yanks boarded the yacht sneaky beaky style and killed two skinnys but the others killed the hostages anyway!

Funnily enough I tend to believe the second version. A rescue attempt that went tits up... now I am not condeming the yanks for trying it... I am not condeming them for having failed, a rescue attempt like that probably has only a minor chance of success.... but the US Navy should have said feck all till the entire facts comes out. The naval sources version sounds like a panicky whitewash...just the same with the Brit hostage killed by the Yank grenade, where US sources said it was a taliban suicide bomb... just like the wikileaks Apache attack where the Yanks said that "There is no question that coalition forces were clearly engaged in combat operations against a hostile force" which although not untrue, did not truthfully refer directly to the so called 'collateral murder' incident.

These ill-advised 'statements' by the US Military do very little to enhace the plausibility of the US and just leads to a heck of a lot of mistrust, no wonder people beleive wikileaks so openly if the US command isnt 100% staright with the worlds media..... for fecks sake Barack old bean, if I were you I would be telling your military commanders that if some ass-wipe decides to make a statement which is seen as a cover-up later on, because the facts dont match the statement 100% then they would be losing there job PDQ.
Obviously he had one eye on the SF Porn book he would be writing as soon as his tour was finished. Good drills, that man.

What I can't understand is why, once the hostages had been confirmed as dead, the rest of the Skinnies were not killed immediately. The old Shane(the movie, not the fat Aussie)Special: "You all saw him - he had a gun!"
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
I once attended a conference in Singapore (nice gig if you can get it) on piracy prevention in the Mallacca Straits. Speaker after speaker stood up and said that Malaysia and Singapore needed to spend far more money on policing it (with an undertone from every interested party that some money needed to go they're way). Near the end was a paper from an Malaysian admiral, a highly intelligent man and Dartmouth and US Staff College educated. He made 3 points that shocked and horrified the audience of industry and interest groups:

1. The probelm is not Malaysian or Singaporean - very few ships of theirs were attacked. If the western nations wanted piracy eradicated then they would have to pay for it
2. Unless everyone becomes a policeman it is impossible to eradicate crime and therefore there is an "acceptable" level of crime.. Since piracy in the straits was in fact primarily seaborne robbery (with little actual violence or injury) then the cost of eradication outweighed the benefit.
3. Finally, and most relevent to piracy in Somalia, the issue is not stopping crime in action but preventing the cause of crime. The pirates in the straits are mostly Indonesian fishermen driven out of work by overfishing and with no alternative means of supporting their families. The answer to piracy in the straits was not crime prevention but job creation on the Indonesian coast.

Does point 3 sound familiar? There's a lot of waffle about killing skinnies to prevent piracy. Probably not effective on its own - it will just drive them to more extreme measures when they capture a ship. What's needed is an incentive - stabilising their country and getting them back to work. Its not sexy, its long term and it costs money. But how long can we maintain a frigate or an RFA off Somalia full time?
 
I once attended a conference in Singapore (nice gig if you can get it) on piracy prevention in the Mallacca Straits. Speaker after speaker stood up and said that Malaysia and Singapore needed to spend far more money on policing it (with an undertone from every interested party that some money needed to go they're way). Near the end was a paper from an Malaysian admiral, a highly intelligent man and Dartmouth and US Staff College educated. He made 3 points that shocked and horrified the audience of industry and interest groups:

1. The probelm is not Malaysian or Singaporean - very few ships of theirs were attacked. If the western nations wanted piracy eradicated then they would have to pay for it
2. Unless everyone becomes a policeman it is impossible to eradicate crime and therefore there is an "acceptable" level of crime.. Since piracy in the straits was in fact primarily seaborne robbery (with little actual violence or injury) then the cost of eradication outweighed the benefit.
3. Finally, and most relevent to piracy in Somalia, the issue is not stopping crime in action but preventing the cause of crime. The pirates in the straits are mostly Indonesian fishermen driven out of work by overfishing and with no alternative means of supporting their families. The answer to piracy in the straits was not crime prevention but job creation on the Indonesian coast.

Does point 3 sound familiar? There's a lot of waffle about killing skinnies to prevent piracy. Probably not effective on its own - it will just drive them to more extreme measures when they capture a ship. What's needed is an incentive - stabilising their country and getting them back to work. Its not sexy, its long term and it costs money. But how long can we maintain a frigate or an RFA off Somalia full time?
Kill every Skinny who gets in a boat. Starvation will take care of the rest. Job jobbed.
 
I once attended a conference in Singapore (nice gig if you can get it) on piracy prevention in the Mallacca Straits. Speaker after speaker stood up and said that Malaysia and Singapore needed to spend far more money on policing it (with an undertone from every interested party that some money needed to go they're way). Near the end was a paper from an Malaysian admiral, a highly intelligent man and Dartmouth and US Staff College educated. He made 3 points that shocked and horrified the audience of industry and interest groups:

1. The probelm is not Malaysian or Singaporean - very few ships of theirs were attacked. If the western nations wanted piracy eradicated then they would have to pay for it
2. Unless everyone becomes a policeman it is impossible to eradicate crime and therefore there is an "acceptable" level of crime.. Since piracy in the straits was in fact primarily seaborne robbery (with little actual violence or injury) then the cost of eradication outweighed the benefit.
3. Finally, and most relevent to piracy in Somalia, the issue is not stopping crime in action but preventing the cause of crime. The pirates in the straits are mostly Indonesian fishermen driven out of work by overfishing and with no alternative means of supporting their families. The answer to piracy in the straits was not crime prevention but job creation on the Indonesian coast.

