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Army Bursars - 2nd Lt Rank and they havent got a clue?!

#1
I know i am new to the whole TA thing but surely there is something wrong with the world when someone who is on a Bursary and given the rank of 2nd Lt and isnt able to pass a simple WHT correction NSP a ruddy weapon (leaving the mag on).
 
#3
If it's in the otc then the whole system is screwed up. Take JUO promotions for example. One fellow half kills himself training for and doing the cambrian patrol and doesn't get promoted. Whereas the fellow who takes the easy option of teaching MTQ1 gets promoted within a few weeks of the new intake. Both joined the otc at the same time, do the same MTQ2 course etc and in some cases are in the otc for much longer.

Sorry, I'm not bitter or anything. :roll:
 
#5
Its not just the officers, there were over 2000 of the TA who couldnt pass their WHT on Telic.
the numbers of Regs who were unable to pass has been kept a secret as this may cause the public to lose faith in us but im sure there were 1 or 2
 
#6
You are correct there Pensioner, JUO is usually given when an O/Cdt has taken on a staff position. So an MTQ1 Plt Cmdr or Plt Sgt would qualify you.

Doing something like Cambrian is not a staff appointment! and so does not qualify you for JUO.
 
#8
rockapeMk2 said:
I know i am new to the whole TA thing but surely there is something wrong with the world when someone who is on a Bursary and given the rank of 2nd Lt and isnt able to pass a simple WHT correction NSP a ruddy weapon (leaving the mag on).
Correct me if I'm wrong but surely it's only cadetships that get the automatic 2Lt, the salary and post graduation commitment. Bursars are only expected to attend but only get the (lesser) comitment and (lesser) financial benefit.

Maybe this person in question had completed a SSLC (Gap Year Commission) and hence transferred ti to a TA Gp B afterwards, in such a case I find them failing a WHT after a year with the regular army quite hard to believe.

Any more info rockape?

Also with regard to JUO appointments, the criteria differs from unit to unit from what I've seen. Some are purely on aptitude, enthusiasm and fitness for a career in the army whereas other seem to be based purely on being one of the CO's "Golden Boys". There is no hard or fast rule on this.
 
#9
Cheeky, they are defo on a bursary as they keep going on about it. What is bugging me is that the person concerned is swanning about like they are something special,God help them if they start wanting salutes in the field.... :x
 
#10
I can only speak for the OTC I did MTQ-2 at (Liverpool), but they had the following OTC Ranks (i.e. meaning nothing outside).

1st Year O/Cdt (White strip, rectangular and identifiably different from TA O/Cdt insignia)
2nd Year O/Cdt (as 1st year but with a blue border)
3rd Year O/Cdts had insignia based on appointment:
MTQ-1 Section Commander: 2 thin stripes
MTQ-1 Platoon Sergeant : 3 thing stripes
JUO: 1 thin stripe with a knot type thing over it (worsted knot?)
SUO: 2 thin stripes with the knot
Non-Commissioned Platoon Commander: 3 thin stripes with the knot
2nd Lt: Obviously a pip
Recce Platoon (essentially 4th year cadets who'd had a command appointment, or the overspill if an unusually large no. of Cdts hadn't dropped out) like 2nd year insignia but with a red border.

The JUO's were essentially Cadet CSMs, while the SUO was the cadet RSM.

At the end of the second year, A coy cadets put themselves forward for a job, and had a short course.
 
#11
Am intrigued- what badges are these guys wearing? Your corps badge, or their sponsor unit?
If they were RAMC or similar I could understand, but who else gives cadetships out?
 
#12
1st Year O/Cdt (White strip, rectangular and identifiably different from TA O/Cdt insignia)
2nd Year O/Cdt (as 1st year but with a blue border)
3rd Year O/Cdts had insignia based on appointment:
MTQ-1 Section Commander: 2 thin stripes
MTQ-1 Platoon Sergeant : 3 thing stripes
JUO: 1 thin stripe with a knot type thing over it (worsted knot?)
SUO: 2 thin stripes with the knot
Non-Commissioned Platoon Commander: 3 thin stripes with the knot
2nd Lt: Obviously a pip
Recce Platoon (essentially 4th year cadets who'd had a command appointment, or the overspill if an unusually large no. of Cdts hadn't dropped out) like 2nd year insignia but with a red border.
what the hell o_O

We have; one black stripe, two black stripes, 'pretzel' (juo) & SUO pretzel with 2 black lines
 
#14
We have one thin black stripe on passing MTQ1, two thin black stripes on passing MTQ2 and the pretzel for JUO. We don't do SUO for some reason. Not that we actually need any.
 
#17
London

1st Year O/Cdt (Inishals ULOTC on plain Rank slide)
2nd Year O/Cdt (passed MTQ1) (as 1st year but with a black stripe)
3rd Year O/Cdts (Passed MTQ2) (as 1st year but with two black stripes) or had insignia based on appointment:-
Section Commander (Staff): 3 thin stripes
Platoon Sergeant (JUO) : 1 thin stripe with a knot type thing over it (worsted knot?)
JUOA :(Cdt CSM in charge of 1st years (A Coy)) : 1 thin stripe with a knot type thing over it (worsted knot?)
SUO: 2 thin stripes with the knot
Non-Commissioned Platoon Commander: (don't have such a thing)
2nd Lt: Obviously a pip
 
#18
rockapeMk2 said:
Cheeky, they are defo on a bursary as they keep going on about it. What is bugging me is that the person concerned is swanning about like they are something special,God help them if they start wanting salutes in the field.... :x
Who is this knob, Rockape? I take it they are a Gap Year officer in Athlone, not yet snapped up to do some PC job or something?
 
#19
rockapeMk2 said:
Cheeky, they are defo on a bursary as they keep going on about it. What is bugging me is that the person concerned is swanning about like they are something special,God help them if they start wanting salutes in the field.... :x
What ever their reason for wearing a pip, don't let it worry you, idiots exist at all levels. If its causing you a major problem though I suggest you have a quite word to one of the other subalterns. That'll probably solve it.
 

Unknown_Quantity

War Hero
Moderator
#20
Treat him with the contempt he deserves. Whats he gonna do? B0llock you? Unlikely, the worst he can do is complain up the CofC and that will result in you getting a "you should respect the commission" chat from the adj while he gets reemed by the RSM/coy OC/ CO/ every other subbie for being a complete eijit.
 

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