Ban on hunting with guns....

#1
Ban on hunting with guns is the next target for anti hunting scum, on Countryfile today the league against cruel sports said the guns were next.

Watch out because fishing is on the list to.
 
#2
its all a waste of parliament time verging on obssession, they are spending too much time on this hunting ban issue at the expense of a more worthwhile legislations, they are also alienating many voters
 
#3
armourer said:
Ban on hunting with guns is the next target for anti hunting scum, on Countryfile today the league against cruel sports said the guns were next.

Watch out because fishing is on the list to.
When the government bans something like hunting with dogs/guns/angling, is there a compensation package in place to reimburse the sportsman for the equipment they can no longer use?

With somewhere around 3.5 million people in Britain enjoying the sport of angling, if the govt were responsible for compo they would think twice about banning it. Personnally i own a couple of grands worth of sea angling kit, i think a compo bill of a couple of billion would put them off a ban.

Boney
 
#4
Most of us got shafted when we handed in our revolvers when bLair came to power, although one or two of the blokes I shoot with actually made money by handing in pistols which were in no state to shoot as they had been "shot out" after years of use and had very little resale value.

Some people were never compensated after the self loading rifle ban when £150 per rifle was offered and all that by a Conservative government.

I think bLair will be thinking hard now regarding the election and watching how the hunting bill will effect his progress in the polls.
I now intend to take up Beagling again after a 20 year lay off just to make a point and break the law for the fun of it!
 
#5
I know someone who had his kids working hard in his workshop for extra money, assembling pistol rounds to hand in for "compensation"! :twisted:
 
#6
Not too sure if the hunting with guns will be able to halt Labour's attack on life in the country, but I'd like to see them go on and have a go at angling.

Two reasons:-

1. I don't do angling so it wouldn't matter to me at all.

2. Angling is a classless sport and was at one time (I don't know about today) the largest participant sport in Britain.

I fear that the second point however will mean that they won't have the balls to try it.
 
#7
Can someone please clear for me why hunting is seen as a class sport?
I seem to have missed this jump to upper by farriers and stable hands,
Hunting has not effected any one class by the imposition of this ban,
It has effected them all.
And by doing so it will, given time and a re-imposition of the social divide, create just what the Government are hoping for a re-classification of the masses,
Go to any hunt meet and listen to the accents of the riders,
They are a social hot pot where common ground has created no class
Ask a huntsman what he thinks of his dog handler and hear his awe and praise for the mastership he knows he will never match,
Ask a stable hand about the rider and he’ll tell you in truth if the man is worthy of the mount.
A sport that causes a division of the classes?
No.
Hunting is as a political issue far more dangerous,
Hunting unites the working, middle and upper classes,
Ask yourself how many people who vote labour do so because they where brought up to do so,
What then if they are included in a circle where political topics are less left and more centre,
Where a new horizon is shown.
How does ‘New Labour’ fair then against the wider spectrum to the man who so blinkeredly voted it in?
Just a thought.

Guns are next, that was never in doubt really was it?
In hunting they set the pattern,
Age old, but still the soundest of campaign goals,
Divide and conquer.

Beebs
 

Unknown_Quantity

War Hero
Moderator
#8
OK, so hunting with dogs is out, same for guns... Whats left? well, I suppose you could mine the countryside, or leave a persistive nerve agent around... What about some nice snares? :roll:

what next eh? and what will replace it?
 
#9
Any grouping that is at all selfsufficient, that promotes selfreliance and responsibility, seems to be anathema to the control freaks in New Labour.

Shooting will be smothered by oblique legislation, unconnected with the actual private ownership of firearms; issues such as Health and Safety/Right to Roam across game and deer shoots.
Lead shot is already banned over wildfowling areas, necessitating the use of more expensive steel and bismuth shot. Viable treatments for gapes and worm infestations in pheasants will become difficult and expensive to administer under new DEFRA rules.

The British Association for Shooting and Conservation is fooling itself if they believe that they've got Alun Michael 'on-side', simply by giving him a day on the clay range.This duplicituous sh*t was instrumental in pushing the pistol ban though, in spite of the recommendations of the Cullen Report, and the Countryside Alliance must now be wishing they'd never agreed to talk to him. GLASS, the Green Lane Association (4x4 adventures) is another special interest group that is about to suffer from Alun Michael's decision to change the status of Roads Used as Public Paths to Restricted Byways in the Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000...

If you belong to a special interest group that falls within Alun Michael's remit, one that offends the righteous b'stards in New Labour, beware; your days are numbered... Unless this shower are kicked out at the next election!

