Anyone know anything about swords?

I've been recently volunteering with a local police force's museum. We recently took it over from a period of disuse, and we're sifting through what we have. Upon opening a cupboard we found a right assortment of cutlery, which none of us know anything about. What I suspect is, we have a large collection of utterly unremarkable scrap metal in various pointy shapes, stabbing rioters, for the use of. But on the off chance this isn't the case, I thought I'd ask around to see if anyone can ashed any light.

Exhibit A:
Two swords, marked "Made in India" and a very confusing series of features. On one hand it appears they've put some patterning on the blade and they've got these soft velvet scabbards. On the flip side the pommel a nut threaded onto a screw that forms the grip with some cheap nasty wood around it. It screams something trying to look a lot flashier than it is. All I can think of is a Khyber Pass Enfield, or similar.


Exhibit B
Two different basket hilted straight swords. Very little in markings on either. One carries "AA.5.95" and "88 WD" on the scabbard. The second mark has some kind of arrow over the top of it, which puts me in mind of makers marks you get on headstamps. The other sword is utterly devoid of markings, but does have a crest etched into the blade, and a stamped circle just above the hilt.


The mystery mark on the sword with the etched blade:


The scabbard markings, which belong to the second sword:



We also have a large collection (~20) of general issue cutlass, to be handed out en mass to the coppers for dealing with rioters.

Any help would be gratefully received.
Thanks.
 
One of them is a 53-pattern Cavalry sabre.
 
Keep the Pointy bit away from you, and vigorously poke towards the enemy. That's all I know about swords, hope this was of some help.
 

Ritch

LE
Keep the Pointy bit away from you, and vigorously poke towards the enemy. That's all I know about swords, hope this was of some help.
Beat me to it.

I was just going to say, "they're sharp".
 
Exhibit A looks like the sort of thing of sale on my local market in the 1970's, made in India or similar and retailing at ~ £15

Exhibit B lower looks like a standard UK officers sword, modern [since c1900] pattern. Presumably there isn't a regimental badge on the hilt. Upper is harder but I suspect a 1820-1900 pattern cavalry sabre. Below are the 1853 and 1885 models
1575482603006.png

1575482698654.png
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
Swords are for fixing before going over the top
 
Exhibit A looks to be the style I see at flea markets in Canada to this day, tacky wall hanger junk that chavs do battle with in the living room on Friday nights......
 
The two Indian items would seem to have been produced purely for the decorative market and aimed at Westerners.

They can't make up their mind whether they are Indian 'talwar'-style swords or British Raj weapons. The full basket hilt was not usually the case for a true Talwar (and the metal for the basket seems to be very thin).

The foot of the scabbard is pure Western with the large spade-like metal work: again, not usually seen with true Talwars.
 
I've been recently volunteering with a local police force's museum. We recently took it over from a period of disuse, and we're sifting through what we have. Upon opening a cupboard we found a right assortment of cutlery, which none of us know anything about. What I suspect is, we have a large collection of utterly unremarkable scrap metal in various pointy shapes, stabbing rioters, for the use of. But on the off chance this isn't the case, I thought I'd ask around to see if anyone can ashed any light.

Exhibit A:
Two swords, marked "Made in India" and a very confusing series of features. On one hand it appears they've put some patterning on the blade and they've got these soft velvet scabbards. On the flip side the pommel a nut threaded onto a screw that forms the grip with some cheap nasty wood around it. It screams something trying to look a lot flashier than it is. All I can think of is a Khyber Pass Enfield, or similar.


Exhibit B
Two different basket hilted straight swords. Very little in markings on either. One carries "AA.5.95" and "88 WD" on the scabbard. The second mark has some kind of arrow over the top of it, which puts me in mind of makers marks you get on headstamps. The other sword is utterly devoid of markings, but does have a crest etched into the blade, and a stamped circle just above the hilt.


The mystery mark on the sword with the etched blade:


The scabbard markings, which belong to the second sword:



We also have a large collection (~20) of general issue cutlass, to be handed out en mass to the coppers for dealing with rioters.

Any help would be gratefully received.
Thanks.

