Big Charlie (HMS PoW) Breaks Down

[cernunnos]

First time I’ve heard of UK trialling the Mojave drone for resupply.

Wouldn’t a wider lifting type body be better for payload and endurance rather than what looks like a Predator type?

They do have range and payload in hard points, probably smaller for ship space, but I can help think storage will be different shape to what’s usually shipped to fit in some underwing pods?

Suppose you could attach missiles to it for transport instead of launch, or is the idea to work out if it’s a useful Capability and build on that?

Something like this?

 

[TamH70]

Something like this?

That's actually flyable. Given enough thrust from the engines and slightly bigger wings to add control surfaces to the lifting body formed by the hull.

 

[Yokel]

Back to reality...

Will the WESTLANT deployment include more trials of helicopters doing rolling landings, as mentioned here?

And running landings – rolling to a stop on the deck rather than dropping down vertically – will provide a very effective profile for heavy, limited-power recoveries in low winds and taxi and castor data will allow the helicopter to reposition safely on deck upon landing.

Lieutenant Commander Tom Lofthouse, the detachment commander for the trials – and also the last person to land on Albion’s deck in a Commando Sea King - hailed the trials as “a game-changer for amphibious operations in constrained waters such as the Norwegian Fjords. We are delighted to be able to increase the capability of the Commando Helicopter Force and to support the growth of Littoral Readiness Groups by enabling more Royal Marines to fly further.”

As well as impacting future Merlin helicopter operations from Albion or her sister HMS Bulwark, the data from the trials is being pored over by experts to see whether the lessons learned can be transferred to other ships – and the submarine-hunting version of the Merlin, the Mk2 – to increase its range and lifting power too...

 

[Yokel]

The first of class HMS Queen Elizabeth is also preparing for deployment. There was a picture this morning of her lift chains being worked on, which was very odd considering the media seemed to insist that she had the ones from Prince of Wales.

Having any of the media admitted that they got it completely wrong?

 

[Yokel]

HMS Prince of Wales is now in Mayport.

Naval Station Mayport welcomes British aircraft carrier HMS Prince of Wales - News4Jax

NAVAL STATION MAYPORT, Fla. – More than 900 sailors assigned to the British aircraft carrier HMS Prince of Wales arrived at Naval Station Mayport Wednesday morning. This is the ship’s first visit to Naval Station Mayport and it’s expected to be in port five days...

Still no admission from the media that they got things wrong.

 

[Yokel]

Now on the RN website:

Uncle Sam meets the Prince of Wales as carrier debuts Stateside

Britain’s biggest warship has arrived in the USA ready to begin an autumn of trials pushing the boundaries of 21st Century carrier operations.

HMS Prince of Wales sailed into the US Navy base at Mayport in Florida ready to embark the equipment, supplies and stores vital to supporting F-35 Lightning operations for the first stage of three trial periods involving crewed and uncrewed aircraft.

When she departs the base, US Lightnings will join the carrier for a series of exhaustive trials to push the operating limits of the stealth fighter/Queen Elizabeth-class combination, increasing the carriers’ punch and ability to carry out strike missions in ever-harsher weather conditions.

The British carrier left UK waters earlier this month after drone trials off Cornwall. The ship’s company have used the ten-day passage to train and hone skills, particularly on the flight deck: firefighting/crash exercises, moving Merlin and Wildcat helicopters around, refuelling etc, as well as sea boat ops, quick draw self-defence exercises and more...

The duty rectal orifice Lewis Page was moaning in one of the papers about 'jet less carriers' yesterday.

 

[Yokel]

HMS Prince of Wales' long-awaited F-35 trials begin off US east coast - Forces Net

HMS Prince of Wales' much-anticipated F-35B flight trials have begun off the east coast of the US.

The Royal Navy is working to expand the operating limits of the jet, to develop advanced takeoff and landing techniques, allowing the aircraft to launch with more weapons.

An American test pilot from Naval Air Warfare Center Aircraft Division (NAWCAD) Air Test and Evaluation Squadron Two Three (VX-23) flew to the UK's newest aircraft carrier, which left from Norfolk Naval Station, Virginia, on Tuesday...

SRVL trials going ahead a year later than planned.