Does point 3 sound familiar? There's a lot of waffle about killing skinnies to prevent piracy. Probably not effective on its own - it will just drive them to more extreme measures when they capture a ship. What's needed is an incentive - stabilising their country and getting them back to work. Its not sexy, its long term and it costs money. But how long can we maintain a frigate or an RFA off Somalia full time?
I doubt you are going to be able to provide jobs for the Somalians that can provide revenue of approx $1 million. As that is what they are getting paid in ransoms (obviously that is an approximation for arguments sake)

Piracy on in the mallaca straits is a different beast in that they go on, the crew lock themselves in their rooms and the pirates go round nicking gucci stuff then bugger off.
 

Uzbeck

War Hero
No. You provide decent well paying jobs and security AND muller heck out of the pirates at the same time. Once you've seen that although Crime pays pretty well but is rather risky to life and limb and there is a safe well paying alternative...most people will take the latter.

Otherwise us Cornishmen would really be back to wrecking ....'cos we would if we thought we could get away with it.
 
Kill every Skinny who gets in a boat. Starvation will take care of the rest. Job jobbed.
I have visions of you in a robe screaming "DEPLOY THE KRACKEN!!!"
 
I have visions of you in a robe screaming "DEPLOY THE KRACKEN!!!"
How very dare you! I'm the Emperor Palpatine, I'll have you know!

"Wipe them out...all of them!":muhaha:

Edited to add; if you have visions of me in a robe - seek professional help. Possibly an exorcist...
 

Bouillabaisse

LE
Book Reviewer
No. You provide decent well paying jobs and security AND muller heck out of the pirates at the same time. Once you've seen that although Crime pays pretty well but is rather risky to life and limb and there is a safe well paying alternative...most people will take the latter.

Otherwise us Cornishmen would really be back to wrecking ....'cos we would if we thought we could get away with it.

Agreed, carrot and stick. Or oggie and the Revenue

Mind you, looking at the price of holiday lets in Cornwall in August piracy and daylight robbery have not been totally eradicated
 
Skinny sources have told a BBC reporter .
How could anyone possibly even consider that these sources might, possibly, be the teeniest, eeniest ickle bit biased.
 
The naval sources version sounds like a panicky whitewash...just the same with the Brit hostage killed by the Yank grenade, where US sources said it was a taliban suicide bomb....
Ah, yes; thats the one that the local Commander considered, reviewed and very rapidly ( to his great credit) gave a revised version of the story within 24 hours?

Why not just say you hate the Yanks?
 
Bleeding-heart liberal. The entire, worthless country should be wiped off the map. If there was ever a race of people who prove that genocide is not automatically a bad thing, Somali's are it.

And yes, I'm aware that there are still Western hostages being held there; that's the only reason I'm not calling for Somali to be turned into the world's biggest Glow in the Dark Carpark.
Before wiping this totally worthless country off the face of the earth,can we deport every last one of the worthless criminal benefit-scrounging terrorist Somalis from Britain back to Somalia?.
 
How could anyone possibly even consider that these sources might, possibly, be the teeniest, eeniest ickle bit biased.


Tut Tut you are deliberately using biased tactics that you blame the BBC of by ignoring the follow on statement in my post...(and how do these sources know unless they were onboard and also had access to a phone to let the BBC know before the yanks 'arrested' them!) I never said I beleived the BBC report from Nairobi..how did they get the information...but it does seem a plausible idea does it not?..well it does to me!

Ah, yes; thats the one that the local Commander considered, reviewed and very rapidly ( to his great credit) gave a revised version of the story within 24 hours?

Why not just say you hate the Yanks?

So why didnt the local commander just wait 24 hours till he had the full facts before allowing someone to 'balls it up' to the press earlier?

No I dont hate Americans as individual people per se...I just dislike and distrust America as a whole!
 

Uzbeck

War Hero
The US do seem to feel unable to say 'We dont yet have the full facts, we'll have them very shortly, untill then no comment'.

I guess its a cultural thing, the US seems to have a lot more respect for Journo's than we do in the UK. Perhaps immediate silence just leads to worse stories and allegations of cover ups?
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
I cant see how the US can respect its journos going by the sanctified drivel they churn out. I watch the US evening shows on the news channels and for a country with 250 odd million people they have no worthy news or you get the sesame street version
 
Danish yacht ING apparently seized last thursday with 7 Danes on board, including three children.

fun fun fun
 
Jesus when will these people learn, The Somalis have been venturing further and further afield, how the feck can you risk your children's lives on a fecking cruise in potentially dangerous waters!

I just hope for the kids sakes that the Yanks dont try and rescue them!


Isnt it time someone did an 'Oradour' on some Somali village in reprisal!
 

ottar

LE
Jesus when will these people learn, The Somalis have been venturing further and further afield, how the feck can you risk your children's lives on a fecking cruise in potentially dangerous waters!
All waters are 'potentially dangerous'. Crossing the road is also 'potentially dangerous'. Do you have any idea of how many people there are at sea that weren't attacked by pirates?
Which waters are you planning on restricting 'cruises' to?
 

Fotofrog

Old-Salt
The whole situation with the skinnies is an odd one. Whilst eradication of the entire race seems a credible option the west coast of Africa has seen some benefit - as mentioned there is now a wealth of fish back in the area.

I think cruisers/yachts should ensure they keep an unbelievably wide birth or avoid the general area all together. Easier said than done I know but if you want a septic grenade/blade/.50 visit during a hostage rescue then continue to drop by and let the skinnies pay you a visit.
 

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