ARRSE in the Daily Telegraph...again!

#1
No names this time tho;



What soldiers say

Last Updated: 2:57am BST 28/04/2007

Soldiers have made the following comments on the Army Rumour Service website:
# The Staffords had a tough enough time on the previous tour, I can't even begin to imagine how bad this one was, but can only guess that when serving soldiers feel strongly enough to voice their anger, then there is a proper drama.
# My worry is that when we withdraw to Basra Air Station and abandon (sorry, hand over to Iraqi control) Basra Palace, we'll be even less likely to be able to achieve anything in Basra. If I were a local Iraqi policeman, I'd know what way the wind was blowing -we are leaving, and the Iranians are not: no real choice which side to back, then.
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# Unfortunately, we lost the strategic war the moment we set foot on Iraqi soil.
# Has anybody figured out where the British Army will be in 5 years time? This is fingers in the dyke stuff, a real crisis developing from an illegal war and an occupation planned by idiots. One thing is for sure, there aren't enough soldiers to do two wars.
# I think that we have lost the initiative - and militarily that can be rather dangerous.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/04/28/nirq128.xml


Linked to this story;



Battle for Iraq is lost, says soldier

By Nick Britten
Last Updated: 2:57am BST 28/04/2007

# Leader: Iraq still needs us
# Your view: Should Prince Harry quit the Army if he can't fight?

A British soldier who has just returned from Iraq yesterday described the situation in Basra as "hopeless and lost" and accused the Government of "trying to save face" by keeping troops there.
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Pte Paul Barton said insurgents had taken control of the area and that British troops were constantly under siege to an increasingly sophisticated enemy.

He called on Tony Blair to withdraw troops immediately.

Pte Barton told The Daily Telegraph: "We have overstayed our welcome now. We should speed up the withdrawal. It's a lost battle, a hell hole that will not get any better. We should pull out and call it quits."

Pte Barton said in the 18 months between the end of his first tour of Iraq and his return this year the pressure on troops had increased hugely. The "Iranian influence" had given insurgents increasingly powerful and new weaponry, he said.

Pte Barton, a member of the 1st Battalion, the Staffordshire Regiment, said: "The situation has become intolerable. We are meant to be there peacekeeping but there is no peace to keep. There's a civil war going on and we are caught in the middle, coming under attack day and night.

"They are getting access to a lot more weapons, which are also becoming stronger and stronger.

"We're coming into the end game as far as I'm concerned. We're losing around four soldiers a month and it won't get any better.

"They've even started attacking our base at Basra airport now they've got proper artillery guns. Once that's gone there's nowhere left."

The regiment was based in the Shatt al-Arab hotel, which was handed over to the Iraqi army on April 8. Of the 40 tents in the base, just five remained unscathed by the end of the tour.

Pte Barton, from Tamworth, Staffs, said: "We were just sitting ducks under constant attack three, four times a day. Fifteen mortars and three rockets were fired at us in the first hour we were there. It was unbelievable.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/04/28/nirq28.xml
 
#2
I wonder if this was referenced with permission?!?
 
#3
At least they chose sensible quotes
 
#4
spike7451 said:
No names this time tho;



What soldiers say

Last Updated: 2:57am BST 28/04/2007

Soldiers have made the following comments on the Army Rumour Service website:
# The Staffords had a tough enough time on the previous tour, I can't even begin to imagine how bad this one was, but can only guess that when serving soldiers feel strongly enough to voice their anger, then there is a proper drama.
# My worry is that when we withdraw to Basra Air Station and abandon (sorry, hand over to Iraqi control) Basra Palace, we'll be even less likely to be able to achieve anything in Basra. If I were a local Iraqi policeman, I'd know what way the wind was blowing -we are leaving, and the Iranians are not: no real choice which side to back, then.
advertisement
# Unfortunately, we lost the strategic war the moment we set foot on Iraqi soil.
# Has anybody figured out where the British Army will be in 5 years time? This is fingers in the dyke stuff, a real crisis developing from an illegal war and an occupation planned by idiots. One thing is for sure, there aren't enough soldiers to do two wars.
# I think that we have lost the initiative - and militarily that can be rather dangerous.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/04/28/nirq128.xml


