Antennas and Propogation - A Dying Art

#1
Why do we train operators in so many different types of antennas during A&P when all they do on exercise is put up a droppy dipole.

Why do they always insist on using Clansman Braid instead of coppper wire or D10 .

And, are the only operators on this forum TA?
 
#2
I used to think along similar lines until a recent exercise when I visited a det and found a full R4 dipole strung between two trees.
 
#3
WhiteHorse said:
I used to think along similar lines until a recent exercise when I visited a set and found a full R4 dipole strung between two trees.
Were u sure, not cammoflagued 12m's?

Narks me I can get sent out on a limb but stilll get comms in on HF/VHF on the first antenna's I try (sloping wire and VHF on a Marconni tower - the original Marconni) and dets on the mainland are still struggling
 
#4
I think it boils down to the Det Comd, if he/she is a good one they will work it "heights and gains" until its perfect and always go for the one thats best on the day, problem is that half the time the crew arrive and are told "use that car park" and are given a bit of gravel or a tennis court size bit of land cos the HQ is the size of wembly and taken all the good sites for vehicle parking.
 
#5
Yep think so to. Heights and gains isn't understood, drop into advice 2nd Fresnel zones is the reason ur comms aint working and the eys glaze over. Or mention height is an important factor on longer range HF links.....
 
#6
Ragnar said:
Yep think so to. Heights and gains isn't understood, drop into advice 2nd Fresnel zones is the reason ur comms aint working and the eys glaze over. Or mention height is an important factor on longer range HF links.....
Last time I mentioned the 2nd Fresnel zone on exercise somebody thought I was talking about artillery. Let's just admit it, since working CW stopped being a skill that every operator had to master, the "young 'uns" just haven't got a clue. I mean, they think that morse is something only 'Special Operators' have to use instead of your first IA of difficult comms.
 
#8
WhiteHorse said:
Fresnel Zones, I've found my long lost family :D
You'll be on about your 'Ionospheric Prediction Charts' and 'Map of Great Circles' next! :D
 
#10
Blimey I've wandered into a lost world 8O
 
#11
Ragnar said:
Why do we train operators in so many different types of antennas during A&P when all they do on exercise is put up a droppy dipole.
Coz it always works!

Ragnar said:
Why do they always insist on using Clansman Braid instead of coppper wire or D10 .
And, are the only operators on this forum TA?
Coz most sprogs need the little coloured things to count more than 10!
and I am not TA or a senior like most ppl here seem to be.

one last thing -

THEY DROPPED MORSE???!?!??!?!?!?!

to be replaced by ....?
 
#13
Ragnar said:
...
Why do they always insist on using Clansman Braid instead of coppper wire .....
Have you ever tried persuading the QM to demand a reel of 500m of R4? He will usually shuffle into the corner, have 3 minor heart-attacks and mumble something about "Budgets" before returning with the Blanket Stacker's DS Answer - "Dues Out" :D

Ghost
 
#15
MUFs, LUFs and OWFs can't be far from this thread now - ah, it's all coming back. The fact that BOWMAN HF is working well, and providing really good Z speech over significant ranges on TELIC, might just mean that all this stuff comes back into circulation since it disappeared as CW went out - it'd be nice to see and would separate the boys from the men among operators.
 
#16
Donny said:
MUFs, LUFs and OWFs can't be far from this thread now - ah, it's all coming back. The fact that BOWMAN HF is working well, and providing really good Z speech over significant ranges on TELIC, might just mean that all this stuff comes back into circulation since it disappeared as CW went out - it'd be nice to see and would separate the boys from the men among operators.
Donny u left out NVIS
 
#17
Ragnar said:
Ghost_Rider said:
Have you ever tried persuading the QM to demand a reel of 500m of R4?
No but I issue what I have left and I still get it back (with the chain link insulators)
Used to keep my secret stash in the top of my bergan two coils, enough for a 2Mhz dipole. Bit heavy, but I was moving by FFR.
 
#19
Only did that the once when "quickly " re tasked from FFR to Inf on ex. Wouldnt have been a problem but I had the 320 as well!

Edited due to crap spelling
 
#20
Ragnar said:
Donny u left out NVIS
Ah, yes but, of course, like Father Christmas, NVIS doesn't really exist :wink:

OK, so it does, sort of. But going back to the days of 604 Sig Tp in Germany in the 80s, it was a real bugger and took serious effort to operate with any sort of reliability. Especially mobile, at 2 in the morning, with crap freqs 8O
 

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