An Officer Class for the Police

#1
Not sure really what to think about this...

Sir Thom Windsor has recommended that there should be a new way to join the plod. Normally, everyone starts at the bottom of the ladder and works their way up through the ranks. His report suggests that progression is pretty hard and not many people advance very quickly.

Under his new scheme, which will start with 80 people, people will join and do one year as a constable but will then go on a two year course to become an Inspectors. In effect, this will create an Officer class of police. 40 of the people will be current constables working within the system; the other 40 will be new recruits. Sir Tom does not mince his words:these are to be top Russell Group type people, with firsts or 2:1s and all the other baubles one gets from such universities. This scheme will be 'one of the toughest in the country'. In just three years, their pay will go from around 20k to around 50k.

Naturally, Sir Thom is keen to draw on the experiences of other professions and talks at length about Officer recruitment for the army, of which he writes:

"There is an expectation that officers, often at a young age, lead and direct operations without
having had experience of serving in the ranks. An analogy given is the difference between
understanding how to drive a car and how the engine works. It is not necessary to know one to
do the other."

Unfortunately for Sir Thom, this part of the report also details, how this kind of scheme has been tried before but has had to be abadoned because - surprise surprise - normal police officers resent the fact that these people have not 'paid their dues' 'don't know what its like for normal officers' etc etc.

So, what do we think then? Great idea that will transform the police by providing new and strong leadership? Or yet more evidence of a disregard for people who actually go out and do a job and know what real life is in favour of people who do PPE?

Also: is it not ironic that this is coming out now, at a time when the army is removing the difference in pay and conditions for non-grad Officers?

Report is here: http://review.police.uk/publications/part-2-report/report-vol-1?view=Binary
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#2
Oh no! Yet another Police thread! There'll soon be more police threads on this Army site than there are anti-Scottish threads.

Can't we have something vaguely military? I understand that 'Walts and medals' are quite popular just now.
 
#3
Good scheme but I really can't see the point of serving as a constable for a period of one year, of the 2-year inspectors course. Introduce another rank, something similar to subaltern perhaps, and then let them cut their teeth on the ground as an officer, not as a tom - you might then achieve the aim.
 
#4
Not sure really what to think about this...
In case you hadn't notice mate, about 35,000 people went for a walk recently to suggest it is ****ing shit.

Other than that, I'm with biscuits.
 
#5
One of the big differences between the proposed scheme and our system is the in theirs the standard constables still could reasonably expect to make their way up - it's not two rank systems like ours, it's one with two entry points. There's potential for some serious friction there, I reckon. Although setting up a full officer strata like the Army isn't really practical in a pre-established organisation, in fairness.

I can see it happening, and not really working...
 
#6
In case you hadn't notice mate, about 35,000 people went for a walk recently to suggest it is ****ing shit.
Point taken, but most of the chat seems to focus on pay and conditions as opposed to this scheme in particular.

Oh no! Yet another Police thread! There'll soon be more police threads on this Army site than there are anti-Scottish threads. Can't we have something vaguely military?
Sorry, I was trying to draw a link between Officer Plods and Officer Officers, agree it is a bit tenuous though.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#7
In case you hadn't notice mate, about 35,000 people went for a walk recently to suggest it is ****ing shit.

Other than that, I'm with biscuits.
A walk? Half the shower at the Police Federation need to go for a run.
 
#9
Oh no! Yet another Police thread! There'll soon be more police threads on this Army site than there are anti-Scottish threads.

Can't we have something vaguely military? I understand that 'Walts and medals' are quite popular just now.
Indeed. I come here for a ****ing break from work!
 
#11
Point taken, but most of the chat seems to focus on pay and conditions as opposed to this scheme in particular.



Sorry, I was trying to draw a link between Officer Plods and Officer Officers, agree it is a bit tenuous though.

Totally different kettle of badgers mate.

For starters Army officers are supposed to display leadership.

Police senior officers mainly display idiocy and sycophancy.

This obsession with trying to avoid the traditional 2 years probation for new coppers is pathetic, the probation period is there for a reason. IMHO it takes a good 3 -5 years to be competent
 
#12
A walk? Half the shower at the Police Federation need to go for a run.
I do frequently, sometimes I even do it in nice locations and not having to shout "Stop! Police!" first (if there's by-standers, looks good at court then).

