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BATUS TDS Staff are being completely ripped off by the Army. Out of pocket by £3500!

#1
BLUF: The Army are refusing to pay single BATUS TDS staff LSA, despite it clearly saying so in their posting orders. This sees the average TDS out of pocket by over £500 per month.

I like many others have found myself involuntarily trawled for a TDS posting to BATUS. The only 'sweetener' my parent unit could give me for the impending 7 months of misery was: "Don't worry, you'll get paid more than you do on tour - won't that be great". As if they are doing ME a favor, cheers.

I finally receive my posting order late, as usual, and I note that at the bottom, under remarks it says the following:

"Paras (not the maroon type) that refer to this Assignment Order are: PARA'S 1, 2, 3, 12, 168, 187 and 193"

I then follow the link and print out the corresponding PARA numbers. PARA 193 says this:

193 - ASSIGNMENT ORDER SPECIAL INSTRUCTIONS - BATUS APC ASSIGNED TDS



· Allowances - this is a INVOLSEP tour of duty. APC Assigned TDS will receive Single/MU rates of LOA and LSA at the appropriate rate. The Single Living Accommodation (SLA) rate of Disturbance Allowance (DA) is admissible for TDS in this way.


Now I'm no rocket scientist, but that is pretty clear cut to me - WE SHOULD GET LSA. Apparently the head shed over here are trying to 'fight our corner', but say its pretty unlikely that we will get it.

If the Army have changed their policy on this then it should be enforced NEXT year, and not on those who were 'convinced' to volunteer by the extra pay. Especially as our parent units AND Glasgow told us we would get LSA and we weren't told until 1st June! (Having started working for BATUS in April). Equally as frustrating is that married TDS are earning LSA, so there're getting paid a lot more than us for doing the same job!

The whole thing feels wrong, I mean the Army preaches values and standards, and tests people accordingly - I'd say they have failed their own test.

If anyone out there can give us some guidance on where to go/what to do next, we would be really grateful.

The affronted.
 
#6
Ah, the BATUS LSA/LOA train rumbles on. This should be in the calendar like Christmas or Easter....Sometime aorund Jun and the staff in BATUS will interpret some rule differently and someone will end up moaning. To take up your point, you are right, your AO is clear. However, you state married blokes are getting LSA. That is not right as payment of LSA is irrelevant of whether someone is married or not.
 

Guns

ADC
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#9
From the JSP

INVOLUNTARILY SEPARATED (INVOLSEP) STATUS AND VOLUNTARILY SEPARATED (VOLSEP) STATUS


1. Service personnel, who are separated from their immediate family, normally for Service reasons, will be classified as INVOLSEP and eligible for benefits related to unaccompanied (UnAcc) service in the following circumstances:


a. On any assignment of 12 months or less.


b. When they are Personal Status Category (PStat Cat) 1s/c and assigned to a different location from their spouse/civil partner in excess of 50 miles apart and do not share a family home.


c. Waiting to occupy Service Families Accommodation (SFA), but not once a SFA appropriate to rank and family size has been refused. If the arrival date of the family is delayed through personal choice, then the Service person will be deemed Voluntarily Separated (VOLSEP) from the date of allocation of the SFA or Service person’s arrival date, whichever is the later.


d. Waiting for up to 6 months for the completion of a house sale/purchase transaction or tenancy agreement but only following the receipt of a firm offer. Where an extension to this period is deemed necessary, application should be made to the SPVA PACCC. The application must be supported by documentary evidence from, for example, Estate Agents or Solicitors, of the Service person’s continued attempts to complete the transaction. This provision overrides subparagraph 1c above.


e. Attending a course as a student for periods up to 12 months.


f. On exercise or in Field Conditions.


g. A Service person in PStat Cat 2 when separated from their child who normally resides at the duty station, or a child for whom Continuity of Education (CEA)(Board), CEA(Special Education Needs Addition (SENA)), CEA(Day) or CEA(SENA(Day)) (see Chapter 9) is being claimed when the separation occurs while the child is residing at the duty station during a school holiday.


h. When a child, attending a school local to the family home (not at the Service person’s new duty station) for whom CEA(Board), CEA(SENA), CEA(Guardians) or Day School Allowance (North Wales) (see Chapter 9) is not being claimed, is within the last 2 academic years before a public examination in secondary education (GCSE, “A” Level, Scottish equivalents etc). Once established, INVOLSEP status will remain until next assigned, except where a child is withdrawn from school or college before completion of the current stage of education. In such situations a case should be submitted to the SPVA PACCC for consideration and approval.


i. Where the Service person wishes to serve unaccompanied in order that their family may support a child attending a BTEC, or similar course, they may submit a case, to the SPVA PACCC for authority to be treated as INVOLSEP. Authority will normally be granted if:


(1) The child is attending a BTEC, or similar course, at the time of assignment.


