Bayonet in 'modern' warfare

#41
i got issued a bayonet with l85 at mobilization centre in 2000 and 2001. Think it stayed in armoury for 6 months when deployed. never bothered adding it to webbing!! Has any infantry ever used the wire cutter on theirs????? STAB armourer.
 
#42
I believe bayonets are regularly fixed in the green zones of afgan due to closeness of engagements and the fact u cant apparantly see more than 5 foot infront of u
Strange IMHO that the Septics are choosing to dispense with an extremely cheap and effective weapon (both psychologically and practically).

I believe that they are still issuing Tomahawk axes to Rangers, who I'm know have reported at least one close quarter kill with one. Reminiscent of removing all guns off fighter aircraft because "aerial warfare has moved on", wasn't long before they were screwing guns back onto aircraft and I get the impression it'll be the same in this case:)
 
#43
I remember inspecting many bayonets whilst in kosovo 2000 and 2001. i understand it was a bit different to iraq n afgan, but if we had 250 l85 on books then there was always 250 bayonets in box in corner of iso container!! Never ever came across one that was damaged cos always used tin openers instead!!
 
#44
Strange IMHO that the Septics are choosing to dispense with an extremely cheap and effective weapon (both psychologically and practically).

I believe that they are still issuing Tomahawk axes to Rangers, who I'm know have reported at least one close quarter kill with one. Reminiscent of removing all guns off fighter aircraft because "aerial warfare has moved on", wasn't long before they were screwing guns back onto aircraft and I get the impression it'll be the same in this case:)
Ranger that Mother f@cker! everything can be killed with a tomahawk! YouTube - Ranger School Promo 2
What about special forces ?
 
#45
Wasn't there a scene on Ross Kemp in Afghanistan 2, where the Jocks were ordered to fix bayonets? Mainly because they knew that Terry was near but not where or how close.

Bayonet, a fighting knife, a tool (if designed and developed correctly) and a fearsome addition to the pointey end of a rifle. And in CQB, if you run out of rounds and the enemy is close enough why not. Likewise if ammo is running low, the bayonet doesn't need batteries or any form of consumables.





BBC NEWS | UK | Military cross for bayonet charge
British Officer ran low on ammo, opted for the bayonet charge (not sure when but awarded medal in Sept 2009).

Hero Soldier Who Led Bayonet Charge Against Taleban Wins Bravery Award - UK's #1 Community: Navy, Marines, Army, RAF
45 Cdo Marine who led a bayonet charge in Afghan (medal in Dec 2009).

Seems like the bayonet is far from dead.
 
#46
Combatives would be very effective. Having been privilaged enough to take part with some bits involving it, i can swear by its effectiveness. I mean, being hit in the face over and over again is enough to take your eye off the prize.
Point taken, but I mean, being bayonetted in the face over and over again is enough to really take your eye off the prize.
 
M

Mark The Convict

Guest
#47
Especially if you've just been bayoneted in the eyes!

Serious head on. I've read an account by an Australian WW2 veteran who, before setting off for whichever theatre (can't remember the details) was told by his WW1 veteran father/uncle to aim only for the neck when using the bayonet.

The reasons were that it can be attacked from all sides, contains windpipe, spine and arteries, won't trap the blade when he collapses (unlike the ribs) and the enemy will instinctively try to protect it.
 
#48
The reasons were that it can be attacked from all sides, contains windpipe, spine and arteries, won't trap the blade when he collapses (unlike the ribs) and the enemy will instinctively try to protect it.
Is this to counter them firing at you, if they are nails and got it in the ribs? But the neck almost eliminates this occuring?
 
M

Mark The Convict

Guest
#49
I think (!) the reason was that the WW1 teaching meant that blokes were attacked themselves when their bayonets got stuck. Much less likely to happen with the neck.
 
#50
Yeah, it makes sense really, obviously the neck is the most effictive fatality zone if you would, albeit not a vast area to hit in the heat of a firefight, but if you were trained well enough to swipe around there, like you said there is such a small chance of being held up for more than a second or two, before slaying someone else and getting a VC.
 
#54
The reasons were that it can be attacked from all sides, contains windpipe, spine and arteries, won't trap the blade when he collapses (unlike the ribs) and the enemy will instinctively try to protect it.
Surely the fact that the enemy will try and protect it would be a good reason not to go for it? Bayonetting someone in the arm - whilst certainly inconvenient - isn't going to kill someone, whereas a bayonet in the chest is really going to cause the enemy problems. Not to mention the fact that it's a much smaller target - it's a little like the arguments for shooting at the centre mass rather than going for a head shot.
 
M

Mark The Convict

Guest
#55
Quite so; I suppose that while he's trying to protect himself, he's not trying to kill you. I imagine troops are taught to target the torso because it's bigger. You wouldn't want to miss with your first thrust, either way.
 
#56
he postings about the action last Friday involving the Argylls and the PWRR; has this knocked on the head the old chestnut that the bayonet is outdated on the 'modern' battlefield (ironic, as I recall reading that it was heavily used in th
Spooky, perhaps he's been bayoneted...
 
#57
Surely the fact that the enemy will try and protect it would be a good reason not to go for it? Bayonetting someone in the arm - whilst certainly inconvenient - isn't going to kill someone, whereas a bayonet in the chest is really going to cause the enemy problems. Not to mention the fact that it's a much smaller target - it's a little like the arguments for shooting at the centre mass rather than going for a head shot.
Exactly wot i was taught, aim for chest. Bigger target than going for groin or neck.
 

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