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Benefit payments to exceed income tax receipts

#1
Torygraph

In 2009/10, the Treasury is expecting to take in £140.5 billion in gross income tax receipts. Social security benefits are projected to be £164.7 billion.

The disparity between tax revenue and welfare costs was identified by Andrew Brough, a fund manager at Schroder Investment Management, who suggested that the amount of money spent on social protection could soon exceed that raised from both income tax and national insurance.
Would have helped if the story had also given details of receipts from corporation tax, VAT, etc. However, the basic message remains scary, and makes you wonder about the future of the country.
 
#2
The future? I don't wonder at all. Unless we see serious and meaningful change on a vast scale there is no future for this country. Brown has sepnt money at such a rate he ran out and has been borrowing it on the never never to continue the spending spree.

We really have hit the game over point, just nobody seem to be prepared to do something about stopping the cnut. You only have to listen to his latest climate change bottomless pit fund plan to realise we are fooked. I kid you not, the game is up. The coffers are way past empty but the spending is still out of control.

Oh and Ashie, don't bother responding you clueless cnut.
 
#3
[quote="Pork_Pie] and makes you wonder about the future of the country.[/quote]

And makes you wonder about the future of benefits.

Which many ex-servicemen (like myself) depend upon.
 
#4
I still think that the answer is to turn able bodied benefit claimers into a manual labour force. Get them out the door and get them providing something for society. They will either work hard for dole money or find jobs elsewhere.
 
#5
Closet_Jibber said:
I still think that the answer is to turn able bodied benefit claimers into a manual labour force. Get them out the door and get them providing something for society. They will either work hard for dole money or find jobs elsewhere.
Exactly. Why is unemployment benefit seen as a 'free good'? Work for it - it will prevent you from becoming idle and feckless, provide a sense of self-worth, maintain a track-record of 'get up and go', will benefit the country and, if you are really idle and feckless, it gives natural selection the opportunity to thin out the gene pool.
 
#6
Closet_Jibber said:
I still think that the answer is to turn able bodied benefit claimers into a manual labour force. Get them out the door and get them providing something for society. They will either work hard for dole money or find jobs elsewhere.
That has been suggested many time here on Arrse (including by myself)
The simple fact is that the country is now so far down the financial toilet the treasury is effectively already printing money to keep up its commitments.
Its political suicide for whoever does it but the benefits system has to be reduced in cost, dramatically.
The harsh fact is that us poor overburdened taxpayers are going to be paying for this mess for at least a decade. Has Mr Brown considered what happens when we all decide enough is enough and emmigrate?
I for one am tired of paying through the nose for lazy, workshy cnuts to sit infront of widescreen tellies all day (and thats just the thieving bastard politicians)
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#7
Work for food tokens & rent payment or starve in the street with your offspring.
 
#8
Fifth_Columnist said:
Closet_Jibber said:
I still think that the answer is to turn able bodied benefit claimers into a manual labour force. Get them out the door and get them providing something for society. They will either work hard for dole money or find jobs elsewhere.
Exactly. Why is unemployment benefit seen as a 'free good'? Work for it - it will prevent you from becoming idle and feckless, provide a sense of self-worth, maintain a track-record of 'get up and go', will benefit the country and, if you are really idle and feckless, it gives natural selection the opportunity to thin out the gene pool.
What track record? :?

Most of the worthless scum haven't got clue what work is, those that do know, get up in the mornings and try chasing non existant jobs. (Non existant to Joe public that is.) They were there but are filled from within or off the "old boy/rolled up trouser leg" network, they are only advertised to comply with the law.
 
#9
Biscuits_AB said:
Work for food tokens & rent payment or starve in the street with your offspring.
I did hear an idea recently that dole should be paid in the form of a cheque addressed to your housing provider and the rest should be food tokens. No actual Cash given.

I wonder how well this would be recieved. Not by the Dole Collecter but by the tax payer who is funding it.

As has been mention any Massive review of the benefit system will have to be done by the next government as firstly, the current government don't give a sh1t about anything but their own survival and secondly a chop of benefits would be political suicide (Which when you review the first point explains why labour won't do it).
 
#10
Closet_Jibber said:
Biscuits_AB said:
Work for food tokens & rent payment or starve in the street with your offspring.
I did hear an idea recently that dole should be paid in the form of a cheque addressed to your housing provider and the rest should be food tokens. No actual Cash given.

