Blind Pugh unveils totalitarian anti-terror proposals

Blind Pugh:

  • He's only doing what's right for our safety

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Maybe he's pushing this a little too far

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • We should be a bit worried about this chap

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Get this totalitarian monster out!

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters

Anti-terror laws 'may go further'

Anti-terror measures could be stepped up
The home secretary is to spell out proposals for more far-reaching measures to tackle terrorism. David Blunkett will unveil the ideas on ITV1's Jonathan Dimbleby programme.
Proposals include special anti-terror courts without juries and civil orders which could be used against people suspected of planning terrorism.

The new legislation will not be introduced until law lords rule on existing anti-terror laws, nor feature in the Queen's speech this week.

BBC political correspondent Carole Walker said the new proposals will have to await the ruling, expected in the New Year, on the terror suspects being held without trial in Belmarsh prison in London.

But she said Mr Blunkett is expected to lead new crackdowns on anti-social behaviour and organised crime with a raft of new bills in Tuesday's Queen's Speech.

The government and security services have long warned that an attack on the UK is "inevitable".

But Mr Blunkett has also been criticised by his political opponents who say he is creating a climate of fear to justify repressive anti-terror laws, she said.

Phone taps

In the television interview, to be shown on Sunday, he says officials are looking at more measures such as special anti-terror courts and allowing evidence from phone taps in trials.

The home secretary says new civil orders are also being considered which could be imposed against people suspected of "acts preparatory to terrorism" even if they have not committed an offence.

He said the breach of such orders would be a criminal offence which could result in imprisonment.

"We'd be able to use civil (orders), like anti-social behaviour orders, to say, 'If you step outside what we've precluded you from doing, if you for instance, use this particular banking network...then we can move you from the civil into the criminal law', and then we can use the normal criminal justice process, " he said.

Mr Blunkett said that the introduction of special terrorism trials with judges sitting alone without a jury was also being considered.

"I think there's a very strong case for translating what we have in the special immigrations appeals tribunal, that is the superior court of record, into the criminal justice system and there's widespread support for looking at that," he said.

But the home secretary added that any decision on legislation would have to wait until after the general election.

"It's not my intention to try and push a bill through this side of the general election whenever the prime minister calls it," he said.

Practical difficulties

Mr Blunkett said that he was also considering allowing wire tap evidence in criminal trials - a move previously opposed by the security services who feared that they could be forced to disclose secret operations in court.

The head of the planned new Serious and Organised Crime Agency, former MI5 chief Sir Stephen Lander, told the programme that he was an "enthusiast" for using wire-tap evidence in court but acknowledged there were practical difficulties.

"Wire taps are very important tool for law enforcement and for the ending of terrorism, but we've managed pretty well in this country over many years not using it in evidence," he said.

"The question on the table is whether we could be even more successful were we able to do so."

Next election

The BBC's Carole Walker said that Labour is putting security and personal safety at the heart of its programme for the run-up to the next election.

She said in the Queen's Speech legislation will be announced to set up a system of identity cards.

There will also be a new agency to tackle serious organised crime and yet more measures to crackdown on anti-social behaviour and binge drinking.
So, if you're suspected of terrorism, you'll be tried in secret by a single judge, with no jury as if it's an immigration case. And if you remember back a few months, in terror cases they don't even want to make you aware of the evidence against you before you step into the courtroom.

This current bunch of arrsewipes are driving us down a very precipitous road to totalitarianism. Or maybe I'm just paranoid? But, it's not paranoia if they really are out to get you... 8O
blessed baby cakes said:
I think we're getting to a bizarre combination of 1984 and Brave New World...
Terrifying that this clown is in charge of such important stuff.

'In order to save the village, it became necessary to destroy the village'

'In order to defend our freedoms, it became necessary to get rid of them.'



Kit Reviewer
Steamywindow said:
'In order to save the village, it became necessary to destroy the village'

'In order to defend our freedoms, it became necessary to get rid of them.'

Steamy, I'm sure that quote comes from Blind Pugh not Jesus, but I stand ready to be correted by Purple Flash or his colleagues.

[quote="Steamywindow"'In order to defend our freedoms, it became necessary to get rid of them.'[/quote]

It's already started....smoking, hunting, punishing your children when they deserve this. Joe Stalin lives. :cry:
The time to oppose these measures is now - before they happen.

It appears that Liabour are going to ape Dubya and fight on a security (ie fear) ticket. Opposing them on this ground does not work. Their biggest weakness is trust - ie the 45 minute claim, no WMDs etc. So this is where they should be attacked - "can you trust them to say we are safe?"
I see from today's papers that the Queen's Speech will include provision for ID cards. This is yet another of the frankly silly but deeply sinister moves Blair seems to want. (although you notice that, as so often, his name is not associated with a controversial measure).

compulsory ID cards mean that, for the first time, simply existing can become an offence against British law.

copper: hello Sir, may I see your papers please?

