Any Friendly Landowners?

Discussion in 'Shooting, Hunting and Fishing' started by Flying Felix, Mar 9, 2009.

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  1. Long story short.

    Lancs police are not following the recommendations from ACPO in reference to sound moderators for target shooting. So I’m after any friendly landowners in either the Lancs or Warwickshire area for rough shooting.

    Help please.
  2. Sorry I can't help, but I'm curious as to what you mean about Lancs police? Are they only allowing sound mods for sporting shooting?

    Are you a BASC member? If so, perhaps you should try contacting them?

  3. msr

    msr LE

    GMP don't follow the ACPO guidelines for firearms cabinets.

    Formal complaint submitted.

  4. Flying Felix

    Check your pm.

  5. As I understand it, even if you only use the rifle for range work, if you state you want a mod for hearing protection, over and above that provided by ear defenders and to reduce noise to those in the vicinity that may not be wearing hearing protection, they will be hard pressed not to oblige. If someones hearing is damaged then, in these days of blame, they would be equally culpable in not mitigating the risk.

    Have you spoken to either the NRA or BASC?
  6. Below is a copy of the letter I sent after the first refusal

    "Dear Mr XXXX,

    Mr XXXXX has in formed me today of your initial decision to deny my application for a variation for sound moderators for my rifles. I was most disappointed to hear of your stance, in that you will not approve a variation in association with target shooting, especially in light of the letter from Mr James Hart QPM BSc PhD FIMgt (Assistant Commissioner) on behalf of the ACPO Administration of Firearms and Explosives Licensing Sub-Committee to the Chief Constables dated 8 April 01.

    In his letter, he clearly states that sound moderators used in full bore rifles have a beneficial effect in reducing damage to the shooters hearing and bringing the noise levels to within safe EU limits. There is also a beneficial effect in reducing environmental noise. It goes on to state that the ACPO has revised its guidance to reflect this and although it is centred around the taking of live quarry the committee’s view is that it is also applies to target shooting.

    Therefore the good reasons for my application for a variation for sound moderators for my rifles are:

    To have the ability to reduce the risk of damaging my hearing whilst shooting.

    To have the ability to conduct marksmanship coaching with reduced levels of hearing protection to facilitate communication.

    To have the ability to bring noise levels to within safe EU limits.

    To have the ability to apply, as good practice, the principles of Regulation 7 of the Noise at Work Regulations, 1989.

    To have the ability to apply, as good practice, the principles of the Health and Safety at Work Act, in order to reduce the risk to As Low As Practical whilst producing a Risk Assessment.

    To have the ability to reduce the recoil of the firearm by 30%.

    I have a verbal agreement to allow me conduct vermin control on MoD land at XXXXXXXX and in the near future I will be submitting a variation to allow vermin control and expanding ammunition.

    I was told that your decision was also based upon “the NRAs policy on sound moderators”. I have spoken to the NRA about their “policy on sound moderators” and they have stated that they have not released nor have any policy regarding sound moderators, so as you can imagine I’m a little confused on this point.

    I hope that in light of the above points and in line with ACPOs guidelines you agree that the use of sound moderators for target shooting is “good reason” and you look with favour on my application for this variation. I look forward to receiving your reply soon.

    Yours sincerely"

    Their stance is that unless everybody at the club uses sound moderators, or it is in the club rules that everybody has to use one, then target shooting is not a "good reason", which is contradictory to ACPOs recommendations.

    It even turns out that the Firearms licensing officer was on the committee that passed the motion in 2001!

    I'm sure I would win on appeal, but I'm still waiting to get my licence back and I'll need to find out the process for the appeal.
  7. What organisations are you in? The only way to deal with these cnuts is to face them down.
  8. Biped

    Biped LE Book Reviewer

    The BASC is a fantastic organisation for facing them down if you (and BASC) think you have a point.

    The ex-head of Firearms in my area got jumped all over a few times by the BASC (and lost) over his interpretations of Firearms laws in the courts.

    Above all, COMMON SENSE is what matters with the interpretation of these laws. There is no common sense reason why moderators for rifles should be restricted - it doesn't make them more dangerous - especially considering the firearms are licenced to users, unlike, for example, moderated firearms in the hands of crims.
  9. Agreed ref BASC
  10. Biped

    Biped LE Book Reviewer

    What's your take on mods?
  11. I don't see any reason for them to remain on Section 1 at all. An unchambered barrel isn't even on Section 1!
  12. ugly

    ugly LE Moderator

    If needed I can help re land, regular usage can be once a year! Be way doon sooth though mucker!
  13. Thanks to all,

    What a great response. :lol:

    I’m in the NRA and will now join the BASC. I was a little apprehensive about contacting the BASC straight off as my plan was to get the rifles (they’re still waiting for collection) get back on the range and then move onto rough shooting. Seemed a little hypocritical to contact BASC for a target shooting argument.

    The tack now will be to obtain land forms from the willing landowners, and submit them so I can get the variation and pick up my guns.

    I know that I’m going to need some training – I’ve got no idea which furry little woodland creatures can end up on the dinner plate legally, and what is classed as vermin.

    I was due to be posted to Canada last year, hence the ordering of a couple of rifles with sound moderators. Hoping for bear stakes for Christmas dinner.
  14. Ugly,

    By all accounts’ you're the Yoda of the shooting world and certainly worth meeting up with.

    By the way, is it true that you can shoot anything as long as you scream "It's coming straight for us!" as per Southpark? :wink:
  15. Just run at 'em screaming!