Americans at it again with Militant Islam

#1
Libyan Islamist says he won’t be enemy of U.S.

By Simon Denyer, Friday, September 2, 12:58 AM

TRIPOLI, Libya — He says he was tortured by the CIA and accused of links with al-Qaeda, but Tripoli’s new military commander, Abdulhakim Belhadj, insists that he is no extremist or enemy of the United States.

“I have no intention of revenge,” he said in an interview aimed at clearing his name in the media. “I may take legal advice one day, but I won’t be an obstacle in the way of the relationship between Libya and the United States.”

Belhadj has emerged as a powerful military figure in the new Libya, an Islamist fighter whose past dalliance with global jihad has raised concerns that the fall of Moammar Gaddafi’s regime could allow radical Islam to gain a foothold on these North African Mediterranean shores.

He fought with the mujaheddin in Afghanistan against Soviet rule in the 1980s but asserts that he also set up schools and provided humanitarian assistance for the Afghan people. He says he twice refused invitations to find common cause with al-Qaeda.

“When al-Qaeda was formed in 1989, I was there in Afghanistan, but I didn’t join or agree to participate in their acts,” he said, dressed in military fatigues with a pistol on his belt, his black beard neatly trimmed. “We were never interested in global jihad; our concern is Libya and the Libyan people.”

After the fall of the communist regime in Kabul, Belhadj joined other Libyans who had fought in Afghanistan to found the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG), an organization dedicated to the overthrow of the corrupt, oppressive and anti-Islamist Gaddafi regime.

The group asserted responsibility for an assassination attempt on Gaddafi in 1996 and fought sporadic clashes with security forces in subsequent years.

Several members were thought to have al-Qaeda affiliations, but others were clearly uncomfortable with the global jihadist group, and another former leader, Noman Benotman, later made his feelings known publicly in an open letter to Osama bin Laden.

“When the Taliban took over in Afghanistan and al-Qaeda announced their international front against Jewish and Christian people, Mr. bin Laden invited us to join the celebration,” Belhadj said. “We refused to join, and we were trying to convince him not to take this path.”

Nevertheless, the LIFG was banned by the United Nations and listed by the State Department as a terrorist organization. Belhadj was arrested in Malaysia in 2004 and transferred to Thailand, where he was briefly interrogated and, he says, tortured by the CIA.

“I was injected, and strung up by hands, and cold water and ice was put all over my body,” he said.

After a few days, the CIA decided he was not worth keeping and transferred him to Gaddafi’s Libya with his pregnant wife. She was kept in jail there for two months, something that clearly still rankles Belhadj. He says he spent six years in jail in Tripoli, three of which were in solitary confinement without a single shower. For a year, he says, he was not allowed to see his newborn son.

Gaddafi, like many other Arab autocrats, portrayed himself as a bulwark against Islamist extremists but granted an amnesty to hundreds of Islamists between 2008 and 2010, when Belhadj was freed. He soon joined the revolution against the Libyan leader.

Today, he is a central figure in the hunt for Gaddafi, a search being conducted with the help of NATO.

There is talk in Tripoli of tensions between the civilian leadership of the rebel national council and its military leadership, between pro-Western leaders and more Islamist elements such as Belhadj.

But he brushes aside this talk, insisting that he is committed to democracy and building a new Libya free of the oppression that characterized Gaddafi’s rule.

“We are sons of today, not of the past,” he said. “We are working for the security of Libya and the security of the whole world.”

On Tuesday, U.S. officials acknowledged that there were concerns about Islamist influence in the Libyan revolution but played down the links with al-Qaeda.

“Some members of LIFG in the past had connections with al- Qaeda in Sudan, Afghanistan or Pakistan, and others dropped their relationship with al-Qaeda entirely,” said a senior U.S. official who closely tracks Islamist terrorist organizations but insisted on anonymity in discussing sensitive files about terrorist organizations.

“It seems from their statements and support for establishing a democracy in Libya that this faction of LIFG does not support al-Qaeda. We’ll definitely be watching to see whether this is for real or just for show.”

Libyan Islamist says he won’t be enemy of U.S. - The Washington Post
 
#3
You've posted a sensational headline which bears no relation whatsoever to the story you've plonked underneath it.