 

[Yokel]

The RN website has a basic explanation of Shipborne Rolling Vertical Landing:

HMS Prince of Wales will chase bad weather and heavy seas while the jets themselves will take-off and land with various weapons and fuel loads, experiment returning from ‘missions’ still carrying missiles/bombs – rather than ditching them in the ocean – and practise landing by rolling to a stop on the flight deck rather than touching down vertically.

From: F-35s join HMS Prince of Wales for key fast-jet trials - Royal Navy

Note also the last paragraph:

The trials come as both of the UK’s carriers are at sea with UK flagship HMS Queen Elizabeth operating in northern European waters and due to visit Sweden this weekend before resuming her autumn deployment working with NATO and Joint Expeditionary Force allies.

 

[Yokel]

Just for completeness:

F-35 in rolling vertical landing on HMS Prince of Wales - UK Defence Journal

HMS Prince of Wales, currently conducting trials off the American coast, has witnessed its first Shipborne Rolling Vertical Landing.

The Shipborne Rolling Vertical Landing (SRVL) is a British endeavour—a capability at least a decade in the making—that will allow pilots to return to ship with more stores on the aircraft after a mission.

It is a process designed to land jump-jet aircraft that uses both the vertical thrust from the jet engine and lift from the wings, thus maximising the payload an aircraft can return with and stopping the financial waste that comes with dropping expensive weaponry in the sea in order to land vertically.

 

[Channel Hopper]

That's actually flyable. Given enough thrust from the engines and slightly bigger wings to add control surfaces to the lifting body formed by the hull.

Nah, it flies as is.

 

[Yokel]

I think I have already shared my views on the hit and miss nature of the RN/MOD PR people. Why did the RN website not report the SRVL trials, given their pioneering nature and the amount of technology that has gone into enabling SRVL? The RN website did report trials of launching a fully laden F-35B using the full length of the deck and of course the ship moving at maximum speed.

HMS Prince of Wales’ fully-laden F-35 paves way for future carrier strike ops - Royal Navy

Maximum speed (all engines and both shafts and propellers working as designed) is needed to provide wind over the deck for both these operations.

 

[bob231]

I think I have already shared my views on the hit and miss nature of the RN/MOD PR people. Why did the RN website not report the SRVL trials, given their pioneering nature and the amount of technology that has gone into enabling SRVL? The RN website did report trials of launching a fully laden F-35B using the full length of the deck and of course the ship moving at maximum speed.

HMS Prince of Wales’ fully-laden F-35 paves way for future carrier strike ops - Royal Navy

Maximum speed (all engines and both shafts and propellers working as designed) is needed to provide wind over the deck for both these operations.

Two thoughts, @Yokel:

- Press releases tend to be written by the Ship. If the Ship herself didn't see this as important - or Cdr WE was just too plain busy - it could have easily got overlooked. We still treat PR as a second hat for the WEs, which contributes to its paucity.
- Wind over deck is a combination of Ship's speed and local met. It may have needed full power in these circumstances but that isn't a nailed-on requirement.

 

[Yokel]

Two thoughts, @Yokel:

- Press releases tend to be written by the Ship. If the Ship herself didn't see this as important - or Cdr WE was just too plain busy - it could have easily got overlooked. We still treat PR as a second hat for the WEs, which contributes to its paucity.
- Wind over deck is a combination of Ship's speed and local met. It may have needed full power in these circumstances but that isn't a nailed-on requirement.

With reference to your first point; the 13 October news article from the RN website (which I quoted) did say:

HMS Prince of Wales will chase bad weather and heavy seas while the jets themselves will take-off and land with various weapons and fuel loads, experiment returning from ‘missions’ still carrying missiles/bombs – rather than ditching them in the ocean – and practise landing by rolling to a stop on the flight deck rather than touching down vertically.

Perhaps I am turning into Victor Meldrew?

As for your second point I am thinking of the writings of various WAFUs such as Nick Richardson, who talked about the engines going to maximum for Sea Harrier launch and recovery.

 

[Not a Boffin]

As for your second point I am thinking of the writings of various WAFUs such as Nick Richardson, who talked about the engines going to maximum for Sea Harrier launch and recovery.

Bob is correct.

Context is everything. That reference is highly likely to refer to operations in the Adriatic in very limited "boxes", where repositioning in designated time slots was key. Going to max chat when you've already got 25 kts of wind down the deck is likely to result in people being unable to stand up and hence unable to operate.

 

[alfred_the_great]

The SHOL for the SHAR was tiny (R10-20, 15-25 wind over deck) IIRC.