But there are some pie-eaters, aren't there?

Point taken, but most of the chat seems to focus on pay and conditions as opposed to this scheme in particular.
No it's not. That's the home office trying to run a subliminal message of coppers being greedy and unwordly whilst they demolish the police service for ideological reasons.

All plod are officers. Individual officers of the crown accountable for their actions.

You mean "constable" as in rank? Well, the rank structure is purely for administrative convenience and to give arrogant somethings to think they are better than "constables". As we are repeatedly seeing now, senior plod can't find their arse with both hands and a ****ing mirror.

Particularly the High Potential Development Scheme.

Known quite a few of them. ****ing useless at being cops or managers. Good at Police and Home Office newspeak, and more lucrative to learn that then mandarin, arabic, farsi, and somali combined. Less operationally useful though.

So I suggest a few less of them, and a few more of us thick ******* who nick people and actually stop crime would be an idea.

If I was PWC I'd charge a couple of million for that review.

As biscuits said, there's enough on this board to mount a charge of conspiracy to incite disaffection. A quick search will turn it up.

Last time I met someone so unable to investigate a simple line of enquiry, they were in the Department of Professional Standards :)
 
#13
One of the big differences between the proposed scheme and our system is the in theirs the standard constables still could reasonably expect to make their way up - it's not two rank systems like ours, it's one with two entry points. There's potential for some serious friction there, I reckon. Although setting up a full officer strata like the Army isn't really practical in a pre-established organisation, in fairness.

I can see it happening, and not really working...
So you haven't heard of LE officers then?
 
#14
Whats the current average and median times for a Constable to reach Inspector rank? How many Constables are even bright enough to get beyond Sergeant?

If currently no-one does it before their late 20s then perhaps there is scope for a fasttrack scheme to get some younger "Subalterns"

Everyone hates jumped up Grads, the cnuts, but I'm amazed it doesnt happen already - like with most jobs I reckon the driver and mechanic analogy probably has a lot of truth in it. Different skill sets. Not all great football managers were great players.........
 

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
#16
Perhaps Sir Thing has been looking at fundamental blunders by the Police - evidence not disclosed, innocent people carefully framed, general heavy-handedness, arrests of victims instead of perpetrators, Brazilian electricians being taken out etc etc and thinks the top of the force needs a stronger dose of brain power with people that can think in deeper ply and see a bigger picture, so that it pays out less in compo and features less often in the Daily Mail.

How many 2.1s, let alone 1sts does the Plod currently recruit I wonder?
 
#17
Whats the current average and median times for a Constable to reach Inspector rank? How many Constables are even bright enough to get beyond Sergeant?

If currently no-one does it before their late 20s then perhaps there is scope for a fasttrack scheme to get some younger "Subalterns"

Everyone hates jumped up Grads, the cnuts, but I'm amazed it doesnt happen already - like with most jobs I reckon the driver and mechanic analogy probably has a lot of truth in it. Different skill sets. Not all great football managers were great players.........
It already happens - Called High Potential Development Scheme - and it promotes yes men and women who can tick boxes and regurgitate management speak.
 
#18
Perhaps Sir Thing has been looking at fundamental blunders by the Police - evidence not disclosed, innocent people carefully framed, general heavy-handedness, arrests of victims instead of perpetrators, Brazilian electricians being taken out etc etc and thinks the top of the force needs a stronger dose of brain power with people that can think in deeper ply and see a bigger picture, so that it pays out less in compo and features less often in the Daily Mail.

How many 2.1s, let alone 1sts does the Plod currently recruit I wonder?

Wow.

Never seen so much bollocks and bullshit in one post.

Where to start.....

Well, no one is 'carefully framed' anymore.

Failing to disclose evidence is the fault of Prosecutors (CPS not police) 99% of the time

And the 'Shooting Brazilian Electricians' (Tired old pile of cock cheese of a story it is - fkin uber yawn) was presided over by Cressida Dick - A graduate of Balliol college - Oxford University

So no - I dont think accelerated promotion or an officer cadre is a good idea
 

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