Linked to this story;



Battle for Iraq is lost, says soldier

By Nick Britten
Last Updated: 2:57am BST 28/04/2007

# Leader: Iraq still needs us
# Your view: Should Prince Harry quit the Army if he can't fight?

A British soldier who has just returned from Iraq yesterday described the situation in Basra as "hopeless and lost" and accused the Government of "trying to save face" by keeping troops there.
advertisement

Pte Paul Barton said insurgents had taken control of the area and that British troops were constantly under siege to an increasingly sophisticated enemy.

He called on Tony Blair to withdraw troops immediately.

Pte Barton told The Daily Telegraph: "We have overstayed our welcome now. We should speed up the withdrawal. It's a lost battle, a hell hole that will not get any better. We should pull out and call it quits."

Pte Barton said in the 18 months between the end of his first tour of Iraq and his return this year the pressure on troops had increased hugely. The "Iranian influence" had given insurgents increasingly powerful and new weaponry, he said.

Pte Barton, a member of the 1st Battalion, the Staffordshire Regiment, said: "The situation has become intolerable. We are meant to be there peacekeeping but there is no peace to keep. There's a civil war going on and we are caught in the middle, coming under attack day and night.

"They are getting access to a lot more weapons, which are also becoming stronger and stronger.

"We're coming into the end game as far as I'm concerned. We're losing around four soldiers a month and it won't get any better.

"They've even started attacking our base at Basra airport now they've got proper artillery guns. Once that's gone there's nowhere left."

The regiment was based in the Shatt al-Arab hotel, which was handed over to the Iraqi army on April 8. Of the 40 tents in the base, just five remained unscathed by the end of the tour.

Pte Barton, from Tamworth, Staffs, said: "We were just sitting ducks under constant attack three, four times a day. Fifteen mortars and three rockets were fired at us in the first hour we were there. It was unbelievable.
Lets not forget Tony Bliar's legacy on health n safety, before any tents can be removed. This NEW LABOUR government has given the insurgents more 'HUMAN RIGHTS' (what in wartime - only in the name of NEW LABOUR, at anytime!), more than British Forces serving personal................

Tony Bliar, too much, the YES-man.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/04/28/nirq28.xml
 
#7
This looks like sloppy, lazy journalism.
 
#8
Don't see why we have to jump on 'em too hard for this one. The quotes are pretty representative of a lot of the views on here - as Cheapseats says, at least they used sensible ones this time - and by not referencing the users he's a) helped ensure anonymity and b) given people a reason to come read the site for themselves.

As for "lazy journalism"; maybe it is but, especially with the recent MOD debacle over story selling, is trying to hunt down attributable quotes from confirmed serving personnel going to get him anywhere? Who's going to agree to speak and who's going to give their real opinion?

The press have a job to do which they may well abuse a lot of the time. We shoudn't jump down their throats when they do it reasonably. That only serves to alienate those who do it well and takes a lot of the impact out of complaints when we've really got something to complain about!
 
#9
Dear Mr Telegraph Hack,

I see that you have lifted some of my words from the ARRSE website to use in your paper/website. I don't recall giving you permission, nor your bothering to attempt to ask for it. It's a very simple process where you send me a PM and ask politely.

I assume that you are drawing a salary for you efforts with this piece. I'd be grateful if you would make a contribution to a service charity in lieu of the effort that I and others made to sustain your income.

Many regards,
whitecity
 
#10
whitecity said:
Dear Mr Telegraph Hack,

I see that you have lifted some of my words from the ARRSE website to use in your paper/website. I don't recall giving you permission, nor your bothering to attempt to ask for it. It's a very simple process where you send me a PM and ask politely.

I assume that you are drawing a salary for you efforts with this piece. I'd be grateful if you would make a contribution to a service charity in lieu of the effort that I and others made to sustain your income.

