Another WW1 Medal question

Discussion in 'Military History and Militaria' started by Lost-Jock, Jun 15, 2010.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. I am trying to get information on a Capt. F. W. Musgrave who served in the
    6 West Yorks during WW1 as I seem to have his Webley - Fosbery! At least that is name lightly marked on the backstrap.

    The London Gazette has a couple of references, promotion to Captain and a couple of staff appointments. He survived the war and the last entry is the termination of his commission in 1921.

    Sometime between 1917 and 1919 he became Captain F. W. Musgrave M.C.
    Using the Gazette search function I have been unable to find the entry marking the award of the medal.

    I am looking for any suggestions on where I can find more information on line
    and also, has anyone any experience of the records still available at the Regimental museum in York? I will be back in the UK in August and am prepared to make the drive down from Edinburgh if it is worth it.
  2. seaweed

    seaweed LE Book Reviewer

    Have you tried looking for his Medal Card online? Also has Edinburgh a public library with a set of Army Lists? Could be some info there. Kew, and Portsmouth public library have these but they are not much help if you are holed up in Scotland.
  3. MC for Capt. Frederick William Musgrave, 1/6th Bn., W. York. R., T.F. gazetted 1 Jan 1919. Probably no citation since it is NYH list.

    And the MUSGRAVE F whose personal file is in The National Archives at Kew (Ref: WO 339/99518) may (r) may be this office.

  4. Thank you all.

    C_C - the honours list is interesting, I didn't think the MC would be awarded that way.

    The last time I was tracking down the original owner of a revolver, an officer in the then 79th Highlanders, I was standing in the Museum at Fort George waiting to see the curator. Casually looking at the index list for a BFO painting of the Regiment before they set off for the Crimea, who was the officer in the foreground holding the standard? My guy! The museum kindly sent me a large photo of the painting, complete with an index card of the identifiable Officers and SNCOs.


    edited to add, until today I didn't even have his full first or middle name so thank you for that too.
  5. LJ

    As I understand it, there were two sorts of MCs -

    'immediate' for a specific act of gallantry, gazetted relatively soon afterwards and with a citation published either in the same gazette or sometime afterwards

    'periodic' (not the right word) for distinguished service over a period of time, gazetted in the half yearly honours lists and with no citation. This usage arose, in part, from the absence of any more suitable award until the introduction of the Order of the British Empire late in the war.

    But I am not a medal buff, so someone should be along soon to explain what I've got wrong.

  6. I think his man is this one:
    Description Medal card of Musgrave, Frederick William
    Corps Regiment No Rank
    West Yorkshire Regiment Temporary Lieutenant, Staff Captain

    Date 1914-1920
    Catalogue reference WO 372/14

    It'll cost you £2 online to have a look at it.
    Her's the link:
  7. Is this your chap:

    Attached Files:

  8. It would appear so! The power of Arrse.

    The next question is sources of good quality medal copies to mount with the display? I know originals of the 1914-1915 Star, the Victory medal and the British War Medal are easy to find but down the line, when this piece eventually gets sold, I don't want any doubt that these are copies and not the original medals. There is enough of that sort of thing already.
  9. As mentioned MC's were awarded for not just for gallantry.

    There is a record of a officer being awarded the MC for doing a great job in battlefield salvage(!). HRH The Prince of Wales was awarded one by his HRH Dad in WW1 when he went near the front line with his unit (and he hated it being mentioned or having to wear it).

    There was also a Guards officer who spent the 1st War on the Staff and turned up back at his battalion in 1918 with a DSO and MC for Staff work. He was shunned by the other officers who had got theirs the hard way and left the army.
  10. Not just an officer phenomena - there was an ASC SNCO awarded the DCM for his sterling service in the field bakery at, I think, Le Havre.