Argentine sub has gone missing.

Lawyer Sonia Krescher said: 'We are going to ask them to refloat it. We need to see the bodies and know what happened.'

She obviously has no idea what a 1200psi wall of water will do... apparently, the sudden compression of the air in the compartments would heat it in excess of 800°C, so well done hamburger...
Individuals who make comments like that, have generally no idea of the technicalities involved in recovering a vessel from that depth, and it could be said that they are, for whatever reason, posturing.
 
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I had thought that the debris field seemed small and initially concluded that this indicated that the submarine must have broken up close to the bottom. Thinking deeper, only the pressure hull would have imploded with the unpressurised casing keeping all the bits together, possibly until the sub struck bottom.
If you look at the footage in the post below yours, you'll see (especially at around 5:10) that the casing is merely perched on the pressure hull, and does not envelop it.
 
It looks and feels more like a railway yard than a high tech shipyard , no budding Brunel myself , but it would not fill me with confidence to know my sub had been re-fitted on the cheap at that place .
Curiously, right next to the sub refit complex in Rosyth was the facility where Babcock overhauled railway rolling stock. I had a tour of the place and was more impressed by the railway stuff than the sub complex.
 
I think you have an unrealistically high impression of how good the wiring loom is in your car. Or in any of our subs.

Using masking tape on splices during a deep refit..... bodge job by barely trained workers.
And the batteries.. no one seems to have any proper paperwork on them, avd no one seems to know wether they were new, refurbished, where the ‘new’ batteries or the ‘new’ cells originated, or wether they were just tarted up to look ‘new’ and the money pocket by corrupt officials.
 
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Using masking tape on splices during a deep refit..... bodge job by barely trained workers.
And the batteries.. no one seems to have any proper paperwork on them, avd no one seems to know wether they were new, refurbished, where the ‘new’ batteries or the ‘new’ cells originated, or wether they were just tarted up to look ‘new’ and the money pocket by corrupt officials.
I'm curious as to how you reached those conclusions. What source(s) other than the video did you use?
 
An article in the US Naval Institute news. Similar content and comments from some who apparently are actually current or former submarine drivers.

US Naval Institute News
 
Read the local press.
There have been some very murky dealings involving the firm that supplied the batteries and some very pointed allegations.
True and some of that is referenced earlier in this thread. It seems corners may have been cut with batteries and air-scrubbers iirc. I don't think the Argentine investigation is complete. I was more suggesting that nothing seemed obviously wrong in the video and it is hard, imo, to get a view of the thoroughness of the job from the film.
 
I'm curious as to how you reached those conclusions. What source(s) other than the video did you use?
There is a lot of stuff about this in the press in Argentina . Usual round of finger pointing going on , but they're concentrating on the fact that the yard was not qualified to carry out the work and also that employment at the yard was handed out as a sinecure for political support to the last government ( Kirchner ).
 
There is a lot of stuff about this in the press in Argentina . Usual round of finger pointing going on , but they're concentrating on the fact that the yard was not qualified to carry out the work and also that employment at the yard was handed out as a sinecure for political support to the last government ( Kirchner ).
It's amazing how much of this quid pro quo is accepted in latin countries as normal. The excuse is that everybody does it so if you don't you are an idiot.

Then to make the most profit possible they cut corners rather than doing a totally professional job. I am as unsurprised as possible to hear this.



As a brief thread divert to give a further idea, some years ago we had a man who did trips round our lake on a type of catamaran. Ex Merchant Marine officer and very professional.

A lakeside bar entered into competition, bought a similar one but then after a time had the batteries doubled in size so he could go faster, overtake the first one and rake in more cash. But he needed extra grills just above the waterline to cool them down. Once up to speed no problem as the grills were raised up.
One day a french tour company with loads of pensioners asked the first one to take them round, he pointed out that because of safety limits and numbers he would need two goes.
The tour guide went to the second who said 'pack them all in' and negotiated an all-in price.
Heavy weight, especially with porky pensioners, it backed away from the mooring and water started going in the grills. 'Luckily' the driver saw what was happening and tried to get back, he failed but had he been just a couple of metres further out the boat would have gone down a steep shelf. As it was we had twenty dead and one who succumbed a few days later, it would have been worse but for a school group of teenagers who went into the water to pull the oldsters out.