Oh, yes, by-the-by.. Prediction: You can bet your arrse that compensation will not be paid to shooters again, because the Government got badly stung after the pistol ban; they're sure to find some way of weaseling out of it.
Any bets?
 
#10
A blinding light just shone upon me... :idea: 8O :!:

I said:
'Any grouping that is at all self-sufficient, that promotes self-reliance and responsibility, seems to be anathema to the control freaks in New Labour.'

Feck me! I just realised I could be talking about the Army...

Now that explains a lot, doesn't it?
 
#11
blessed baby cakes said:
Can someone please clear for me why hunting is seen as a class sport?
I seem to have missed this jump to upper by farriers and stable hands,
Hunting has not effected any one class by the imposition of this ban,
It has effected them all.
And by doing so it will, given time and a re-imposition of the social divide, create just what the Government are hoping for a re-classification of the masses,
Go to any hunt meet and listen to the accents of the riders,
They are a social hot pot where common ground has created no class
Ask a huntsman what he thinks of his dog handler and hear his awe and praise for the mastership he knows he will never match,
Ask a stable hand about the rider and he’ll tell you in truth if the man is worthy of the mount.
A sport that causes a division of the classes?
No.
Hunting is as a political issue far more dangerous,
Hunting unites the working, middle and upper classes,
Ask yourself how many people who vote labour do so because they where brought up to do so,
What then if they are included in a circle where political topics are less left and more centre,
Where a new horizon is shown.
How does ‘New Labour’ fair then against the wider spectrum to the man who so blinkeredly voted it in?
Just a thought.

Guns are next, that was never in doubt really was it?
In hunting they set the pattern,
Age old, but still the soundest of campaign goals,
Divide and conquer.

Beebs
Absolutely spot on Beebs, I couldn't have put it better.

I spent the week in Eire visiting a friend with Mrs Tombs and we decided to go out for the day and along the lane we met the local hunt as it was about to set off, no police, no saboteurs just ordinary local people like the electrician who couldn't do any wiring in our friends house that day because he was gong hunting.
Where the bloody hell have we gone wrong in this country that I love so much?
 
#12
OldAdam said:
Any grouping that is at all selfsufficient, that promotes selfreliance and responsibility, seems to be anathema to the control freaks in New Labour.
Well, given that 40% of people in the UK now receive benefits of one kind or another (I think I read it in the Torygraph recently), it seems that Neue Arbeit are trying to buy the electorate. Welfare reform my arrse!

To coin a phrase (remember: you heard it here 1st): Stealth Bribery
 
#15
Related to the link above!

From the Herald, some time in 2003.

Dunblane secret documents contain letters by Tory and Labour ministers

Investigation: By Neil Mackay, Home Affairs Editor

LETTERS between Labour and Tory ministers and correspondence relating to Thomas Hamilton's alleged involvement with Freemasonry are part of a batch of more than 100 documents about the Dunblane mass murder which have been sealed from public sight for 100 years.
The documents include a letter connected to Hamilton, which was sent by George Robertson, currently head of Nato, to Michael Forsyth, who was then Secretary of State for Scotland.

Until now it was thought that a 100-year public secrecy order had only been placed on one police report into Hamilton which allegedly named high-profile politicians and legal figures. However, a Sunday Herald investigation has uncovered that 106 documents, which were submitted to the Dunblane inquiry in 1996, were also placed under the 100-year rule.

The Scottish Executive has claimed the 100-year secrecy order was placed on the Central Police report, which was drafted in 1991 five years before the murders, to protect the identities of children named in the report. Hamilton had allegedly abused a number of children prior to his 1996 gun attack on Dunblane primary school in which 16 primary one children and a teacher died before Hamilton turned his gun on himself.

However, only a handful of the documents, which the Sunday Herald has discovered to be also subject to the 100-year rule, relate to children or name alleged abuse victims.

The most intriguing document is listed as: 'Copy of letter from Thomas Hamilton to Dunblane parents regarding boys' club, and flyer advertising Dunblane Boys' Sports Club. Both sent to Rt Hon Michael Forsyth, MP, Secretary of State for Scotland, by George Robertson MP.' Also closed under the 100-year rule is a 'submission to Lord James Douglas Hamilton, MP, Minister of State at the Scottish Office, concerning government evidence to the Inquiry'.

Another document relates to correspondence between the clerk of the Dunblane inquiry, which was presided over by Lord Cullen, and a member of the public regarding 'possible affiliations of Thomas Hamilton with Freemasonry ... and copy letters from Thomas Hamilton'.

