Alleged SAS War Crimes Report

[Nige]

Why do you think that's any of your business? I've told you I did a tour there and that should suffice. I really couldn't give a toss if some internet person believes me of not and I'm certainly not going to start posting photo's/proof etc..... You can either accept what I say as true or not - that's up to you. But to get back on topic:

Do I think any Taliban that got killed in Afghanistan deserved it? Yes I do!
Do I think anyone was murdered? No I don't.
Do I think journo's have a biased agenda? Yes I do.
Do I think people make up claims to get money? Yes I do.
Do I think compo claiming lawyers are scummy and just want money - Yes of course the scummy leaches do!

No matter what the MSM write from now on, they are not to be trusted, also these political witch hunts/internet trials are not based on any hard evidence - just hearsay and rumours most of the time.

FACTS - has anyone at all been convicted of murder in this report - NO they haven't.

This thread is just basically waffle, with a few armchair lawyers spoffing out their biased opinions, that's all. Do I take it seriously - NOPE, and I doubt anyone will be charged with any murders - you know that's the likely outcome and so do I.

Let us know when you read the report - until then, I don't think anyone gives a shit what you think.

 

[par avion]

Special Forces soldier John Letch stands down over picture of him drinking from prosthetic

A picture taken in the bar 11 years ago has returned to kick the Command Sergeant Major, Special Operations Command up the bum.

Especialy as he has been lecturing the entire Australian Army on 'good soldiering' just weeks ago.

 

[Saturation]

@par avion
There is a new development complete with photos on the net.
Best you get googling and post it here, and be obsessive about it.

 

[Banker]

There is a new development complete with photos on the net.

And said photos appear to contradict what BRS's lawyers have claimed in submissions related to his defamation case.

The webs we weave.

 

[Saturation]

And said photos appear to contradict what BRS's lawyers have claimed in submissions related to his defamation case.

The webs we weave.

We live in interesting times, but I am dumb apparently.

 

[Saturation]

@par avion
Keep going, keep going, you have almost convinced me.

 

[retread2]

@par avion
There is a new development complete with photos on the net.
Best you get googling and post it here, and be obsessive about it.

All right, I've Googled it and failed miserably. Give us a clue, eh?

 

[Saturation]

All right, I've Googled it and failed miserably. Give us a clue, eh?

Sydney Morning Herald, or wait for @par avion to post.

 

[bobthebuilder]

All right, I've Googled it and failed miserably. Give us a clue, eh?

He did a shoey.

 

[retread2]

He did a shoey.

Daniel Ricciardo was shooting prisoners?

Seriously though, the SOCOMD SM was sprung having done the wrong thing and did (or is doing) the right thing.

E2A: belatedly I realised that I had got right and wrong mixed up. Not on my own there, then.

 

[SignalFire]

The video of the Australian SAS killing the farmer in Afghanistan is quite clearly an execution and nothing but a war crime. I understand that war has an unimaginable mental impact but if a Special Forces Soldier cannot keep their focus and have sound decision making then I have no idea how they can be fit for SF...

Do you know the Context of the incidence? me neither

 

[Señor_Chang]

Do you know the Context of the incidence? me neither

Nope, nor me. However the ones who do, considered the context worthy enough of further investigation into it. As well as finding the video to directly contradict what the soldier in question officially said happened in his report....

 

[TwoSocksJackson]

Watched this earlier on Al Jazeera and I am posting it here as I thought some of you might be interested:

The Killing Field

We investigate explosive revelations about killings and cover-ups by Australian special forces in Afghanistan.

www.aljazeera.com

I wasn't there so I will not comment on the video however I do have a question: does anyone know what type of assault vest 'Quake' is wearing? (Asking for a hyperactive Labrador )

 

[bobthebuilder]

Ben Roberts Smith’s defamation case is currently ongoing in Aus.

I make no comment; here is today’s report in the Sydney Morning Herald.

Doubts over witnesses entering Australia for Ben Roberts-Smith defamation trial

Three villagers who allege they saw Ben Roberts-Smith kick an unarmed man off a cliff in Afghanistan are unlikely to be granted entry to Australia to give evidence, a court has heard.

www.smh.com.au

 

[Banker]

Ben Roberts Smith’s defamation case is currently ongoing in Aus.

I make no comment; here is today’s report in the Sydney Morning Herald.

Doubts over witnesses entering Australia for Ben Roberts-Smith defamation trial

Three villagers who allege they saw Ben Roberts-Smith kick an unarmed man off a cliff in Afghanistan are unlikely to be granted entry to Australia to give evidence, a court has heard.

www.smh.com.au

It’s a civil case, say whatever the **** you like.