The owner eventually went to jail for a light sentence and is back running his bar.
The company who did the alterations and who must have known they were illegal were not blamed.
The tour guide who packed them in and failed in her job has not been sanctioned as far as I am aware.
The Government Department responsible for boats and who did not inspect has not been admonished.
Our Town Council who did send someone to look, but merely issued a friendly personal 'be careful' because the bar owner is crony with local politicians, also received no sanction.

So many levels of responsibility and no actions taken. This is typical of latin dealings and why so many people get away with so much. Because it is so high profile it may unravel on them this time, but while I hope so I won't hold my breath.

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True and some of that is referenced earlier in this thread. It seems corners may have been cut with batteries and air-scrubbers iirc. I don't think the Argentine investigation is complete. I was more suggesting that nothing seemed obviously wrong in the video and it is hard, imo, to get a view of the thoroughness of the job from the film.

The fingers pointing at Adm Lepron, a man with many corrupt fingers in many corrupt pies

Latin American Herald Tribune - Argentine Navy Brass, German Execs Charged with Corruption

He was removed from the submarine contract too after emails discussing payments for services were leaked. His cut for a signature and no questions asked was apparently @ 6%

During his tenure of the refit, the job went from 3 million and new cells, to 5 million and refurbished cells, but no one seems to found any paperwork that prove the batteries were actually properly refurbished or the conformity of any parts as suitable for submarine use. Someones made a killing, literally.
 
Read the local press.
There have been some very murky dealings involving the firm that supplied the batteries and some very pointed allegations.
Similar allegations have been made about the state of our sub's, just a couple of years ago, gentleman by the name of McNielly. The fact that he was an insider, and that his stories were repeated in the press doesn't make them any more true, they are still just unsubstantiated allegations.

From the video, I could see nothing which supported the claims of poor quality regarding either wiring circuitry or battery cells. The stuff in the papers appears to be politically motivated, which doesn't mean it's necessarily untrue, but does mean it isn't entirely reliable.
 
Similar allegations have been made about the state of our sub's, just a couple of years ago, gentleman by the name of McNielly. The fact that he was an insider, and that his stories were repeated in the press doesn't make them any more true, they are still just unsubstantiated allegations.

From the video, I could see nothing which supported the claims of poor quality regarding either wiring circuitry or battery cells. The stuff in the papers appears to be politically motivated, which doesn't mean it's necessarily untrue, but does mean it isn't entirely reliable.

Except he’s been charged with corruption, and the firms involved have beaten a path for the hills and refuse to release any technical paperwork, confirming what parts were supplied, if any, and what technical work was done, if any..

Occams razor...

Yard with no experience of refitting subs - but close contacts with corrupt politicians
Contracts signed off by Instituionally corrupt Admiral involved in large scale contract fraud.
Unexplained cost jumps in contract prices - signed off without demur by said Admiral
No technical paperwork - yet Admiral signs off work without demur
Complaints by crew the work was vastly sub standard and flawed - told by grown ups to shut up and go to sea..

Looks like a wipe over and a coat of shiney paint, smells like a wipe over and a coat of shiney paint.
ARA San Juan May have sat in a shipyard for years, but a technically competent refit doesn’t seem to have been part of the agenda. Ripping off the contract and lining pockets was the key job. If Lepron was the enabler taking a 6% cut, you can be sure everyone else was on the take too.

The wiring work is if a shockingly poor standard of fit and finish. And that’s just the visible stuff that can be seen and checked.
 
Ive skimmed that video and cant see any clearly shocking wiring

If you ignore the Green cables gashed in and jumping - which look to be in work so not an indication of quality

Also the black wiring gashed in up a stanchion of some sort - but that looks a lot like work lighting cables to me so are simply tied out the way.

I didn't spot the taped up splices - but tape may simply be to mark them for inspection
 
And the batteries and ancillary parts…

One of the lines of investigation seems to have found that parts sold by dodgy vendors with the connivance the bent Admiral that were end of life, had no certificates of compliance or had been written off..... what could possibly go wrong?
 

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