(2) The child has been accepted for and allocated a place on a nonresidential course prior to the notification of assignment.


(3) The course is nontransferable to the new location and there is no acceptable substitute.


j. When a Service person has been assigned to a designated campaign
continuity post as maintained by ACDS(Ops) and has an expectation to serve continuously on operations, in an operational theatre, for 9 months or longer, INVOLSEP status may commence up to 6 months prior to the date of deployment to a designated campaign continuity post.


k. On an assignment designated by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) as “No Child”, providing the individual has at least one child for whom CEA is not in issue. When a Service person has no children, or is in receipt of CEA for all children, and elects to serve unaccompanied on an assignment designated by the FCO as “No Child”, they

Now for single personnel


5. Single Service personnel (PStat Cat 5) are considered to be INVOLSEP for Longer Separation Allowance (LSA) purposes when they are temporarily detached (e.g. on Ops/ex or courses) away from their permanent duty station for Service reasons for 7 days or more and they are unable to return to their permanent duty station on stand down and weekends. Single Service personnel permanently assigned to a different country to that in which they have a Privately Maintained property would not be considered to be INVOLSEP.



LONGER SEPARATION ALLOWANCE


GENERAL


05.0101. Aim. The aim of Longer Separation Allowance (LSA) is to support and improve retention by compensating those personnel experiencing separation over and above that compensated for by the X-Factor element within basic pay. As a general principle, it is paid at increasing amounts in order to target those who experience the most separation throughout their service. Payment of the allowance recognises the disadvantages of separation caused when return to the duty station at weekends/stand-down is precluded by either the nature or location of the duty. It also provides some support for those who are voluntarily separated from their immediate family.


e. Qualifying Separation (QS). Qualifying Separation (QS)is defined as 7 consecutive days or more INVOLSEP that is taken at a location that precludes return to the duty station, family home or permanent residence during normal stand down periods (e.g. weekends). For eligibility for personnel on board sea-going qualifying vessels see sub-paragraph 05.0103e (2), for personnel serving under Field Conditions see sub-paragraph 050103e(3) and for eligibility for those in OTR posts see paragraph 05.0114. QS does not start to accrue for new entrant officers until completion of initial officer training at the appropriate single Service officer training college BRNC, RMAS or RAF College Cranwell (but see paragraph 05.0124 for those Service personnel commissioned from the ranks). For new entrant non-commissioned ranks, LSA starts to accrue after 26 weeks of Service (on the move from new entrant rate of pay to basic pay level one or higher) or on completion of Phase 2 training, whichever is the earlier. A Service person will be deemed to be undertaking QS if they are:

(1) On temporary duty for a period of 7 consecutive days or more and are unable to spend a minimum period of 24 hours at their duty station, family home or permanent residence within a weekend (or period of time off in lieu) due to the nature or location of the temporary duty.


(2) Permanently or temporarily assigned to a Seagoing LSA Qualifying Unit (SLQU) (see definition at Chapter 1 Section 2) where the requirement to complete 7 consecutive days or more separation is waived and LSA is payable from the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] day of qualifying separation, but only for periods whilst the Service person is:



  • At sea.


(b) Alongside in ports outside the UK Theatre.


(c) At anchor or a buoy in UK waters.


(d) Alongside in UK ports other than a ship’s Base Port for periods not exceeding 14 days.


(e) A member of a submarine nuclear propulsion watch when nuclear safety regulations require the maintenance of sea watches alongside, including in Base Port.


In all of these circumstances entitlement to LSA will cease during periods that a Service person returns to the family home or permanent residence. Where ships visits, programmed to complete within 14 days, are extended, entitlement to LSA will cease immediately. LSA will not be paid when alongside in Base Port. It will also not be paid during visits to other UK ports for periods of 15 days or more, as seagoers are likely to become eligible for GYH (Travel) at this point (see Section 2 of this Chapter).

