Army WO3s and RAF WO1s

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goodoldboy

MIA
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Nonsense. IOs and Ops Offrs were routinely PVd, albeit not always. But what do the facts matter anymore? All that matters is the sympathy vote and that's being milked and abused for all it's worth.
I'm glad you edited that bag of pure bollocks John, otherwise I would have had to call you a liar. But I will anyway...

Liar
 
Nonsense. IOs and Ops Offrs were routinely PVd, albeit not always. But what do the facts matter anymore? All that matters is the sympathy vote and that's being milked and abused for all it's worth.
Whatever you say - you are the expert.
 
I have a theory. In reality Johnny G is actually a top bloke, not interested in Thai boys, is good value on the piss, not condescending one bit, doesn’t take himself too seriously and has never touched Milan. He’s just here for the shits and giggles.
D42DAEF2-9511-4740-94F0-8924117C6207.jpeg
 
Whatever you say - you are the expert.
Now that is gen top bollocks from Johnny. Most Bde, Div and higher staff officers were not even PV’d/DV’d , yet alone Capt Fck wit who was Ops Offr of 3rd Bn the Queens Own Bluffers. ‘Constant or regular access to TS material’ ring a bell? Probably not.

Shit. That’s another 250 posts to follow.
 
No. I think that whatever John G thinks, we now know all that we need to know about him and can leave him to continue howling down the well at his own reflection.
 
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No. I think that whatever John G thinks, we now know all that we need to know about him and can leave him to continue howling down the well at his own reflection.
That would be funny.

Everyone can put him on ignore, and watch him back to back milling with himself!

The fantasist fibber.
 
Nonsense. IOs and Ops Offrs were routinely PVd, albeit not always. But what do the facts matter anymore? All that matters is the sympathy vote and that's being milked and abused for all it's worth.
Interesting. I was the Ops Officer of 38 (Berlin) Field Squadron RE and as so had full and regular access to a whole bunch of Secret documents. NV was sufficient for that. All officers were NV as a matter of course.

But, because it was an independent squadron I was also the RSO (and the IO). It was because I was the RSO and so responsible for a few pads of BATCO and the two Clansman BID fills we had, I was PV'd. Not because I was the Ops Officer. I was an IO in a later EOD job and still had no requirement for PV then, even though I was in regular contact with Tech Int (Army) DI59b. PV was only for 'regular and unsupervised access to TS' and given that war plans etc were only Secret, there wasn't much call for regimental officers (except the RSO) to be PV'd.

I was then PV'd again when I went to work in MB, it's an expensive process and there was no point in doing it when it wasn't needed. I therefore don't agree that PV was 'routine' for ops officers.
 
Yes, without hesitation.

Two decades before dingerr was an ATO at Warminster, when I did my A/Tk Milan cse at SWW and was an A/Tk Milan pl comd, ATOs were not required on a Milan range. It was considered unnecessary and that if an ATO was required then one could be called. That subsequently changed and ATOs were mandated to be on all Milan ranges.

Some 95% of the time on a Milan range there are no problems at all - the missile's fired, the targets hit, etc. Around 5% of the time there may be a problem which could be due to operator error (loading, aiming, tracking, etc) or a missile fault (at the FP, in flight with a rogue missile, failing to gather, or on impact / completion, etc).

If the ATO wasn't there / prior to his being mandated to be there, dealing with most of that '5%' was the responsibility of the DCs / Sect Comds / Pl Comd / Range Offr, unless ATO had to be called for a specific incident. Once ATO was mandated to be on the range, though, he assumed some of that responsibility and part of the responsibility for the safety and lives of those on the range.

If the ATO doesn't observe the missile being fired...
If in your day, an ATO wasn't required, and if, as you say, this predates @dingerr's time as an ATO by two decades, how can you be so sure that you know what @dingerr's job was on a Milan range? By the time he rocked up you were long gone. If you make the argument that he doesn't know what the score was in your day, then the same logic must apply conversely.

Your entire argument seems predicated on picking holes in his syntax* in his description of 'looking downrange'. We're on ARRSE not at the Civil Service College so basing an argument on use of grammar and prose isn't particularly an effective one. It's certainly not very persuasive.


* He was an AT after all, so presumably types using a ruler.
 
Interesting. I was the Ops Officer of 38 (Berlin) Field Squadron RE and as so had full and regular access to a whole bunch of Secret documents. NV was sufficient for that. All officers were NV as a matter of course.

But, because it was an independent squadron I was also the RSO (and the IO). It was because I was the RSO and so responsible for a few pads of BATCO and the two Clansman BID fills we had, I was PV'd. Not because I was the Ops Officer. I was an IO in a later EOD job and still had no requirement for PV then, even though I was in regular contact with Tech Int (Army) DI59b. PV was only for 'regular and unsupervised access to TS' and given that war plans etc were only Secret, there wasn't much call for regimental officers (except the RSO) to be PV'd.