I wonder how well this would be recieved. Not by the Dole Collecter but by the tax payer who is funding it.

As has been mention any Massive review of the benefit system will have to be done by the next government as firstly, the current government don't give a sh1t about anything but their own survival and secondly a chop of benefits would be political suicide (Which when you review the first point explains why labour won't do it).
In order to reduce the cost of welfare, I doubt the actual "dole" needs to be reduced. Just make people work for it. When benefits living is no longer an easy option, loads of them will find regular work.

OTOH. Not everyone on benefits is a scrounger. Some are genuinely trapped. Therefore another winner would be to make it impossible to be worse off working than just claiming.

The whole benefits system is up shiz creek.
1. Some people make it a lifestyle choice.
2. Some people are trapped by being financialy penalised if they return to work.
 
#11
"those that do know, get up in the mornings and try chasing non existant jobs. (Non existant to Joe public that is.) They were there but are filled from within or off the "old boy/rolled up trouser leg" network, they are only advertised to comply with the law"

Much truth spoken there I think.

My son wants work experience- it is an educational requirement but the school system tells him to find it- and like most of his class has ended up shadowing his parent because very few businesses are interested

My friends children, 18 and 21 have written a sackload of applications for career jobs and not received a single reply- both have good education/good references from previous part time work

A 60 year old made redundant not had a reply to the 50 applications he's made for advertised jobs.

Benefits are needed but how can you split short term need from lifelong sponging?
 
#12
archer said:
Benefits are needed but how can you split short term need from lifelong sponging?
Quite simply, you dont. You make being on benefits "essential items only".

Supply vouchers that are redeemable for food/Utilities/rent or mortgage bills.

Vouchers contain the Name and Address of the person, and must be backed up by photo ID (Driving License/Passport) or a Utilities bill with the persons name and Address.

If you want to buy fags/booze - get a job.

This means that whilst you can live off benefits, you wont be able to buy any luxury items and there will be a clear incentive to get off your ass and find a job.
 
#13
Our country works off a system where the Rich are rich because the poor are kept happy by the rich. Unfortunately us lot in the middle pay both of their wages.
 
#14
Majorpain said:
archer said:
Benefits are needed but how can you split short term need from lifelong sponging?
Quite simply, you dont. You make being on benefits "essential items only".

Supply vouchers that are redeemable for food/Utilities/rent or mortgage bills.
Vouchers contain the Name and Address of the person, and must be backed up by photo ID (Driving License/Passport) or a Utilities bill with the persons name and Address.
If you want to buy fags/booze - get a job.
This means that whilst you can live off benefits, you wont be able to buy any luxury items and there will be a clear incentive to get off your ass and find a job.
I completely agree, perhaps I phrased it badly and should have asked,

How can you make it work?
 
#15
Majorpain said:
archer said:
Benefits are needed but how can you split short term need from lifelong sponging?
Quite simply, you dont. You make being on benefits "essential items only".

Supply vouchers that are redeemable for food/Utilities/rent or mortgage bills.

Vouchers contain the Name and Address of the person, and must be backed up by photo ID (Driving License/Passport) or a Utilities bill with the persons name and Address.

If you want to buy fags/booze - get a job.

This means that whilst you can live off benefits, you wont be able to buy any luxury items and there will be a clear incentive to get off your ass and find a job.
Which would, of course, require derogation from Human Rights legislation because making people use vouchers is considered 'humiliating'.
 
#16
Pork_Pie said:
makes you wonder about the future of the country.
The future is:-

1 Massive cuts

2 Tax rises

3 Mass unemployment

4 Civil unrest

For those of us who are of an age to remember, it'll be a rerun of the early 80s when Maggie inherited the last Labour government's economic miracle.

The only ray of hope penetrating into the smouldering bomb crater that is our economy is that there's plenty of fat to cut in government expenditure.

It's reckoned that 2 million of those on incapacity benefit don't need to be there (remember our own dear Sven - too sick to work but able to run an election campaign every year).

With one third of the population living off welfare, there will need to be drastic changes. It is an obscenity that people earning £50,000 per year can still get tax credits. Some sort of workfare scheme will be necessary to get the claimant count down in a reasonable time. And ffs stop paying chavettes to have babies they can't afford.

