Anyone able to enlighten me on this one?

#1
What was the radar cross-section of the last-model Mosquito fighter-bomber?

Tam
 
#2
stick a large IKEA bedroom-set on top of a white van, then drive up and down any major UK runway in the dark to see if your noticed.

have fun..............
 
#3
Is this a trick question?
 

maguire

LE
Book Reviewer
#5
Did it have one,it was made out of wood.
the material its made out of isnt as important as the shape. (IIRC the B-49 was far smaller than the similar sized B-47 due to the flying wing shape with very few sharp corners and flat vertical surfaces). it probably would have been pretty smaller than a Lancaster, say, but still fairly easily detectable. the props and the vertical fin would show up quite well I would imagine from my laymans knowledge of the subject. I'm sure there are people here who know more than I regarding this.
 
#7
I was under the impression that both the Boche and British early warning radar systems had bother picking up the Mosquito at all, even when they were not doing their usual "flying so low that the observers could pick up flowers for their girlfriends" thing.

Tam
 
#8
I would think minimal, because I'm pretty sure wood is non-reflective when it comes to radar waves.

There would be some off any bombs, guns, sights, engines, fire extinguishers and the like, but not a huge amount.
 
#9
This is why I love this site!

What an 'off the wall' question.

Tam, the question that needs to be answered is: Why do you want to know??

Best of luck anyway!!
 
#10
I have an idea but it needs working on. Anyway, wouldn't lots of civvy fliers absolutely love to get hold of new-built, certified fit to fly, very fast two-engined beauties, where if you did manage to damage one, you could get spare parts from the nearest forest? :cool:

Tam
 
#11
I have an idea but it needs working on. Anyway, wouldn't lots of civvy fliers absolutely love to get hold of new-built, certified fit to fly, very fast two-engined beauties, where if you did manage to damage one, you could get spare parts from the nearest forest? :cool:

Tam
Good reply and best of luck.

And yes, probably the most beautiful aircraft of WW2

PS if you need a hand let me know!!!
 
#12
I have an idea but it needs working on. Anyway, wouldn't lots of civvy fliers absolutely love to get hold of new-built, certified fit to fly, very fast two-engined beauties, where if you did manage to damage one, you could get spare parts from the nearest forest? :cool:

Tam
theres a bloke in NZ who has built a mould to make Mozzie fuselages, hes restoring one at the mo, with the idea of making other from scratch.

Mosquito Aircraft Restoration, Auckland New Zealand
 
#13
Bloody hell, this is up there with some of the random questions my Mushroomettes come out with!

As someone whose career has been centred upon radar use, both on the ground and from the air, I shall attempt to answer.

Firstly, it is a misconception that wood is the purveyor of some mythical stealth quality. It probably has a degree of radar absorbency at certain wavelengths, but not much. RCS is far more reliant upon shape and the application of radar absorbent material than construction material per se.

In addition, whilst the Mossie airframe was largely built of wood, the engine nacelles, principle control surfaces and propellers were metal; the latter in particular present a very tasty radar signature.

During WWII, the Mossie was routinely tracked by German radar. However, only the type’s superlative speed and altitude performance made it such a difficult target to engage. Indeed, Heinz Knoke’s seminal book ‘I Flew for the Fuhrer’ describes how air-air destruction of a Mosquito was considered particularly noteworthy. As a result, special units using supercharged variants of several types (notably the bf109 and Ju88) were developed with the specific aim of challenging Mosquito ops; highly accurate Oboe bombing of German cities being especially annoying to Goering (he was famously vexed on 20 Jan 43, the 10th anniversary of the Nazi’s seizure of power, when a carefully timed Mosquito attack knocked out the main Berlin broadcasting station and put his live speech off air!).

However, it was not until the arrival of Me262 jets (a small number of which were equipped with Neptun radar) very late in the war that the Mosquito was properly challenged at high level. As mentioned, the Mossie was also employed in low level strike and intruder ops which also reduced or avoided radar detection times.

Therefore, whilst I can’t give an exact RCS figure Tam, I suspect that the Mossie had a relatively average RCS for an aircraft of it’s size. Luftwaffe radar was able to track it throughout the war and only its outstanding performance allowed such a low attrition rate.

Regards,
MM
 
#14
Thanks for that MM, it sort of blows a lot of the myths about the Mosquito being the first stealth fighter out of the water.
Now what to do about those metal engine nacelles, control surfaces and propellors? What to do, what to do?
(disappears into metaphorical shed and starts plotting)

Tam
 
#15
Thanks for that MM, it sort of blows a lot of the myths about the Mosquito being the first stealth fighter out of the water.
Now what to do about those metal engine nacelles, control surfaces and propellors? What to do, what to do?
(disappears into metaphorical shed and starts plotting)

Tam
What about modern composites, such as carbon fibre? RAM paint? Also, don't forget the air intakes inboard of the nacelles - they'd be pretty good trihedral reflectors! Funny you should raise this thread, I have a colleague (light blue) at work who's been thinking along the same lines... It would make a great "sports tourer"!
 
#16
As I said, Manod, I have an idea, at the moment it is pretty embryonic but I will do some work to mature it a bit more. Thanks for the input, and I agree, Mossys would rock bells in civvy rig.

Tam
 
#18
As I said, Manod, I have an idea, at the moment it is pretty embryonic but I will do some work to mature it a bit more. Thanks for the input, and I agree, Mossys would rock bells in civvy rig.

Tam
I disagree. Military aircraft look decidedly gay in civvy colours. The only exception is when they're stripped down to bare metal and polished. This looks best with the late mark or post-war piston-engined fighters.

Damned hard to find pictures of 'em though. I remember seeing several of them in Aeroplane magazine yonks ago - must have been a fad. People these days have no taste.


Contra Mustang - Ruined by homosexual metallic green wings.

I'd like to have a mirror-polished Sea Fury, or late mark Spitfire. And some slaveys to polish it of course . . . well a man can dream. :drool:
 
#19
Hum, as an old Licensed Aircraft Engineer I can assure you
"if you did manage to damage one, you could get spare parts from the nearest forest?"
Is a non starter, only specially approved/certified wood can be used and specialist woodworkers capable of doing the job as getting like Rocking Horse, jobby.

john
Broke my heart when the last UK one crashed at Barton.
Cup of
Nice shot showing the air intake to the Radiator the feature that gave the Mustang it's Speed.
 

the_boy_syrup

LE
Book Reviewer
#20
Bloody hell, this is up there with some of the random questions my Mushroomettes come out with!

As someone whose career has been centred upon radar use, both on the ground and from the air, I shall attempt to answer.

Regards,
MM
MM I was once told that a decent radar operator would be able to track any aircraft as even modern stealth aircraft return some sort of radar signature
would you (within Opsec limits) agree with that?

IIRC RAF Reg proved it by locking a Yank stealth aircraft up with rapier at Farnbourgh
 

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