 

[BaronBoy]

Last night I listened to an interview with the author of the article I have (hopefully) linked. I have today bought the magazine but not yet had a chance to read the article. The gist of the interview was that there was a lot more "nastiness" going on by special forces (not necessarily all Australian) than was detailed in the Brererton Report.

Now, the magazine and the author can be criticised as being "left-wing" or "left leaning", it could be argued that the Afghans are seeking compensation, or that the actions were as a result of Afghans settling local scores, however, in the interview the author answered these criticisms and others. The author has also been resident in Afghanistan since 2013 and has contact with the Taliban. One comment that was made time and time again was that the conduct of special forces in Uruzgan Province was one of the best recruiting actions possible.

I am not making any claims regarding the truth of the allegations raised in the article, however, after reading several books by David Kilcullen on counterinsurgency where he makes the point time and time again that a purely military response will lead to overkill and cause massive resentment and often leads to a worsened situation. It also shows a massive lack of understanding of the local situation.

Anyway, the link: The Monthly: The Worst Form Of Defence

 

[retread2]

Last night I listened to an interview with the author of the article I have (hopefully) linked. I have today bought the magazine but not yet had a chance to read the article. The gist of the interview was that there was a lot more "nastiness" going on by special forces (not necessarily all Australian) than was detailed in the Brererton Report.

Now, the magazine and the author can be criticised as being "left-wing" or "left leaning", it could be argued that the Afghans are seeking compensation, or that the actions were as a result of Afghans settling local scores, however, in the interview the author answered these criticisms and others. The author has also been resident in Afghanistan since 2013 and has contact with the Taliban. One comment that was made time and time again was that the conduct of special forces in Uruzgan Province was one of the best recruiting actions possible.

I am not making any claims regarding the truth of the allegations raised in the article, however, after reading several books by David Kilcullen on counterinsurgency where he makes the point time and time again that a purely military response will lead to overkill and cause massive resentment and often leads to a worsened situation. It also shows a massive lack of understanding of the local situation.

Anyway, the link: The Monthly: The Worst Form Of Defence

Thanks for that article. I can't help thinking that many warning signs with SASR were missed. I keep coming back to this quote by the former Director of ASIO, especially the bit I have bolded:

. . . former head of ASIO David Irvine described it as in a "state of dysfunction … by no means broken but by 2015 … in serious danger of becoming so". It was, he said, "ragged, run-down" and stunted by "arrogance, elitism and a sense of entitlement".​

 

[BaronBoy]

Thanks for that article. I can't help thinking that many warning signs with SASR were missed. I keep coming back to this quote by the former Director of ASIO, especially the bit I have bolded:

. . . former head of ASIO David Irvine described it as in a "state of dysfunction … by no means broken but by 2015 … in serious danger of becoming so". It was, he said, "ragged, run-down" and stunted by "arrogance, elitism and a sense of entitlement".​

I have to agree which makes me very angry when at the publication of the Brereton Report it was stated (by Campbell I think - can't be arsed looking it up now) that the command structure of the SASR would not be held accountable. For pity's sake, if there was something rotten in the ranks and the commissioned lot didn't know about it then they were negligent in their duties; if they did know something was rotten and did nothing then they are equally culpable. Either way, it should be a short service career.

This runs far deeper than 2 Squadron who were the ones pilloried publicly. The quote by David Irvine has hints in the book by Mark Donaldson VC where he describes the calls being made by the ranks in the SASR to be let off the leash and take a more active role at the sharp end. The traditional role of the SASR was the same as the SAS in strategic reconnaissance but with the growth of the anti-terrorism role and in Australia, the growth of the Commando Regiment in anti-terrorism and an active role in Afghanistan then the SASR wanted a piece of the action. It would appear that some took the change in role too enthusiastically.

 

[kandak01]

Isn't it somewhat inevitable that entering a conflict with virtually no understanding of the realities of the local society will result in net disadvantage?

You end up killing lots of the wrong people, acting as a recruiter for diverse enemies, get bogged down in fighting without clear goals, and waste a huge amount of your own blood and treasure before admitting defeat?

Letting the military "off the leash" (or, use it or lose it) sounds like an appropriate epitaph for both Iraq and Afghanistan.

 

[ThunderBox]

Looks like this guy is getting hauled up again:

Ben Roberts-Smith under fresh investigation over burner phones and sealed envelopes

A new police investigation is the third into Australia’s most decorated living soldier and will look into whether he was involved in a conspiracy to silence witnesses.

www.google.co.uk