I was then PV'd again when I went to work in MB, it's an expensive process and there was no point in doing it when it wasn't needed. I therefore don't agree that PV was 'routine' for ops officers.
And you’re absolutely correct. I was first DV’d in 2000 and held DV posts until I retired in 2015. My DV is still extant for my civilian job but I only need to be SC for that so technically it’s lapsed.

I suppose @John G needed to be DV’d so that he could earn imaginary medals doing work that wasn’t special in places he can’t talk about because of the OSA and imaginary ‘conventions’.

Makes sense.
 
Interesting. I was the Ops Officer of 38 (Berlin) Field Squadron RE and as so had full and regular access to a whole bunch of Secret documents. NV was sufficient for that. All officers were NV as a matter of course.

But, because it was an independent squadron I was also the RSO (and the IO). It was because I was the RSO and so responsible for a few pads of BATCO and the two Clansman BID fills we had, I was PV'd. Not because I was the Ops Officer. I was an IO in a later EOD job and still had no requirement for PV then, even though I was in regular contact with Tech Int (Army) DI59b. PV was only for 'regular and unsupervised access to TS' and given that war plans etc were only Secret, there wasn't much call for regimental officers (except the RSO) to be PV'd.

I was then PV'd again when I went to work in MB, it's an expensive process and there was no point in doing it when it wasn't needed. I therefore don't agree that PV was 'routine' for ops officers.
Spot on. And a lengthy process as well - too lengthy for the routine vetting of ops offrs and IOs. Johnny yet again show his comprehensive ignorance on all things military - hopefully his Boy Scout skills in Top Roping and Abseiling and getting soldiers lost in orange cagoules are slightly more developed.
 
...Claiming, repeatedly, that I had "assisted rapists" and covered it up, while the complete reverse was the case...

...No-one has carte-blanche to make those sort of posts, constantly, whatever their circumstances, without being challenged...

As another long term resident of SE Asia (through my work) I'll remind everyone that, in my 20+ years since first going there I've never heard of ANYONE being called on to help the police in the way you described, and the only way it makes sense is if you were asked by the police to explain to the soldiers that the best thing they could do would be to pay up to avoid lengthy legal action.

I simply can't credit the story that you then unilaterally persuaded the soldiers to pay more to the victims than had originally been asked, except as part of such a negotiation process. It's hard to imagine any other circumstance. Not impossible, but 'when you hear hoof beats, think "horse" rather than "zebra"'*

Like you say,

"No-one has carte-blanche to make those sort of posts, constantly, whatever their circumstances, without being challenged".

* Saffers may struggle with this metaphor.
 
"No-one has carte-blanche to make those sort of posts, constantly, whatever their circumstances, without being challenged".

* Saffers may struggle with this metaphor.
As her pimp of course he got more money out of them.
 
[It's hard to imagine any other circumstance. Not impossible, but 'when you hear hoof beats, think "horse" rather than "zebra"'*/QUOTE]

Indeed - and when you see an old, fat, sweaty ex-pat resident of Phuket think ‘nonce’, rather than someone there for the ‘cuisine and climate’
 
Phuket isn't the worse by any extent. Pattaya is far grottier.
You've the right of that, Bob. To my eternal shame my Dad moved there. He thought it was the greatest place on Earth. In all fairness, I did what you do in Rome, but I got bored. He took me to Nakkon Ratchasima and Ayutthaya, and I preferred that, but the sleaze of the fleshpots you can keep.

Thing is, he died in 2015, and I'm still trying to coax a death certificate of the Thais, which considering we had property together in Spain is a pain. I wish he'd never gone there, but I never will myself. I can understand why blokes do, because the ladies flock round you, but I was never a hit with the girls, and the pretence of the situation never felt right to me.

Enough of my dark nights of the soul; at least I'm not John G. The bluffing one-man twat riot.
 
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You've the right of that, Bob. To my eternal shame my Dad moved there. He thought it was the greatest place on Earth. In all fairness, I did what you do in Rome, but I got bored. He took me to Nakkon Ratchasima and Ayutthaya, and I preferred that, but the sleaze of the fleshpots you can keep.

Thing is, he died in 2015, and I'm still trying to coax a death certificate of the Thais, which considering we had property together in Spain is a pain. I wish he'd never gone there, but I never will myself. I can understand why blokes do, because the ladies flock round you, but I was never a hit with the girls, and the pretence of the situation never felt right to me.

Enough of my dark nights of the soul; at least I'm not John G. The bluffing one-man twat riot.
I quite understand. There are two ways of doing things over there: the official way and the 'effective' way. Sounds like you tried the official way.

BTW I found the whole scene out there very boring too, but that's probably as due to my circumstances as it was to any moral superiority. I did however watch a lot of people (serving, ex-military or pure civvies) crash and burn over there. It's a complicated culture.

Pattaya was the worst as it had what looked like a complete grid square of identical bars, all about 10m by 5m, with a bar in one corner, a pool table, a barmaid, two girls and - about 50% of the time - a ladyboy present, along with the fat, sad, middle-aged western bar owner. The biggest variation was the colour of the baize on the pool table and the sports channel on the TV.
 
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