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Army & a culture of cover up

"Does the Army have a culture of cover up?"

  • YES - Ive seen it in action.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • NO - Never we have nothing to hide.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0
#1
With this latest court marshal linked to Deepcut etc, Sky News is running a poll. The Question is:

"Does the Army have a culture of cover up?"

Well I’m asking the same question to those in the know.

Due to personal experience I say most definitely
 
#2
No doubt about it. Bloody Sunday, Gulf War Syndrome, Deepcut, last year's potentially lethal kit shortages in Iraq, failure of comms during the advance into Kosovo etc, etc.
 
#3
Ah, typical Sky survey:

Does the Army have a culture of cover up?

Very open question, and are any of the respondents to the poll actually in a position to comment with any authority/knowledge/experience, or are they just voting based upon hearsay and media speculation?

Remember, the results of any poll or survery depends upon the question you ask.
 
E

error_unknown

Guest
#4
All hierarchical organisations with a largely (note: largely, not entirely :roll: ) meritocratic promotion system are prone to this because, if you feck up, you don't get promotion; but at the same time, feck ups are usually the result of more than one person's actions. Consequently, people generally do try to cover up their mistakes when they can, and they are often aided and abetted by others who are concerned that their own advancement may be inhibited by the 'feck up'. In some cases, this can become a very large group indeed.

Of course, in some cases, it may be in other individuals' interests to expose feck ups, because they may then gain promotion at the expense of the original 'fecker (or feckers) up'.

Recognise any of this?
 
#5
Good post, chickenpunk.

Have to say that the majority of alleged cover-ups - if that is what they were - have been spectacularly unsuccessful.
 
#8
THe "Army" has no more or less a culture of cover up than any other large organisation.

Blair and his labour party have the biggest cover up culture but what can you expect from a bunch of bottom feeding scum sucking bedwetting tree hugging yellow bellied trash, I've wiped better things than blair off the sole of my boot.
 

X-Inf

War Hero
Book Reviewer
#9
armourer said:
THe "Army" has no more or less a culture of cover up than any other large organisation.

Blair and his labour party have the biggest cover up culture but what can you expect from a bunch of bottom feeding scum sucking bedwetting tree hugging yellow bellied trash, I've wiped better things than blair off the sole of my boot.
So Armourer, you are not very keen on T Bliar and his M8s then :wink:
 
#10
I find myself astonished to agree completely with armourer.

My experience with senior command levels where there has been a fcuk up or potential fcuk up have usually involved people instructing me that we must "be seen to be transparent".

Thus far I have resisted pointing out that if one is transparent, then one cannot be seen...

Of course, I understand from that expression: "It must look as if we are completely open with nothing to hide, whilst at the same time concealing anything that would make us look bad."

Yeah - piece of cake.

IF
 
#11
I certainly wouldn't say that the military in general have any culture of covering things up. If anything there is a culture to try and bring things into the open. Individuals cover things up to cover their own mistakes and there are accidental screw ups that lead to loss of evidence.

There are plenty of organisations that would raise a call if there was any intensional suppression - SSAFA, chaplains, NAO, select committees, the press (good or bad).
 
#13
A friend of mine was stabbed in Germany about 15 years or so back, lost a lung and nearly died in the process. The assailant got a whopping 28 days nick (yes that's right - for almost killing a bloke he got 28 days in the guardroom - after all my mate was a sprog so he didn't count).

My mate went to the med centre a couple of years ago when he wanted to resettle - to see if he should go for a med pension etc and, surprise suprise, every single relevnt piece of medical paperwork surrounding the injury was missing from his FMed4.

Remember the BMed27 records of vaccinations for Op Granby? They all said Bio1, bio2, bio3 etc but there's nothing on the new ones recording what chemicals we had pumped into us any more. Wierd huh?

PD
 
#14
PoisonDwarf said:
Remember the BMed27 records of vaccinations for Op Granby? They all said Bio1, bio2, bio3 etc but there's nothing on the new ones recording what chemicals we had pumped into us any more. Wierd huh?PD
Obviously an admin oversight and nothing at all to do with potential claims for damages against the beloved MoD. 8)
 
#16
If anyones interested I have my a friend of mines FMED from Granby. He'd lost it in theater before they took ours off us to 'store' and found it later indereath the base of his travel bag on our return to Germany. I'll scan it (pixelating his name and number of course as he's still a serving SNCO). The amount of jabs we had is quite disturbing.
 
#19
There is a difference between 'F*ck Up' - i.e. we get it wrong and we all know about it - like kit in Iraq (no one was hiding the fact that we didnt have body armour etc, it was common and public knowledge) etc, and 'Cover Up' which implies a deliberate knowing attempt by someone to erradicate the truth. Despite all of the conspiracy theories I think that that military tends to go for the former rather than the latter.

I hear the point about GW1 vaccinations etc, but were records lost due to incompetence (possibly), or because someone didn't make a record at the time (probably) or because someone in a smoke filled room in MOD issued an order to systematically go through the med records and eradicate the evidence (very unlikely to go unnoticed or unreported by those involved).
 
#20
I'm afraid it is the culture of today - the blame culture.

The bottom line is - very few people have the bo11ocks to own up to their mistakes any more.
 

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