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Are you prepared for the Recession?

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
It was the RVI in Newcastle and a stint at a hospital in Carlisle. Make your own assumptions, doesn't mean that they are correct.

If it's purely political, how do you explain that it's a global pandemic and people have and still are dying in sizeable numbers.

check out the figures at the end of the year if they dare publish them. or even check the figures for the last 6 months.

you will find no other causes of death other than C19 because nobody is bothering to record or identify them.

hundreds of different conditions that in the UK equal a few dozen every month will show no deaths for 6 months of the year, flu deaths down, HIV deaths down, etc.....

dying with is still not dying of.

the way they are constantly pushing the agenda is very telling. I saw my customers son this morning. he is smack in the middle of the manchester crisis as an ICU consultant. is he bothered about it - no.
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
Sorry mate, you just sound like a British version of that weird Yankee, he's also in denial.
I'm not in denial of anything - this is not nor has it ever been a thing beyond a hysteria that you lot appear to have bought into lock stock and barrel.

I suppose you must be similar to the covidiots I saw who were walking about in respirators to go shopping with zero understanding of an aseptic technique - something notably absent in hospitals until they realised they had to make it look good for all those tiktok videos.

funny how we have been decimated by a rampant plague and yet the actual death rate is Down on the year. I was told to expect red crosses on house doors with the number of dead inside.
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
the way they are constantly pushing the agenda is very telling. I saw my customers son this morning. he is smack in the middle of the manchester crisis as an ICU consultant. is he bothered about it - no.

Rings true to a faceache discussion on the subject:

2020-08-03_22-58_Dean William.jpg
 

Goatman

ADC
Book Reviewer
To Whom It May Concern - seen elsewhere:

1596492093152.png
 

AfricaExpat

Old-Salt
Rings true to a faceache discussion on the subject:

View attachment 494386
Not surprised given that there are only 67 people on ventilators in England now. Down from 220 on 1st July and 2,872 at the peak in mid April. There is no increase in cases. This article explains why it is down to increased testing, localised testing of hot spots and false postives in the increased testing number.
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
I didn't get this from a neighbours' daughters' parrot, or from a guy in the shop; I got the following gen first hand and is my own experience.

Across England hospitals were at 150% plus of ICU capacity. That's every ICU bed occupied, every post-surgical recovery bed occupied, every pre-planned surge bed occupied and a very high percentage of the extra beds that had been generated by plumbing extra ventilators into normal wards.

It's not always as simple as putting a ventilator next to a normal ward bed by the way. In older hospitals a lot of the medical wards aren't plumbed for oxygen. Even when they are, the extra demands on O2 supplies were unprecedented. A number of hospitals came very, very close to running out of oxygen and had to close their doors to new admissions and start transferring patients to hospitals with capacity. It's not normally a good thing to move a critical care patient by the way, and is only done when to not do so poses a significant risk to outcomes.

Many hospitals' critical care capacity was affected by the availability of staff. I forget the exact ratio, but it's more than 1:1 in an ICU. When critical care staff were unavailable because they were sick themselves, or quarantined because they may be, or shielding, then yes some beds were empty. Because there was no staff to care for someone who may have filled them.

This was not in London, not in Birmingham, Manchester or Leeds. This was in a relatively rural region. The peak was lower than had been planned for it's true. It was also shorter. But it was a very close run thing that was mitigated by the lockdown.

So yeah, @Grumblegrunt is full of shit.
lol nice fairy tale.

my cousin is an ICU nurse, I was chatting to an ICU consultant today - this was never a thing in the north, or pretty much anywhere else for that matter. even when made every death a c19 death they still failed to reach the heights of the 2014 flu epidemic which was the worst year for a while..

staffing problems were because too many decided to take some extra holiday, the NHS didn't care they had 14bn of bad management debt written off.

ICU staff were not working as ICU staff at all because the beds were empty of just not required due to all the surgery being cancelled. the real NHS heroes were the HCAs who couldn't afford the time off with many on full FLU wards full of old folks with compicated heath needs at the best of times and only ONE qualified nurse on duty. odd when the rest of the hospitals have been empty.

no nightingale beds have been used - why is that if ICUs were at 150% capacity surely this was so virulent we should have been burying bodies in pits or burning them in mass pyres.

london had it bad because london has too many people for too few beds with many being susceptible due to their ethnicity. C19 is racist.

this is a complicated zooanotic virus that needs watching in case it pinches a decent mutation from another single strain RNA virus but it was never the biblical plague prophesied in the book of Brexit.

even the Politicians called bullshit on fergusons models when he failed miserably to back them up.

and of course he himself was obviously so worried about it.......

odd how all those protests by those peaceful BLM types spitting all over each other has not seen any increases in either infections or hospitisations.