Steamywindow: I don't carry an ID card because they are silly and I don't want to.

copper: Oho! Well you will have to come to the station to be dealt with then. No ID card, tut tut, you might be a Terrorist.

Sw: But dammit, I'm the same bloke I was in 2004, with the same driving license and everything! Why bother?

copper: We have a mania for control, Sir, and thus happily spend billions on pointless beurocratic exercises which genuine criminals effortlessly skirt around.

Sw: Aaargh! You are all mad! Why didn't we stop this when we had a chance!

copper: Because you were too tied up with non-issues like foxhunting, immigration and Europe, busy arguing about Iraq and watching I'm a Celebrity. If you could just headbutt my baton please Sir, it will save me beating you up.

Sw: Bursts into tears.
No need to worry:

Officer: "Can I see your ID card?"

Bloke: "Certainly...ooh, look over there - someone in a red coat is chasing a poor little fox!"

Officer: tugs forelock "Thank you Sir" and sets off in indicated direction.
It's not so much ID cards I don't like it's the fact that this Labour dictatorship will use them to gather info to hunt down what they will class as undesirables....

In a few years time I could have Labourstapo police arresting me as it's come up on the Reichsfurher ID computer that I've bought Guns & Ammo and Bunghole Busters magazines
It's for our own good dontcha know :roll:

I sent Blumpkin a letter stating why I would be declining his "Kind offer" of an ID card.
His Dep't responded by thanking me for my support :? and outlining their plans to stop people from becoming "ID card martyrs"
All this on top of innocent people having their fingerprints & DNA recorded against their will.


Kit Reviewer
Steamywindow said:
Yes, yes, Cutaway. I shall now deploy my reserve.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :wink:
Attempts and conspiracies are already punishable inchoate crimes, whether consummated or not. There's no need to pass another statute to proscribe them.

So what is meant, under this proposed legislation, by "acts preparatory to terrorism?"

Buying groceries? (Can't do a proper terrorist's job on an empty stomach.)

Complaining about the government. (Could inspire the listener to commit terrorist acts against it.)

Reading disapproved books, magazines and internet websites?
Perhaps Blunktw@tt should look at getting his own House in order...

This story has been spun out by the conspiracy theorists to indicate a worldwide Masonic kiddyfiddling ring run for the benefit of the "great and the good." However, believable as it is that our Dear Leader would be involved in such activities, one would have to ask - why did the "New World Order" cops arrest the bloke in the first place?

The Sun
Crime Editor

A TOP aide to MPs at the House of Commons was yesterday charged with having child porn on his computer.

Senior clerk Phillip Lyon, who arranges the weekly Prime Minister’s Question Time for Tony Blair, was arrested after vice cops raided his Commons office.

Lyon, 37, is accused of making indecent images of children.

The dramatic raid followed a probe into an internet kiddie porn ring.

Stunned cops found the trail led straight to the heart of Government.

Detectives from the Metropolitan Police Clubs and Vice Obscene Publications and Internet Unit got a warrant to search the Palace of Westminster.

They seized Lyon’s computer. And five days later they raided his home in Basildon, Essex.

Lyon yesterday went to London’s Charing Cross police station on bail.

He was charged with ten specimen counts of making indecent images of children on his computer at work.

The charge carries a maximum sentence of ten years imprisonment. Lyon was bailed to appear at Bow Street Magistrates Court on September 10.

Police would have had to seek permission from Commons authorities, usually the Sarjeant At Arms, before they entered the House, as they have no formal jurisdiction there.

Lyon’s arrest in April followed a tip-off to the Met’s vice squad from National Crime Squad cops.

A source said: "Officers were shocked when they came across a suspect in the House of Commons.

"A computer, software disks and documents were seized for examination."

Lyon is a highly trusted senior clerk to the Commons select committees.

His main duties are arranging Question Time on Wednesday afternoons. He has daily contact with senior backbench MPs and sits in on private sessions of the select committees as they cross-examine witnesses.

Lyon has a pass to the Commons guaranteeing him full access to the building after being vetted.

A Commons source said: "He was a highly respected member of the civil staff who was implicitly trusted by colleagues and MPs.

"He was in a position of great responsibility. The allegations against him are shocking."

Meanwhile, in a separate operation a Scotland Yard computer analyst was yesterday charged with downloading indecent images of children.

Nigel Morris, 36, of Pinner, Middlesex, worked as an outside contractor on police computers for the firm SEMA.

