An Operational Thought - Craftsman Aug 2007

Discussion in 'REME' started by alf_granite, Aug 2, 2007.

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  1. I've just flicked through this month's Crafty and felt compelled to post a new topic. There is an honest and refreshing letter highlighting the excellent work REME do on Op tours but also debating the training we receive to do the work. So...I just wanted to know what everybody's thoughts were on the letter, assuming you could get hold of the mag.

  2. Col Mark’s letter does raise the age old debate of soldier or tradesman first. However he raises a more subtle implied question which is ‘what should be the focus of our technical training’. Here we have a dilemma that every 1st line and to a lesser extent 2nd line ES commander faces whilst in barracks or on exercise. ‘I am there to fix the units toys so that they play with them, or I am there to train REME Attached/LAD/Wksp/Bn to go on operations.’

    I believe that as a Corps we need a change of mind set to one that sees fit kit as a welcome by-product to technical training. Instead of equipment state boards in tiffies and ASM offices we should be monitoring training. If you ask your average craftman what they are doing on the shop floor, the likely answer will be ‘fixing, repairing, replacing x bit of kit’. I believe that the correct answer should be ‘ I am learning, practicing to fix x bit of kit for when I need to do it on ops’
  3. We also need some of our seniors off their FEMIS terminals and out there on the floor training the young lads up!
  4. Well said.....

    Here have my terminal! I would swap you (even though i have no femis). What a dream it is for many Seniors, a bay on the shop floor where they can do the work that were trained for. But then is that not what we also need out of our Full Screw's and Lance Jack's? Someone to train the younger lads through the early stages of their life in the REME working on the shop floor?
  5. Bluebells, d'you reckon the CO would be happy with 'well trained' tradesmen but VOR vehicles? At first line units [in fact, at all units], the emphasis must be on keeping fit kit in the hands of the troops.

    We are here to keep kit in the hands of the user, wherever we are. We have achieved this since 1942, without the need to put up ILUO charts and fill in crappy PDRs.

    We are intelligent people who can plan in training requirements around maintenance tasks.

    If we lose sight of the need to keep kit fit, the Corps will be amalgamated before you can say lilliburlero.
  6. I agree with you, and maybe i seem bitter and twisted, but i got my full screw after 9 years, i thought that was not too bad myself, but it gave me a chance to learn the ropes as a lance jack and i was experienced enough as a full screw to give the advice needed and technical experience to rectify most problems i encountered. But now i see more and more people that are Cpls before they go on their class 1 course or promoted to Cpl within months to a year after their class 1 course. Worse thing i find is that i get called on to help these sprog Cpls because they dont have a fcuking clue about how to rectify the problem they encounter half the time as have no experience with the problem. Problem is that the unit that the LAD is part of, look upon a Cpl as being experienced and knowledgeable at his/her trade as they would with anyone within their own cap badge. But i fcuking fail to see how some cnut that goes on his class 1 with lets face it limited experience ( we are always constantly learning) then finishes it can be expected to be a fitter section 2i/c and then go out on a job then not have a fcuking clue what to do when encounters a problem because he has not come across it before, so have to call in the likes of myself to help them sort their fcuking inability to sort out a problem, because they have all the responsability but no fcuking clue. So yes as i said i might be bitter and twisted but i do not believe that any VM should get his Cpl before his class 1 course no matter how far up your O.C's arse you are or how many charity events you may have organised, end of day you may be promotional quality and that will reflect when you do your PAAB. But when at unit you are a liabilty unless you have the experience and if you are going tiffy then it wont matter about yout technical ability as you have passed the course and you will be sat behind a desk kicking out health and safety sh1te and relying on your artisan Sgt to advise you with regards to jobs in hand and what you should do with regards to work and other matters.
  7. I'd have been looking sick on the promotion ladder then as it took me 6 years to get on a VM2 trade test, no course, because of operational commitments and a further 3 to get away for my VM1. I agree with time in trade beinga criteria but not attending courses. I in fact only got my VM2 because I put in my option and was seen by CREME to ask why I had done it.

    Mind you that was in 1964 and we'd just lost all the NS men so were as short handed as the corps is today.
  8. Whatever happened to training on exercise as if it is for REAL.
    Seriously though there has never been enough time devoted to Field training for operations pre first posting rather the idea being "get to your first unit and they will show you what you need to know". Is this time for a change perhaps where the training comes out of the technical training budget rather than hoping that someone else will shoulder the burden in spite of overstretch,
  9. For a B Mech Squatter Ive got to say Im liking you more and more Spannerspanker are you trying to get round me. Agree with a lot of points on here and A CPL in the REME is the backbone of the fitter section. Thats why you need that full screw who's done at least 8 to 10 years so the young lads can learn from them and the Artisan Sgt can know he can trust him. Having a VM Cpl who's done less than 5 years going on his Class 1 and soon after Tiffy course then a Tiffy by his nine/ten year point is crap, where has his experience of running a fitter section come from :?

    edited to say we have great 3-2 training set up taught by our Cpl's weekly.
  10. One of the problems I see with "pre-posting " training is what training do you give.
    Obviously the basic phase on etraining is fairly universakl but what training do you giv eto fit into the Cfn's 1st posting. My first out of training posting was to The Blues, an armoured car regiment at the time and I was taught to do my bit as a squadron fitter. My next posting was to a gunner regiment and the military side of my job was completely different as a battery fitter. I then spent time ,as hav emost of REME apparently , at 10 Fld Wksp where once again the tactical side was different to anything I'd don epreviously. Perhapsit would benefit REME personnel if on joining a regiment they were to spend a few weeks "in" the regiment before moving to LAD or Wksp. I doubt if there is enough spare time for this but I fel it would be more beneficial that trying to teach the military skills needed in all the different units at Arborfield.
  11. Pre para or all arms cdo in effect at a local level.
  12. Sounds to me spannerspanker that not only are you bitter you are making a valid point sound like its just because you failed your paab and don,t have it in you to run a fitter section. Maybe i am wrong but you are sterio typing and its like me saying all artisan's are fat and bald!
  13. hey spurs fan
    shouldn't you be watching the telly
    someone's arrse is getting tanned . scouse style
  14. Can we change that to a little over weight and a full head of hair please, new age Artisan and all that. :D
  15. So you automatically assume that you have to be a tiffy to run a fitter section? fcuk... you have lot to learn dont you? You a fcuking tech or something?
    I am sorry if you think that when i say a class 1 Cpl who has been off his class 1 course 3 months and in the army 5 years or whatever has fcuk all experience is stereotyping people but end of day it is fcuking true. But if you feel that i am wrong, i would like to see your argument as to how a Cpl Class 1 who has been in the army 5 years is fully qualified to be the fount of knowledge for the young class 3's and class 2's when they are expecting you to help them out? Yes you may know a fair bit to help them out depending on the kit you work on and the experience you have on it from a previous unit, but if for instance you have only ever worked on landrovers and dafs with the occasional TM then get posted to a medic unit with afv 432 or bulldogs as they are changing to or even a drops unit, then you would be fcuked wouldnt you? What i am saying is that it is better for a fitter section to have a Cpl who has at least two units under their belts before they get the Cpl and actually know how the system works and can be a benefit to a fitter section instead of a hinderance due to lack of knowledge and experience. Now your argument as to how a Cpl who has been in 5 yrs is the dogs bollox is?