Nevermind all this guff about what they are, as a Tax payer I want to know why all this issue equipment has been sat doing nothing when there is Ruffians and rapscallions out there needing a good dose of cold steel.
Tell whomever is in charge I will be contacting my MP and the Home secretary...

Yours Outraged of Dunny-on-the-Wold.
 

Helm

MIA
Moderator
Book Reviewer
The top ones are as said tatt, the others I suspect may be either replicas or local manufactured for issue
 
One of them is a 53-pattern Cavalry sabre.
Excellent! That looks bang on.

Exhibit B lower looks like a standard UK officers sword, modern [since c1900] pattern. Presumably there isn't a regimental badge on the hilt. Upper is harder but I suspect a 1820-1900 pattern cavalry sabre. Below are the 1853 and 1885 models
View attachment 434928
View attachment 434929
Thanks!


Nevermind all this guff about what they are, as a Tax payer I want to know why all this issue equipment has been sat doing nothing when there is Ruffians and rapscallions out there needing a good dose of cold steel.
Tell whomever is in charge I will be contacting my MP and the Home secretary...

Yours Outraged of Dunny-on-the-Wold.
Here this should calm your outrage.

One of ours has so many dents in its blade you could use it as a wood saw.
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
Greenjacket!
How dare you sir


We weren’t fond of issuing the pointy bits in our Bn as marching at the trail was risky enough but on the final Bn attack on B range Sennelager in 1984 and the CO ordered, “Light Infantry will fix bayonets” I did get a little bit excited especially as I had blagged a proper rifle instead of my usual smg

Two years later fixing bayonets on my smg for a company attack on onion mountain seemed a bit pointless if you get me!
 
How dare you sir


We weren’t fond of issuing the pointy bits in our Bn as marching at the trail was risky enough but on the final Bn attack on B range Sennelager in 1984 and the CO ordered, “Light Infantry will fix bayonets” I did get a little bit excited especially as I had blagged a proper rifle instead of my usual smg

Two years later fixing bayonets on my smg for a company attack on onion mountain seemed a bit pointless if you get me!
Well in amongst our cutlery collection we do have a rather nice little hanger. When I drew it my first thought was "Gladius" from the length and shape of the blade. Then someone pointed out Baker Rifle sword bayonet for the hilt. So combine those two into one and you get a really nice little poking thing.
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
I got issued a Sword Frog but was then told we did not carry swords which was a shame as I had a nice Wilkinson Sword.

However I now see that Officers of my Corps are carrying Swords on various parades. God alone knows how. It was difficult enough getting some of us to drill as it was.
 
Exhibit A looks to be the style I see at flea markets in Canada to this day, tacky wall hanger junk that chavs do battle with in the living room on Friday nights......
I hope you are in the pub and not at home on a Friday night
 
I've been recently volunteering with a local police force's museum. We recently took it over from a period of disuse, and we're sifting through what we have. Upon opening a cupboard we found a right assortment of cutlery, which none of us know anything about. What I suspect is, we have a large collection of utterly unremarkable scrap metal in various pointy shapes, stabbing rioters, for the use of. But on the off chance this isn't the case, I thought I'd ask around to see if anyone can ashed any light.

Exhibit A:
Two swords, marked "Made in India" and a very confusing series of features. On one hand it appears they've put some patterning on the blade and they've got these soft velvet scabbards. On the flip side the pommel a nut threaded onto a screw that forms the grip with some cheap nasty wood around it. It screams something trying to look a lot flashier than it is. All I can think of is a Khyber Pass Enfield, or similar.


Exhibit B
Two different basket hilted straight swords. Very little in markings on either. One carries "AA.5.95" and "88 WD" on the scabbard. The second mark has some kind of arrow over the top of it, which puts me in mind of makers marks you get on headstamps. The other sword is utterly devoid of markings, but does have a crest etched into the blade, and a stamped circle just above the hilt.


The mystery mark on the sword with the etched blade:


The scabbard markings, which belong to the second sword:



We also have a large collection (~20) of general issue cutlass, to be handed out en mass to the coppers for dealing with rioters.

Any help would be gratefully received.
Thanks.
I will put £30 into the Police Benevolent Fund or Help for Heroes or Your Pocket if you can proff one of those cutlasses.
 

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