How very Daily Mail of you.
 
#4
First and foremost people must realize that the media is not in place to provide the world with an unbiased perspective of events. The media is there to take snippets of information that suit its own agenda – to sell its product. If one just takes a single perspective then one does not get an unbiased view – only one that meets the agenda of the writer.

In this case we are seeing a country in turmoil, not really knowing what to believe. Yes, I am very sceptical as like you I do not know what the future holds. Therefore we must judge those that appear to have control by their deeds not their words without any preconceived ideas being in mind that the NTC is a rainbow coalition not a single family with a predefined agenda.

If we are to believe what we read then Abdul Hakim Belhadj has always refused to join with the Al-Qaida movement. However, certain countries did not accept this situation, instead interrogating the man then rendering him to, what we now know to have been, a repressive regime. Being held in the now infamous Abu Salim prison in Tripoli for the flimsiest of reasons, reasons we will never know, until late 2010 when he was released during Saif-al-Islam al-Qadaffi’s charm offensive to appease western governments. Knowing what we know today, we must decide for ourselves which of these men poses the greatest danger to the Libyan people and other nations, remembering that Belhadj is one of the most authentic faces of the Libyan revolution. His opposition to the Al-Qadaffi regime began more than 20 years ago, and unlike several of the NTC members who up until and beyond the start of the uprisings were either members of the regime themselves or living far away in the West, he has been at the forefront of the struggle both literally and figuratively. In the other hand we have Saif-al-Islam al-Qadaffi, somebody that appears to have been instrumental in the disappearance and torture of his own people albeit at the behest of his father with the tacit approval certain interested other countries.

Today we must watch and not interfere, seeing if either will change their spots. My advice is to read the unwritten, hear the unspoken and see the unseen then make a decision not jump to preconceived conclusions.
 
#5
You've posted a sensational headline which bears no relation whatsoever to the story you've plonked underneath it.

How very Daily Mail of you.
Well how very newspaer of you, not just the wails perogative is it
 
#6
So the Spetznaz Walt raises his head once again, spouts some pointless dribble to show us just how bad the west is and them scuttles off again for a change.

I wish someone in Manchester would pop along to his house and hit him so hard Google couldn't find him.

I'm not offering BBQ's or boiled eggs, just my gratitude for a well delivered shoeing.
 
#7
So the Spetznaz Walt raises his head once again, spouts some pointless dribble to show us just how bad the west is and them scuttles off again for a change.

I wish someone in Manchester would pop along to his house and hit him so hard Google couldn't find him.

I'm not offering BBQ's or boiled eggs, just my gratitude for a well delivered shoeing.
Once again your arrogance has prevailed.

If you cant stomach the truth, then dont comment, I find it amusing seeing a individual such as you, being a senior too, using a current affairs section to abuse me with your DRIBBLE BANTER.

I was in Zapad GRU and I dont need to prove it any longer.

Comment to the thread posted, I know it hurts, you guys, being the trouble causers once again, using Militant Islamists for your own gains without the consideration of others, You will be the same people, complaining later on, when these same Jihadis attack your installations and cities. I look forward to the future, seeing you guys complain about how Islam is a danger to your Western liberal values, and now the Islamists threaten your way of life.

As if you didnt threaten the way of life of others, by supporting such people.

The article highlights once again, the way the west uses people, and will side with anybody who serves their needs, including their own enemies.

Thats the point of the thread. America and the west, has aligned themselves with their own enemies, if this is your standard of morality and values, then I feel pity on your nations.
 
#9
So, AK - how many of the mods are you giving sloppy gob-jobs to in exchange for carte blanche to post utter drivel that would've got any of our other resident trolls banned a very, very long time ago? You're nothing but a sock puppet, and a particularly tedious one at that. Why don't you have a wander down to the city centre and shout at pigeons instead, there's a good little Billy Bullshitter. Zapad GRU my hairy arse. ****.
 
#10
...
The article highlights once again, the way the west uses people, and will side with anybody who serves their needs, including their own enemies.

Thats the point of the thread. America and the west, has aligned themselves with their own enemies, if this is your standard of morality and values, then I feel pity on your nations.
You say that as if "the west" was a single entity with a common purpose. You claim to live here, why do you do so? You must also have noticed by now that we do not speak with one voice, we bicker and disagree about almost everything.
 