SNP deputy justice minister, Michael Matheson, said: 'The explanation to date about the 100 -year rule was that it was put in place to protect the interests of children named in the Central Police report. How can that explanation stand when children aren't named? The 100-year rule needs to be re-examined with respect to all documents.'

Matheson has written to the Lord Advocate, Colin Boyd, asking why the 100-year rule applies and how it can be revoked. He has so far had no response. He also asked First Minister Jack McConnell to explain the reasons for the 100-year order but received 'no substantial answer'. Matheson is to write to Colin Boyd a second time, in the light of the discovery that more than 100 other documents are also sealed, asking him to account for the decision.

A spokeswoman for the Crown Office said: 'In consultation with the Crown Office and the Scottish Office, Lord Cullen agreed that in line with the age of some of the individuals involved and named in the inquiry, the closure period would be 100 years. The Lord Advocate is considering issuing a redacted copy of the productions, which would blank out identifying details of children and their families. A decision on this has yet to be made.'

Other sealed key reports on Dunblane include:

A 'comparative analysis of Thomas Hamilton' by Central Scotland Police

Information about Hamilton's 'use and possession of firearms'

Pathology reports, Hamilton's autopsy report, and analysis by Glasgow University's forensic science lab on blood, urine and liver samples from Hamilton's body

Details on firearms licensing policies

A review by Alfred Vannet, regional procurator fiscal of Grampian, Highland and Islands, of 'reports and information in respect of Thomas Hamilton submitted to the procurator fiscals of Dumbarton and Stirling by Strathclyde Police and Central Police'

A psychological report on Hamilton

Guidance from the British Medical Association on granting firearms licences

'Transcript of and correspondence relating to answering-machine tape which accidentally recorded conversation between police officers at the scene of the Dunblane incident'

Correspondence and witness statements 'relating to allegations of sexual abuse made against Hamilton'
02 March 2003
 
#16
Doubt gun hunting will go, something like 90% of the total foxes killed are lamped, most in one shot, so I don't see why there would be any reason to get rid of it.

And who was the main force to ban handguns after Dunblaine? Was is a top brass who would say, gun crime would go down after banning them? or was it armchair samurais who think all violent crime would vanish after banning all things gun shaped?
 
#17
I reckon that the Gov't will simply try to make it extremely difficult to get an FAC for any reason at all. They are already trying to make it more difficult to get a shotgun cert. by changing the criteria for granting one so that an applicant must have a "good reason" the simple desire to shoot will no longer be sufficient.

As I pointed out in the hunting thread many of these antis see it as a thought-crime to enjoy shooting or hunting. If you do so you are moraly delinquent in their eyes all the more so if you make it a matter of pride to do the job well and humanely. Only methods that are not enjoyable are acceptable to them or if it must be done by shooting then the shooter must be somehow a disinterested government professional. But, like those cowboys shooting lambs with a rifle during FMD and causing terrible suffering by botching the job, this is not the best way to encourage humane control.

These peope simply cannot see that when people share an environment with wild animals they are part of the ecosystem and compete with those animals . Because they live 50 miles away in a city they cannot understand that they really do compete with rabbits for the rocket that they put in their poncy salad and with foxes for the free range corn fed chicken that they eat it with.
 
#18
If you let them, they will whittle away until you're lucky to have rocks and sticks left.
 
#19
Interesting that everyone responding to this thread seems to be pro guns/hunting. As I was born and raised in the country in a local school with local people (and a local shop), I am no different.

The biggest argument the anti hunt cnuts seem to raise is that it causes pain and suffering to the poor inocent fox. I wonder if any of these townies have ever seen a fox make a kill.

As for guns, how are you going to kill game in a humane way without them, short of keeping them in a pen or cage and 'putting them to sleep'.

This country has had proud traditions such as hunting, shooting, etc for hundreds of years. In the good old days all food items would be sold in towns at a market, quite often animals sold live for freshness. These days your chicken comes in a plastic pack from tescos. Townies don't understand the way the country works, they don't know where their food comes from.

I think a good idea for a new reality TV show would be to put a load of london office workers on a farm and get them to run it. They will see what happens when a fox strikes and also how hard our farmers have to work for very little profit or thanks.

Let the city be the city and the country be the country and we'll all be happy.
 
#20
It is this unrelenting slow but steady lava flow of legislation aimed at entirely controlling every aspect of all citizens lives that is truely worrying. It could well end up that George Orwell under-estimated it.

Heavily regulate employment law. Limit recreational activities. De-populate the countryside and force people into the high density city areas for better control. Personal ID cards. Increased powers of arrest. Holding without charge. It goes on and on.

Just reading back over this it is amazing. This is how Saddam Husein ran Iraq.
 

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