Unfortunately, Dave has ring fenced the health budget. I, for one, would like to see my local hospital stop employing faith healers that 'treat' cancer patients by waving magic crystals over them. The diversity manager on £95,000 per year can sod off too. He can take the free copies of Gay News the hospital hands out to patients with him.

There needs to a swathe cut through qangos, including the BBC. £17 million for Jonathon Ross? Bugger that, get Parkinson out of retirement! The Potato Council (sponsors of National Chip Week with Keith Chegwin) needs to go to the same place Maggie sent the Metrication Board in 1979.

In summary - the future is bright. But probably not for quite some time.
 
#17
A_M - Unfortunately your wisdom is not shared by politicians who forget the lessons learned by our parents.

"If you forget where you have been, how do you know you're not walking in circles?" C_J's History Teacher!
 
#18
Benefits keep the poverty line higher (if they have sky, plasma TV's smoke and drink they aint poor). With the demise of the council estate (putting them into private landlords) again makes it appear we have little poverty.

Its a thin veneer and I reckon we could soon see the return of the lower classes as the benefits and pensions bubble bursts.

Hard times ahead, best get my kids a shoe shine box and a stool.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#19
Majorpain said:
archer said:
Benefits are needed but how can you split short term need from lifelong sponging?
Quite simply, you dont. You make being on benefits "essential items only".

Supply vouchers that are redeemable for food/Utilities/rent or mortgage bills.

Vouchers contain the Name and Address of the person, and must be backed up by photo ID (Driving License/Passport) or a Utilities bill with the persons name and Address.

If you want to buy fags/booze - get a job.

This means that whilst you can live off benefits, you wont be able to buy any luxury items and there will be a clear incentive to get off your ass and find a job.
And you watch the line of 'addicts' suddenly find their way to ECHR. The problem is, it's not those who have found themselves out of work for reasons beyond their control who will make an issue of it (although they will be the hardest done by), it's those who have chosen to make a lifestyle out of benefits who will be the first to find another scam where the tax payer has to stump up. Society is riddled with them and they are bleeding us dry. Not only that, they are anti-social and believe that as they are at the bottom of the pile, they are therefore untouchable. The logic being that they can't drop down any further. These are the people who need to be hit the hardest and they need hitting. They are a drain on society, yet will be the first to shout about 'Johnnie Foreigner' taking British jobs/housing/etc, etc. Their offspring (the second generation of which are now nearing their 30's), know nothing beyond take, take, take, 'because we know our rights' and you have to give, give, give. Successive generations will be no better. There needs to be a strong, decisive action taken or what's left of our social welfare system will be disappear and it will be the fault of those who have never contributed towards it, never held any intention of doing so, or simply, having grown up within that culture, never knew that they should have.

But they will be with us for another generation as no British Government has the courage or indeed, given the scams practiced by themselves, the morality to stamp it out. No politician today would risk his 'career' to speak up for the welfare of future generations being frittered away by scum. The money has to come from somewhere. It's not coming from those who are currently abusing the system and who will continue to do so until the day that their 60 a day habits and failing livers kill them off (after 10's of £k's worth of NHS money trying to keep them alive has been wasted).

These people don't give a sh*t. In fact, on more than one occasion now, I've watched some of their number on TV who have, when challenged by interviewers, blatantly stated that they have no intention of working and then mockingly thanking us for their dole money.

Nothing will happen though. We'll keep paying ever increasing taxes, and they'll keep taking and breeding, until one day when having paid taxes all of your life, you'll find that you'll have to sell some of your property for that operation you need, unless of course you've been smart enough to put some aside over the years.

Take the money out of their hands. Give them food stamps/clothing stamps and remove from the system, anything which could be used to provide for SKY TV, fags, booze or any other uxury, that those working for the minimum wage cannot afford. A benefits lifestyle should not be seen as the more attractive between the two.
 
#20
Disco you raise an issue which is my biggest worry. Are all us tax payers going to work our arrses off for the next 30 years only to find that the ever increasing sponging society can no longer afford to pay our pensions?

We need to live in a society where if you are able bodied there is no reason why you shouldn't be providing something. Even if you spend your days picking weeds out between pavement slabs.
 

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