168,000 NHS hospital beds - only 1900 currently occupied with C19 cases (the most dangerous virus EVER to infect the UK according to the doom mongers). - 1.1%, at its peak less than 10% of beds were taken up by covid cases of which recovered with little or no medical intervention - yep the NHS is straining at the seams.

even New York only saw a 10% ICU occupancy and that was before they released that ventilators killed..
 

lert

LE
lol nice fairy tale.

my cousin is an ICU nurse, I was chatting to an ICU consultant today - this was never a thing in the north, or pretty much anywhere else for that matter. even when made every death a c19 death they still failed to reach the heights of the 2014 flu epidemic which was the worst year for a while..

staffing problems were because too many decided to take some extra holiday, the NHS didn't care they had 14bn of bad management debt written off.

ICU staff were not working as ICU staff at all because the beds were empty of just not required due to all the surgery being cancelled. the real NHS heroes were the HCAs who couldn't afford the time off with many on full FLU wards full of old folks with compicated heath needs at the best of times and only ONE qualified nurse on duty. odd when the rest of the hospitals have been empty.

no nightingale beds have been used - why is that if ICUs were at 150% capacity surely this was so virulent we should have been burying bodies in pits or burning them in mass pyres.

london had it bad because london has too many people for too few beds with many being susceptible due to their ethnicity. C19 is racist.

this is a complicated zooanotic virus that needs watching in case it pinches a decent mutation from another single strain RNA virus but it was never the biblical plague prophesied in the book of Brexit.

even the Politicians called bullshit on fergusons models when he failed miserably to back them up.

and of course he himself was obviously so worried about it.......

odd how all those protests by those peaceful BLM types spitting all over each other has not seen any increases in either infections or hospitisations.

168,000 NHS hospital beds - only 1900 currently occupied with C19 cases (the most dangerous virus EVER to infect the UK according to the doom mongers). - 1.1%, at its peak less than 10% of beds were taken up by covid cases of which recovered with little or no medical intervention - yep the NHS is straining at the seams.

even New York only saw a 10% ICU occupancy and that was before they released that ventilators killed..
Except it's not a fairy tail, it's my own experience.

Very, very few Nightingale beds were used for two reasons -

The surge capacity that was generated in existing hospitals turned out to be enough.

Trusts worked incredibly hard not to send patients there. Like I said, moving critical care patients is a last resort.

So maybe your cousin's experience is not reflective of the national one. Maybe the ICU consultant you were chatting too was ready to give some lowdown scoop to a random bloke. I don't know.

I do know that the NHS came very close to being overwhelmed. CV-19 is a properly nasty illness that even if it doesn't kill you can proper **** you up.
 
Hays travel made 20% of its workforce redundant this morning - over 850 staff going.

30% of FTSE 250 plane manufacturer going with 20% already gone and a further 10% gone yesterday.

funnily enough - the furlough scheme changed yesterday.
 
Hays travel made 20% of its workforce redundant this morning - over 850 staff going.

30% of FTSE 250 plane manufacturer going with 20% already gone and a further 10% gone yesterday.

funnily enough - the furlough scheme changed yesterday.


Still its good for the longer term economy - the FTSE 100 had a very big one day increase yesterday so things must be looking positive to the City of London

Archie
 
Still its good for the longer term economy - the FTSE 100 had a very big one day increase yesterday so things must be looking positive to the City of London

Archie

it will be interesting to look at the companies that make up the FTSE in 4 years. I suspect 20% of them will not make the list. That said, companies will for the most part survive. It’s the people that I’d be concerned about
 
lots of queries about vaccines that have additives nobody knows why it is in there. aluminium and mercury compounds,

Usually added to kick start a generalised response by macrophage cells so that they can promote an antibody based response.

ETA or a T cell response at clonal selection if available.
 
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What about cases when people got COVID19 for the second time? Didn't their immune system produced antibodies?

In the first instance, I would want a reference for this, ie a specific case.

However,
1] An antibody response needs B lymphocytes to clone. This is not always possible or possible but inefficient with a new pathogen. B lymphocytes give rise to classes of cells that make antibodies.
2] If it is possible, the assumption would be that some cells are kept as "memory cells" in the body to again make antibodies ( in a convoluted way) on re infection. If the first adaptive ( antibody ) response was inadequate, re infection could occur.

But:

1] I would normally expect a full T cell response in the thymus gland which would be retained as a memory for re infection to adequately deal with the pathogen on re infection, so someone should not get re infected

But:

1] Compromise to the antibody response or any factor in the adaptive immune response would result in re infection. Such would be with:

a] Age.
b] Chemicals/radiation either accidental or deliberate such as chemo and radio therapy and immune suppression due to transplants, auto immune conditions and so on.
c] Unlucky genetic pre disposition.

To sum up and short answer your question:

Some people could be re infected and be symptomatic ( there is a difference) having made antibodies but this would be very rare.

Such people would likely be compromised as above.
 
so you did vote remain then.
I'm not in denial of anything - this is not nor has it ever been a thing beyond a hysteria that you lot appear to have bought into lock stock and barrel.