Morris has been bailed to appear at Bow Street Magistrates on September 9.
Commons clerk held on child porn charges

Staff and agencies
Thursday November 21, 2002

A top aide to MPs at the House of Commons was today ordered to stand trial on a string of internet child porn charges.
Senior clerk Phillip Lyon, who arranges the weekly prime minister's question time for Tony Blair, faces 12 counts of making indecent images of children between October 10 2001 and April 17 this year.

The 37-year-old, who wore a navy blue single-breasted suit for a five-minute plea and directions hearing at London's Southwark crown court, stood with his hands clasped in front of him as he entered not guilty pleas to each allegation.

The charge carries a maximum sentence of 10 years imprisonment.

Judge James Wadsworth QC, told Mr Lyon, of Langdon Hill, Basildon, Essex, that his five-day trial would start on March 24 next year.

"Your bail is extended until then," he added.

Mr Lyon was arrested in April after a raid on his Commons office by detectives from the Metropolitan police clubs and vice obscene publications and internet unit.

His main duties are arranging question time on Wednesday afternoons. He has daily contact with senior backbench MPs and sits in on private sessions of the select committees as they cross-examine witnesses.
armourer said:
In a few years time I could have Labourstapo police arresting me as it's come up on the Reichsfurher ID computer that I've bought Guns & Ammo and Bunghole Busters magazines
I have no doubt that such is the plan as to anyone whose subscription habits show an unwholesome interest in weapons (or anything else of which the Reichsfuehrer disapproves).

Here's a link to a post, on an American forum, by one of your countrymen (perhaps ex-countryman, by now) recounting a raid on his home by police searching for items his possession of which was legal under UK law.

"Police Raided Me This Week" by "Balddog.";f=38;t=001262
I guess we will all be on their hit list for what they have already dreamed up already and are about to.

It looks like becoming the B-liars dictatorship, I give them a Churchillian salute and they will be defeated in the Ballot box next year :evil:
They say that when America sneezes, Britain catches a cold!

If we don't get the "camps" we'll certainly get the paranoia, although this story may possess a grain of truth as an "mass illegal alien contingency." Only thing is, it would take a fcukload of guards to guard them!

Never thought paranoia could be so much fun! :twisted:


There over 600 prison camps in the United States, all fully operational and ready to receive prisoners. They are all staffed and even surrounded by full-time guards, but they are all empty. These camps are to be operated by FEMA (Federal Emergency Management Agency) should Martial Law need to be implemented in the United States.

The Rex 84 Program was established on the reasoning that if a mass exodus of illegal aliens crossed the Mexican/US border, they would be quickly rounded up and detained in detention centers by FEMA. Rex 84 allowed many military bases to be closed down and to be turned into prisons.

Operation Cable Splicer and Garden Plot are the two sub programs which will be implemented once the Rex 84 program is initiated for its proper purpose. Garden Plot is the program to control the population. Cable Splicer is the program for an orderly takeover of the state and local governments by the federal government. FEMA is the executive arm of the coming police state and thus will head up all operations. The Presidential Executive Orders already listed on the Federal Register also are part of the legal framework for this operation.

The camps all have railroad facilities as well as roads leading to and from the detention facilities. Many also have an airport nearby. The majority of the camps can house a population of 20,000 prisoners. Currently, the largest of these facilities is just outside of Fairbanks, Alaska. The Alaskan facility is a massive mental health facility and can hold approximately 2 million people.

A person named Terry Kings wrote an article on his discoveries of camps
located in southern California. His findings are as follows:
Over the last couple months several of us have investigated three soon-to-be prison camps in the Southern California area. We had heard about these sites and wanted to see them for ourselves.

The first one we observed was in Palmdale, California. It is not operating as a prison at the moment but is masquerading as part of a water facility. Now why would there be a facility of this nature out in the middle of nowhere with absolutely no prisoners? The fences that run for miles around this large facility all point inward, and there are large mounds of dirt and dry moat surrounding the central area so the inside area is not visible from the road. There are 3 large loading docks facing the entrance that can be observed from the road. What are these massive docks going to be loading?

We observed white vans patrolling the area and one came out and greeted us with a friendly wave and followed us until we had driven safely beyond the area. What would have happened had we decided to enter the open gate or ask questions?

This facility is across the street from the Palmdale Water Department. The area around the Water Department has fences pointing outward, to keep people out of this dangerous area so as not to drown. Yet, across the street, the fences all point inward. Why? To keep people in? What people? Who are going to be it’s occupants?

There are also signs posted every 50 feet stating: State of California Trespassing Loitering Forbidden By Law Section 555 California Penal Code.

The sign at the entrance says: Pearblossom Operations and Maintenance Subcenter Receiving Department, 34534 116th Street East. There is also a guard shack located at the entrance.

