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AWOL or Desertion

  • Thread starter error_unknown
  • Start date
E

error_unknown

Guest
#1
2 RAMC(V) Cols & 1 RAMC(V) Sgt have failed to report to their units as part of the Op Telic TA mobilisation. On contacting them they have refused to report.

Now forgive me if I’m wrong but in a peace time role that’s AWOL. But in an operational call up isn’t that desertion ???.
 
#2
I think its desertion, thus a high punishment. Theres probably a reserve forces act/military law guru round here somwhere.

Whatever it is its inexcusable

Correct me if im wrong but doesn't everyone have to get read the liability statment before they get attested
 

CGS

War Hero
Moderator
#3
The sure thing here is that if the system does not respond by looking to punish these two, then it opens the flood gates for the rest to say no.
 
#4
I believe, after having a quick chat to a mate in RMP that the 2 colonels will get a visit from the RMP and a one way trip to jail unless they change their tune - they are both of consultant surgeon ranking and thus on serious money - not something this penny pinching govt will overlook lightly!

Could be wrong though.....
 
#5
I didn't think that it was technically possible to desert from the TA by definition. I think they will be done for refusing to follow a lawful order or some such charge.
 
#7
It will prove to be nigh on impossible to charge them with desertion as the legal nerds are unwilling generally to push for it for the fear of loosing the case, which lets face it is quite simple for any half decent barrister.

The whole affair let's face it will probably be hushed up for fear of a negative media impact :eek:.
 
#8
As I understand it, the details of any "fail to report" individuals are place on the Police National Computer and at some point they receive a visit from the local Plod and are arrested. Its a bit like having an outstanding warrant against you. The civvy magistrates court will then deal with them...harshly, I hope, as they are true war dodgers!

Not sure the RMP get involved - too busy directing traffic at Marchwood.
 
#9
Believe they have to be there - not taking an active part perhaps - due to the seniority of the individuals involved.
 

Ventress

LE
Moderator
#10
What is the source of the story?

Can't see the Army bagging the Colonels, the Sgt better get a lawyer!- Disgrace to the Corps!
 
#11
E

error_unknown

Guest
#12
The source is my good self. Who has the dubious honour of stating where manning deficiencies exist in the DMS/DSCA & which reservist/TA(V) is suitable qualified to fill it. So I suppose you can say from the horse’s mouth.
 
#13
In The Know

Sign up to the Forum, don't remain a guest.

Are there many holes in the NBC area?
 
#14
Now forgive me if I’m wrong but in a peace time role that’s AWOL. But in an operational call up isn’t that desertion
I think you will still find it is AWOL. Desertion in law is very difficult to prove. The prosecution has to prove that the accused intended to never to return to duty (for example, burn ID card) rather than failing to attend.

Are there many holes in the NBC area?
Yes.. in all trade qual areas.
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#15
Ramillies,

help, there must be some gaps for a mean-as-custard regular sapper officer type.  What can I do?
 
#16
help, there must be some gaps for a mean-as-custard regular sapper officer type.  What can I do?
The list of those required is doing the rounds at the moment. Spk to your chain of command. Good luck  :)
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#17
Dont worry, they're doctors and as such get away with murder, trust me I work with them.  They'll probably turn up three days later when they can be bothered.  on recent mobilization of Lvl 2 Backfills I received a call from one Col, who on being asked to attend a 3 day Pre Trg course phoned up to say ' Due to the adverse weather conditions I will not be able to make this training package'  Hmm he only had to get from aldershot to portsmouth not to hard seeing as how people form Northallerton and Derriford made it.

Also a phone call was received by the Orderly Sgt from a certain Psychy Nurse who enquired as to the possibilities of getting a flight from Glasgow to Kuwait, to avoid having to come to Portsmouth first?!!

I ask you are we in an army now or some fluffy tree hugging lefty pampering club?
 
#18
I don't get it - why did they just not smoke some weed the night before and then admit it at the TA Centre, they would, according to regulations be quickly shown the door.

O am I just thick?
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#19
A few points to inform the debate (have to admit cannot confirm their veracity but have spoken to some who should be in the know).

I believe one colonel failed to attend because he is currently on remand waiting to go before the beak for an alleged murder. The second chap did turn up at his unit lines, but just to dump his kit off and hand in a letter of resignation.

The General Medical Council is a very powerful professional body, perhaps the most powerful in the country after the Bar Association.  It almost certainly will not take disciplinary action against these men (at least the one NOT accused of murder), indeed it will probably support them.  Certainly the British Medical Association (the doctors trade union) will back them in their decision not to soldier on.  The NHS trusts that they work for will just be happy that they don’t have to cancel operating lists and fail to meet their targets.  The GMC and medical Royal Colleges consistently refuse to compromise on any of their rules to help the forces out in operational situations.  The DMS and the armed forces as a whole simply have no ‘clout’ with them, we are too small and unimportant in the bigger scheme of things.  Finally, the DPP and the Army prosecuting authority know that they will lose this one at the European Court of Human Rights, certainly even before that in the UK courts.  These two geezers know this.

The NHS is a more important organisation than the armed forces in the view of most of the great British public.  The average citizen, whilst perhaps believing these guys should get a slap on the wrist, would be outraged if they were given any form of custodial sentence, which meant they were not available to treat patients in their local hospital. For politicians, there are more votes in the NHS and what it does than there are in the armed forces and what we do.  Yes, when the shooting starts we will go up the political agenda a little (note the pay rise of the armed forces compared to the nurses and teachers) but that will soon be forgotten about and we will return to being that well known bunch of right wing, foul-mouthed, recruit bullying, larger louts.

Finally a note on pay for these guys two guys.  Medical officers who volunteer for service are only paid the same salary as their equivalent Regular Army rank.  Those subject to compulsory call-out can receive compensation for lost earnings (both NHS and private) up to the figure of £150,000 per year.
 
E

ex-dvr

Guest
#20
I would ask for all the pay they had the T.A.  from all 3,minimum! it's no good to man nor beast, when they play the game ,then when needed refuse to go.
 
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