#11
AK, you are very consistent in sitting on the sidelines moaning on about the evils of us Westerners and picking doom laden holes in eveything.

But you are very light on suggesting alternatives.

So, with Libya, are you suggesting we should have sat back and let the tyrant, who has done us spiteful damage in the past, go through Bengazi massacring his own citizens as he said 'alley by alley'?

Or should we have intervened the way we did?

Or should we have helped him stay in power for the simple reason that he is the enemy of our enemies?

Stepping in and trying to influence international events to conform to your own national interest has been the job of kings and governments since time immemorial.

It is quite bizarre that you consider this to be uniqely Western or particularly immoral thing to do.
 
#12
If you've got this much of a problem with Libya, then feel free to head on down there and give Gaddafi's fellas a hand. I'm sure they'd not say no to an extra body. If you've got a problem with doing that, then kindly shut up and **** off. For someone who claims to live in the 'West', you seem to find a lot of problems with it.
 
#13
...
If we are to believe what we read then Abdul Hakim Belhadj has always refused to join with the Al-Qaida movement. However, certain countries did not accept this situation, instead interrogating the man then rendering him to, what we now know to have been, a repressive regime. Being held in the now infamous Abu Salim prison in Tripoli for the flimsiest of reasons, reasons we will never know, until late 2010 when he was released during Saif-al-Islam al-Qadaffi’s charm offensive to appease western governments. Knowing what we know today, we must decide for ourselves which of these men poses the greatest danger to the Libyan people and other nations, remembering that Belhadj is one of the most authentic faces of the Libyan revolution. His opposition to the Al-Qadaffi regime began more than 20 years ago, and unlike several of the NTC members who up until and beyond the start of the uprisings were either members of the regime themselves or living far away in the West, he has been at the forefront of the struggle both literally and figuratively. In the other hand we have Saif-al-Islam al-Qadaffi, somebody that appears to have been instrumental in the disappearance and torture of his own people albeit at the behest of his father with the tacit approval certain interested other countries.

Today we must watch and not interfere, seeing if either will change their spots. My advice is to read the unwritten, hear the unspoken and see the unseen then make a decision not jump to preconceived conclusions.
Interesting that young Saif was pretty successful as putting himself forward as a reforming future alternative to his father and is now easily cast as monstrous. While a bearded LIFG boogeyman of the sort we've been wetting ourselves over for the past decade suddenly is a hero of the revolution. Makes me wonder if the perceptions of a lot of folk involved in the Arab Spring are as falsified.

The way the MSM spins this sometimes seems to drive our propaganda as much as the other way round and that spin looks to be to be often more about having a good story to sell rather than any particular agenda or reporting the facts. The eschatology narrative of the Arab Spring is a case in point.

The Machiavellian flexibility of our alliances is commendable, we have no friends only interests. The lesson is we are not to be trusted but only a fool would have done that anyway.
 
#14
If you really are ex ZAPAD GRU AK what do you say about your former comrades intervention in places like Chechnya, Georgia or Ingushetia when talking about "Western Intervention"?
 
#15
Jesus Christ, people, don't try to debate him. You're wasting your breath - he'll ignore your point completely, post what he thinks is an inflammatory comment and repeat this process ad infinitum. Either ignore him or point out that you know he's a sock-puppet and couldn't care less what he 'thinks', but for the love of God, Allah, Buddha, Krishna, the Flying Spaghetti Monster or any other brand of Great Beard in the Sky, don't elevate the idiot by attempting to engage him.

The dirty, goat-shagging, Mohammedan pederast.
 
#16
If you really are ex ZAPAD GRU AK what do you say about your former comrades intervention in places like Chechnya, Georgia or Ingushetia when talking about "Western Intervention"?
Two of those are actually part of the Russian Federation, so legally I'd view them as much like the Brits "intervening" in the Six Counties.

Georgia, an uppity former possession of the USSR is a closer fit for Libya. Tbilisi did after all did foolishly deploy area weapons against what it claimed was its own civilian population. Russia then made hysterical allegation of impending genocide as we did over Benghazi. The main difference legally is the Russians were not about to try for a blessing from the UN the US would surely veto. In the end they got their way by main force.