I suppose you must be similar to the covidiots I saw who were walking about in respirators to go shopping with zero understanding of an aseptic technique - something notably absent in hospitals until they realised they had to make it look good for all those tiktok videos.

funny how we have been decimated by a rampant plague and yet the actual death rate is Down on the year. I was told to expect red crosses on house doors with the number of dead inside.
I take my advice from the real professors, not the arrse ones, like yourself.
 
lol nice fairy tale.

my cousin is an ICU nurse, I was chatting to an ICU consultant today - this was never a thing in the north, or pretty much anywhere else for that matter. even when made every death a c19 death they still failed to reach the heights of the 2014 flu epidemic which was the worst year for a while..

staffing problems were because too many decided to take some extra holiday, the NHS didn't care they had 14bn of bad management debt written off.

ICU staff were not working as ICU staff at all because the beds were empty of just not required due to all the surgery being cancelled. the real NHS heroes were the HCAs who couldn't afford the time off with many on full FLU wards full of old folks with compicated heath needs at the best of times and only ONE qualified nurse on duty. odd when the rest of the hospitals have been empty.

no nightingale beds have been used - why is that if ICUs were at 150% capacity surely this was so virulent we should have been burying bodies in pits or burning them in mass pyres.

london had it bad because london has too many people for too few beds with many being susceptible due to their ethnicity. C19 is racist.

this is a complicated zooanotic virus that needs watching in case it pinches a decent mutation from another single strain RNA virus but it was never the biblical plague prophesied in the book of Brexit.

even the Politicians called bullshit on fergusons models when he failed miserably to back them up.

and of course he himself was obviously so worried about it.......

odd how all those protests by those peaceful BLM types spitting all over each other has not seen any increases in either infections or hospitisations.

168,000 NHS hospital beds - only 1900 currently occupied with C19 cases (the most dangerous virus EVER to infect the UK according to the doom mongers). - 1.1%, at its peak less than 10% of beds were taken up by covid cases of which recovered with little or no medical intervention - yep the NHS is straining at the seams.

even New York only saw a 10% ICU occupancy and that was before they released that ventilators killed..

As someone who works for the NHS as a head of department and having been involved with COVID planning and support throughout the pandemic at one of the biggest hospitals in the country, I would just like to point out. You're talking shit.
 
As someone who works for the NHS as a head of department and having been involved with COVID planning and support throughout the pandemic at one of the biggest hospitals in the country, I would just like to point out. You're talking shit.

B0ll0cks.

I cant not reveal the source but there are 220 (ish) NHS Trusts in NHS England and many Trusts have multiple hospitals. A request went out for data for the centre to analyse - specifically they wanted chest x-rays of Covid patients.

Care to guess how many of the NHS England hospitals responded - not Trusts (with multiple hospitals) - hospitals. Go on. Have a guess.










18. Fcuking 18 hospitals.

NHS my arrse. the hospitals are empty.

220 people made redundant last week in one of the Clinical Support Units. There are 136 Clinical Commissioning Groups in NHS England. A CCG is basically a collection of GP practices and the CSUs provide support services to them GP practices. The reason for the redundancies is because the GPs are not making any referrals to hospitals for operations, scans etc, so they have laid off the support team because the have fcuk all to do.

Do you know how the NHS economy works?

GPs get paid for referrals. The hospitals get paid by the DoH for carrying out the treatment/operations.

One of the largest suppliers to the NHS has seen a 70% collapse in revenues because there are no operations being performed. They are currently sat on $50m of inventory in their supply chain that has not moved for 6 months.

Come back when you know what you are talking about.

Just off to clap for the NHS and stick my flag up.

Enjoy the pay rise. I took a 30% pay cut and my mrs took 15%.
 
Given my job I suspect I know far more about the inner workings of the NHS than you. Based on what you've had to say I would suggest you know very little and/or have no understanding as to why those GP referral numbers are down. Also, if the hospitals are so empty why does the one I'm sitting in just now currently have 36 more in patients than we have beds for (we have >1,000 beds)? That's a good day btw.

Maybe, just maybe, you and a couple of other posters on here are posting about things you don't actually have a bloody clue about.
 
I take my advice from the real professors, not the arrse ones, like yourself.

There are such things as Arrse professors but regrettably the case in question is mere Arrse ranting.
Might've been a bit funny if we weren't talking about maintaining the health of the population.
 
You appear to know far more about the inner workings of the NHS than NHS employees would like the public to know so we can't fool you into thinking what a fantastically efficient service it is an how hard-done-to NHS staff are . Based on what you've had to say you know how the NHS trading economy works and its unfortunate you can reference what is happening to suppliers to the NHS. You've obviously been told what is really going on which is why you are able to quote real numbers as to why those GP referral numbers are down. Also, I'm not going to tell you what Trust I work in so you cant challenge my statement which is if the hospitals are so empty why does the one I'm sitting in just now currently have 36 more in patients than we have beds for (we have >1,000 beds)? That's a good day btw.

Damn. I seem to be speaking to someone who knows what a sham the NHS is and he's go his finger on the pulse with real data which I cant challenge cause its true.

Some minor tweaks to your response to reflect reality.
 
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