Blanket pardon of "deserters" in WW 1.

#1
Just curious, they're having a kickaround of this subject on the Matleots page but I cannot find a thread on ours. I think it's a seriously overdue subject but I cannot see how a basically "Army orientated" (hell, we pulled the triggers) subject could be missed by us. My decision is YES (no discussion there!). Why not, it will some give families a sense of closure.
 
#2
Well, although I agree with you I want hold my breath.

Especially if that short little fat man farrah hockley has his dick in the pie.

Quote.

We cannot and should not pardon soldiers shot for desertion during WW1 or WW2.

Even If it is proven they were ill ie. shellshock, ptsd.

It would send the wrong signal to the troops.

End quote.

If a recently retired general is incapable or even worse does not give a fcuk of understanding the effects of ptsd etc its not surprising the MOD have the same attitude??????????
 
#3
Link to this story?
 
#4
oldgoat said:
Well, although I agree with you I want hold my breath.

Especially if that short little fat man farrah hockley has his dick in the pie.

Quote.

We cannot and should not pardon soldiers shot for desertion during WW1 or WW2.

Even If it is proven they were ill ie. shellshock, ptsd.

It would send the wrong signal to the troops.

End quote.

If a recently retired general is incapable or even worse does not give a fcuk of understanding the effects of ptsd etc its not surprising the MOD have the same attitude??????????
Today's soldiers will never face the death penalty so his argument is void. There should be a review of evidence and the sick should be pardoned.
 
#5
A recent court case where the family of a soldier executed for desertion, although medical documents show his condition as we now know PTSD, wanted him pardoned and was upheld.

Farrar-Hockley was intervied by the reporter after the case outside the court (I believe).

I shall go to the bbc and itv but I wont hold my breath.
 
#6
When other WWI soldiers were pardoned I wondered if a pardon meant that the soldiers had been forgiven their crime or that they had in fact committed no crime.

I still haven't worked out the answer.
 
#7
Wah.
Those executed in WW1 were pardoned en-masse in 2006.
Anthony Farrar-Hockley died in 2006.
 
#13
As I remember one of the arguments between historians at the time of the pardon, was that within those who were executed were some genuine bad boys who had committed what were at the time capital crimes, (rape, murder, etc), but for whatever reason were tried in a millitary rather than a civil court.

By failing to acknowledge that fact, a general pardon was morally suspect. I am sorry but I cannot now find any of these discussions on the inter-web

The MOD said that it could not revisit all the trial transcripts, so the general pardon was granted to all the executed men Almost a case of 'God will know his own', in reverse'.

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/world_war_one_executions.htm
 
#14
Onetap said:
Wah.
Those executed in WW1 were pardoned en-masse in 2006.
Anthony Farrar-Hockley died in 2006.
my bold.

Actually his father tony died in 2006.

Tony had two sons, one become a general.

If you read your second link to the last sentence all will be revealed.

edited to add.

He Dair was around bielefeld and the big building during the 80's and 90's.

surprised some of you missed him?????????????????????????????
 
#15
Markintime said:
oldgoat said:
Well, although I agree with you I want hold my breath.

Especially if that short little fat man farrah hockley has his dick in the pie.

Quote.

We cannot and should not pardon soldiers shot for desertion during WW1 or WW2.

Even If it is proven they were ill ie. shellshock, ptsd.

It would send the wrong signal to the troops.

End quote.

If a recently retired general is incapable or even worse does not give a fcuk of understanding the effects of ptsd etc its not surprising the MOD have the same attitude??????????
Today's soldiers will never face the death penalty so his argument is void. There should be a review of evidence and the sick should be pardoned.
You miss the point, this man was a serving general in HM Forces until 200?.

With that attitude "and the man in charge" how do you think the MOD and recognition of ptsd did not exist until this baboon retired????????????????????????
 
#16
YoungDai said:
As I remember one of the arguments between historians at the time of the pardon, was that within those who were executed were some genuine bad boys who had committed what were at the time capital crimes, (rape, murder, etc), but for whatever reason were tried in a millitary rather than a civil court.

By failing to acknowledge that fact, a general pardon was morally suspect. I am sorry but I cannot now find any of these discussions on the inter-web

The MOD said that it could not revisit all the trial transcripts, so the general pardon was granted to all the executed men Almost a case of 'God will know his own', in reverse'.

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/world_war_one_executions.htm
Thats why a lot of family members are angry.

Some cases have only the death sentence as a document.

Some cases where an officer above the rank of captain was charged appear to have dissapeared.

http://www.janpieterchielens.be/shotatdawn/page10.html
 
#17
To a blanket pardon?No.

There were some genuine cases of repeat offenders in which the sentence was just.I think a blanket pardon to appease the popular myth is wrong.
 
#18
Cpt_Darling said:
To a blanket pardon?No.

There were some genuine cases of repeat offenders in which the sentence was just.I think a blanket pardon to appease the popular myth is wrong.
And therein lies the problem.

Due to the stupidity and arrogance of the military at the time we will never know the truth.

And therefore, due to such incompetence ALL should be pardoned.

OR we should therefore in hinsight give every one of the dead the open day of a coroner. Espeshally the one who has a bad taste when it involves the MOD.

OR

the next stage would be Trial by unlaufull execution.

as used by the allies to bring to justice the concentration camp guards.

OR

shall i carry on???????????????

THOSE THAT THROW STONES AND LIVE IN GLASS HOUSES..

http://www.janpieterchielens.be/shotatdawn/page10.html
 
#19
Applying today's values and standards to a different era which was facing challenges and difficulties we cannot even imagine.

Lest we forget - many thousands of very scared and traumatised soldiers layed down their lives day after day after day for 4 years so we could be free.

It achieves nothing in itself, but does just encourage a sort of victim culture where everyone deserves an official apology for something in the past. End of heavy industry, closure of the mines, child labour, Bevin boys, conscription, the potato famine, deportation of criminals, colonial aggression, slavery, victimisation of catholics, burning of witches. When do we stop apologising and re-writing history.
 
#20
Herrumph said:
Applying today's values and standards to a different era which was facing challenges and difficulties we cannot even imagine.

Lest we forget - many thousands of very scared and traumatised soldiers layed down their lives day after day after day for 4 years so we could be free.

It achieves nothing in itself, but does just encourage a sort of victim culture where everyone deserves an official apology for something in the past. End of heavy industry, closure of the mines, child labour, Bevin boys, conscription, the potato famine, deportation of criminals, colonial aggression, slavery, victimisation of catholics, burning of witches. When do we stop apologising and re-writing history.
I am not insinuating we " those that should now better" take the moral high ground against a mentalitity that "WE" could not comprehend unless we were in the trenches.

I still havent found the tv report and probable never will, but my point is that a serving general during Gulf war 1 and 2 was of the opinion that NO-ONE regardless of circumstances should be pardoned for "cowardice" in WW1 or WW2.

unless of course he was an officer above the rank of ???

http://www.janpieterchielens.be/shotatdawn/page10.html

I am not attempting to smeer officers with this or previous posts.

Now that the truth is starting to appear its not surprising the families of the sons/ fathers etc EXECUTED BY FIREING SQUAD simply because they where ill want closure and an apology. And if anyone does not understand then go and fcuk yourself, forever.
 
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