The natives are unlovely but Russian behavior in all three has been pretty atrocious but we as yet have not been daft enough to go all R2P on their arse. Another lesson in the necessity of the possession of ICBMs and the rapid deployment of massive conventional forces for nations keen to preserve their integrity.
 
#17
Two of those are actually part of the Russian Federation, so legally I'd view them as much like the Brits "intervening" in the Six Counties.

Georgia, an uppity former possession of the USSR is a closer fit for Libya. Tbilisi did after all did foolishly deploy area weapons against what it claimed was its own civilian population. Russia then made hysterical allegation of impending genocide as we did over Benghazi. The main difference legally is the Russians were not about to try for a blessing from the UN the US would surely veto. In the end they got their way by main force.

The natives are unlovely but Russian behavior in all three has been pretty atrocious but we as yet have not been daft enough to go all R2P on their arse. Another lesson in the necessity of the possession of ICBMs and the rapid deployment of massive conventional forces for nations keen to preserve their integrity.
I was asking what AK thinks about it giving that he seems to be so critical of western intervention so its notable that you say that The Georgian conflict was similar to Libya as its seems Russia is just as prepared to do the same sort of thing when it suits their interests.
 
#18
Once again your arrogance has prevailed.

If you can’t stomach the truth, then don’t comment, I find it amusing seeing an individual such as you, being a senior too, using a current affairs section to abuse me with your DRIBBLE BANTER.
Normally I try to distance myself from such threads as they seem to go nowhere as the instigator usually can not comprehend the difference between constructive criticism and light-hearted banter. Think about it for a moment. Constantly disparaging the opposition normally ends in failure as the comments become more futile.

I was in Zapad GRU and I don’t need to prove it any longer.
A disbanded and discredited organization that is being investigated by the Russian Military Prosecutor's Office for alleged war crimes, I could ask the question but that would be in bad taste.

Comment to the thread posted, I know it hurts, you guys, being the trouble causers once again, using Militant Islamists for your own gains without the consideration of others, You will be the same people, complaining later on, when these same Jihadis attack your installations and cities. I look forward to the future, seeing you guys complain about how Islam is a danger to your Western liberal values, and now the Islamists threaten your way of life.
Assumptions made without foundation or fact, please provide irrefutable proof that this will occur. There is a considerable difference between supporting a repressed majority and arming a minority rebellion.

As if you didn’t threaten the way of life of others, by supporting such people.

The article highlights once again, the way the west uses people, and will side with anybody who serves their needs, including their own enemies.

That’s the point of the thread. America and the west, has aligned themselves with their own enemies, if this is your standard of morality and values, then I feel pity on your nations.
Nobody is supporting such people, the mandate is quite clear: To protect civilians regardless of race, creed or colour. Believe it or not that means protecting everyone be they black, white or yellow, Christian, Muslim, Hindu or heretic – those people are all the same, if you cut them do they not bleed? This constant taking of the moral high-ground does nothing to improve the standing of this thread, it serves only to defeat its aims, which are, I presume, in your eyes to denigrate the Islamic world and create division and ferment unrest. It would help if you posted a thesis on how you intend to resolve this on-going situation in Libya without the need for further loss of life.

I would ask you to think about this: We are a speck of dust, a speck in time; we are eternal, ever shifting, ever transforming. From birth until we die …….. hopefully in our late
hundreds; It’s a journey ……. it’s an adventure, it’s not about …… hatred, killing each other, settling old scores ……… it’s not about that, it’s about a spiritual journey ….. its about evolving and if I have got anything right it’s my attitude.
 
#19
*sigh* You just can't help yourselves, can you? All you have to do is stop rising to the plastic Jihadi's bait, but no - you keep biting like half-starved piranhas. Muppets.
 
#20
So the Spetznaz Walt raises his head once again, spouts some pointless dribble to show us just how bad the west is and them scuttles off again for a change.

I wish someone in Manchester would pop along to his house and hit him so hard Google couldn't find him.

I'm not offering BBQ's or boiled eggs, just my gratitude for a well delivered shoeing.

Me sir,Me sir I'll do it.....................
 

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