(3) Serving on a period of temporary duty of 24 hours or more away from a permanent duty station where Field Conditions for both Food and Single Living Accommodation have been declared in accordance with the regulations contained within JSP 754. In these circumstances the requirement to complete 7 consecutive days or more separation is waived and LSA is payable from the 1[SUP]st[/SUP] day of qualifying separation.

(4) Serving on an exchange assignment in a ship which corresponds to the definition of an SLQU (see Chapter 1 Section 2). They will be allocated an appropriate overseas Base Port which will equate to a UK Base Port. Entitlement to LSA and other separation allowances are as detailed in paragraph 05.0103e(2).


(5) Admitted as an in-patient to hospital or Rehabilitation Centre for a period of 7 consecutive days or more where the nature of the treatment precludes travel to the permanent duty station, family home or permanent residence during normal stand down periods (e.g. weekends), unless they are in receipt of LSA on the day that they are admitted, in which case QS continues without a break.


(6) Permanently assigned to a designated LSA payment area (see paragraph 05.0111).


(7) Permanently assigned to a designated OTR post and temporarily absent on duty for 4 or more, but less than 7 days (see paragraphs05.0113 to 05.0116).


(8) Already qualified for LSA and then opting to serve unaccompanied for the duration of a permanent assignment to a different Theatre from the family home (seeparagraphs05.0117to 05.0122 for further clarification).



Looking at it it will come down to if you are Assigned to BATUS, all be it for a short time, or Temp loaned.


01.0217. Duty Station. A Service person’s Duty Station is one to which they have been ordered, in writing (e.g. assignment order, temporary assignment order, course instruction) to report, to carry out their duties.

So the married personnel would be INVOLSUP by the JSP and thus entitled to LSA but as a singlie not.

That said I would speak to the RAO and get a definite answer, in writing. If still not satisfied go for a service complaint.

It's all in JSP 752 and is not as bad as it used to be to understand and follow the allowances you can claim.
 
#11
With the Sin Bin gone and Med Hat no longer resembling Hell's waiting room, i don't see what the problem is, I mean, if you had it, what would you spend it on?
 
D

Davetheclown

Guest
#17
BATUS is crap, TDS work from 14 hr days up to 48 hrs on the prairie it is a thankless task. You work 4 week blocks with possibly 3 days to turnaround another battlegroup.

Flight back last year the TDS were exhausted, fed up and under appreciated. Its long hours in really uncomfortable situations, its is a dangerous environment.

Also a letter went into Soldier last year complaining of the rates of pay, the local shops exorbitant rip off.

It is hard tour for a detactched soldier to go on. The pay department there really do not care if you get paid or not. Also they read the rules about different types of pay to there own advantage. There is a I am alright jack attitude from the permanent staff, and the senior officers are more worried that training packages run.

TDS is the worst duty I have done, and I have been twice and hated every moment of it. You are lower than pond scum and treated as such.
 
L

Lizard_Lips

Guest
#18
BATUS is crap, TDS work from 14 hr days up to 48 hrs on the prairie it is a thankless task. You work 4 week blocks with possibly 3 days to turnaround another battlegroup.

Flight back last year the TDS were exhausted, fed up and under appreciated. Its long hours in really uncomfortable situations, its is a dangerous environment.

Also a letter went into Soldier last year complaining of the rates of pay, the local shops exorbitant rip off.

It is hard tour for a detactched soldier to go on. The pay department there really do not care if you get paid or not. Also they read the rules about different types of pay to there own advantage. There is a I am alright jack attitude from the permanent staff, and the senior officers are more worried that training packages run.

TDS is the worst duty I have done, and I have been twice and hated every moment of it. You are lower than pond scum and treated as such.
I'm tds at the minute, and yes everything he said.




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#19
I'm tds at the minute, and yes everything he said.

I've never worked with such an unorganised outfit in my life.


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Am I missing something. Does TDS translate to what I recall as Red Tops?

We worked hard but there was plenty of down time and even an AT package whilst I was there.

We did the tail end of the winter repair, 2 x med mans and assisted some NBC types with an ex.

I left in on my birthday after 6 months and it was remarked on the flight home that we'd never have that much fun in the army again... Which turned out to be true.


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