Many regards,
whitecity
It was printed in Saturdays edition,sandwiched between the 'soldier speaks out' story & Prince Harry going to Iraq story.
Twas in the pub at the time enjoying a few pints of Magners.
 
#11
If any journos are reading this and can't be arsed, print this:

For sale: Raleigh Chopper Original (1979!!) good condition £200 ono

Proceeds to ABF amongst other good causes

ta

Edited for him below!!

(c) Heywood Jablowme

(feel free to print my name with reference to Blair)
 
#12
Is that the original Chopper or the Hong Kong piece of crap Raleigh are selling now? ;)

Costs £15.00 to make my sources tell me (I used to work for them).

Back to the subject, at least the journo's are listening to the people who've been there got the T-shirt (most of which I'd be arrested for wearing due to the content).
 
#13
whitecity said:
Dear Mr Telegraph Hack,

I see that you have lifted some of my words from the ARRSE website to use in your paper/website. I don't recall giving you permission, nor your bothering to attempt to ask for it. It's a very simple process where you send me a PM and ask politely.

I assume that you are drawing a salary for you efforts with this piece. I'd be grateful if you would make a contribution to a service charity in lieu of the effort that I and others made to sustain your income.

Many regards,
whitecity
Whitecity I suggest we put something similar to this at the bottom of each post

© Copyright of Telegraph Media Group Limited 2007

or

© Copyright of Whitecity ARRSE site Limited 2007



that way they cant cut and paste quotes to add to their stories to tell their lies. If quoted by any media scum please send my fee straight to the Army benevolment fund. Any lawyers out there to advise please.

© Copyright of Taz and THE_IRON on ARRSE 2007
 
#14
The_IRON said:
whitecity said:
I assume that you are drawing a salary for you efforts with this piece. I'd be grateful if you would make a contribution to a service charity in lieu of the effort that I and others made to sustain your income.

Many regards,
whitecity
Whitecity I suggest we put something similar to this at the bottom of each post

© Copyright of Telegraph Media Group Limited 2007

or

© Copyright of Whitecity ARRSE site Limited 2007



that way they cant cut and paste quotes to add to their stories to tell their lies. If quoted by any media scum please send my fee straight to the Army benevolment fund. Any lawyers out there to advise please.

© Copyright of Taz and THE_IRON on ARRSE 2007
Be good to know the legality of this, would love to fcuk those jurno ******* over. At least have the balls to ask or donate.
 
#15
Don't particularly object to having the words lifted. Don't particularly object to them not asking given that I often quote their words and link to their stories here on ARRSE.

What I do object to is that they are making money out of our efforts, thoughts and comments.

What maybe should be done is for hacks to make donations to a handful of deserving service charities, and their contributions be recorded on ARRSE. Then we'd know who was being honest about this and who wasn't. I'm sure it could be done, but don't have a magic formulae to hand.
 
#16
Shouldn't be too hard, whitecity. In fact, they could simply devote a little of their space to promoting said charities - I'm sure (for example) the Telegraph openly supporting and promoting a charity in their own pages wouldn't do anyone any harm.

That way, not only the papers but, also, their readers - who do, after all, benefit from the enlightened comments quoted from here - could do their bit to help ;)
 
#17
Very good idea.

I must confess that I was thinking along the lines that individual hacks make donations, rather than a blanket 'gift' from the media outlet itself.
 
#18
whitecity said:
Very good idea.

I must confess that I was thinking along the lines that individual hacks make donations, rather than a blanket 'gift' from the media outlet itself.
We could have a charity a month voted by fellow ARRSE members and individual hacks could donate to that worth while forces charty. Any media reps like the idea of that.


© Copyright of Taz and THE_IRON Limited 2007 (still dont think this will work)
 
#19
whitecity said:
Very good idea.

I must confess that I was thinking along the lines that individual hacks make donations, rather than a blanket 'gift' from the media outlet itself.
Great idea.Should work along the lines that everytime one of them quotes from here s/he makes a donation to a services charity.Their job is to be a wordsmith, lifting the words of others does not fulfil that criteria.
 

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