We didn’t venture into this facility, but did circle around it to see if there was anything else visible from the road. We saw miles of fences with the top points all directed inward. There is a railroad track that runs next to the perimeter of this fenced area. The loading docks are large enough to hold railroad cars.

I wonder what they are planning for this facility? They could easily fit 100,000 people in this area. And who would the occupants be?

Another site is located in Brand Park in Glendale. There are newly constructed fences (all outfitted with new wiring that point inward). The fences surround a dry reservoir. There are also new buildings situated in the area. We questioned the idea that there were four armed military personnel walking the park. Since when does a public park need armed guards?

A third site visited was in the San Fernando Valley, adjacent to the Water District. Again, the area around the actual Water District had fences logically pointing out (to keep people out of the dangerous area). And the rest of the adjacent area which went on for several miles was ringed with fences and barbed wire facing inward (to keep what or who in?) Also, interesting was the fact that the addition to the tops of the fences were fairly new as to not even contain any sign of rust on them. Within the grounds was a huge building that the guard said was a training range for policemen. There were newly constructed roads, new gray military looking buildings, and a landing strip. For what? Police cars were constantly patrolling the several mile perimeter of the area.

From the parking lot of the Odyssey Restaurant a better view could be taken of the area that was hidden from site from the highway. There was an area that contained about 100 black boxes that looked like railroad cars. We had heard that loads of railroad cars have been manufactured in Oregon outfitted with shackles. Would these be of that nature? From our position it was hard to determine.

In searching the Internet, I have discovered that there are about 600 of these prison sites around the country (and more literally popping up overnight do they work all night). They are manned, but yet do not contain prisoners. Why do they need all these non-operating prisons? What are they waiting for? We continuously hear that our current prisons are overcrowded and they are releasing prisoners because of this situation. But what about all these facilities? What are they really for? Why are there armed guards yet no one to protect themselves against? And what is going to be the kick-off point to put these facilities into operation?

What would bring about a situation that would call into effect the need for these new prison facilities? A man-made or natural catastrophe? An earthquake, panic due to Y2K, a massive poisoning, a panic of such dimensions to cause nationwide panic?

Once a major disaster occurs (whether it is a real event or manufactured event does not matter) Martial Law is hurriedly put in place and we are all in the hands of the government agencies (FEMA) who thus portray themselves as our protectors. Yet what happens when we question those in authority and how they are taking away all of our freedoms? Will we be the ones detained in these camp sites? And who are they going to round up? Those with guns? Those who ask questions? Those that want to know what’s really going on? Does that include any of us? The seekers of truth?

When first coming across this information I was in a state of total denial. How could this be? I believed our country was free, and always felt a sense of comfort in knowing that as long as we didn’t hurt others in observing our freedom we were left to ourselves. Ideally we treated everyone with respect and honored their uniqueness and hoped that others did likewise.

It took an intensive year of searching into the hidden politics to discover that we are as free as we believe we are. If we are in denial, we don’t see the signs that are staring at us, but keep our minds turned off and busy with all the mundane affairs of daily life.

We just don’t care enough to find out the real truth, and settle for the hand-fed stories that come our way over the major media sources television, radio, newspaper, and magazines. But it’s too late to turn back to the days of blindfolds and hiding our heads in the sand because the reality is becoming very clear. The time is fast approaching when we will be the ones asking "What happened to our freedom? To our free speech? To our right to protect ourselves and our family? To think as an individual? To express ourselves in whatever way we wish?"

Once we challenge that freedom we find out how free we really are. How many are willing to take up that challenge? Very few indeed, otherwise we wouldn’t find ourselves in the situation that we are in at the present time. We wouldn’t have let things progress and get out of the hands of the public and into the hands of those that seek to keep us under their control no matter what it takes, and that includes the use of force and detainment for those that ask the wrong questions.

Will asking questions be outlawed next? Several instances have recently been reported where those that were asking questions that came too near the untold truth (the cover up) were removed from the press conferences and from the public’s ear. Also, those that wanted to speak to the press were detained and either imprisoned, locked in a psychiatric hospital, slaughtered (through make-believe suicides) or discredited.

Why are we all in denial over these possibilities? Didn’t we hear about prison camps in Germany, and even in the United States during World War II? Japanese individuals were rounded up and placed in determent camps during the duration of the War. Where was their freedom?

You don’t think it could happen to you? Obviously those rounded up and killed didn’t think it could happen to them either. How could decent people have witnessed such atrocities and still said nothing? Are we going to do the same here as they cart off one by one those individuals who are taking a stand for the rights of the citizens as they expose the truth happening behind the scenes? Are we all going to sit there and wonder what happened to this country of ours? Where did we go wrong? How could we let it happen?

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