Alan Johnson and his Knee Jerk Reaction to ASB

#1
Alan Johnson accuses police of failing on anti-social behaviour :roll:

Yep lets all blame the police!
(In our *case I couldn't and still cant praise the police enough!)

This is so typical of those who look at the 'short term' solution to, at the end of the day, win votes.

So, my reply to Mr Johnson was :-

I’m finding it very difficult to write a fully educated comment on this as I can’t find any reports used by the Home Office to come up with this new all singing all dancing plan.

I’ve looked on line, even at Reuters, I’ve looked at both the Home Office and Parliamentary website and I can find nothing that shows that a full, impassionate review of the treatment of victim/witnesses of ASB has taken place. I fear that what I am reading is a rapid response, kneejerk reaction to the comments of Assistant Deputy Coroner Davison at the Pilkington Inquest.

I want to know more, I want to see what evidence has been gathered discussing failures of all agencies across the nation, and I want to see discussions of agencies that offer good practise to victims of ASB but there does not seem to be any.
If these investigations and reports exists then I apologise for this but as one of my Uni lecturers used to say to me “Cite your source!”
(Looking at the HO and Parliamentary websites, some of your sources are seriously out of date!)

So I will ask here:
How many victims have been questioned, how many of those actually stayed the ground to go on to be witnesses and if they didn’t, why didn’t they?
And, just as importantly how many ASB practitioners, police officers, GP’s, County & Local Councillors, magistrates, judiciary, borough solicitors, housing officers etc etc etc have been given the opportunity to speak freely, without fear of reprisal about what they have experienced in their dealings with victims of ASB?

The victims of ASB and those police officers, council workers, and other agency staff who work so hard, often with their hands tied by bureaucracy and/or in house complacency, deserve a FULL review of what has failed, what has worked and how we can stop failing victims in the future.

That is why I initiated a petition for a full ASB Policy Review on the number10dotgov website. I, a victim, don’t want a ‘band-aid’ instant fix; I want a long-term viable cure.



*If you haven't read our story it can be found here.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article6869357.ece
 
#2
Yeah, we're failing on ASB.

But if the urge to go out an grip these mongs that infest our streets hadn't been systematically bred out of cops since 1997, we wouldn't be in this mess in the first bloody place.

Stop slips, the IPCC and their complaints culture everywhere, a spineless CPS and senior officers drunk on performance figures; no wonder no one thinks controlling the streets is the way forward.

"To recognise always that the test of police efficiency is the absence of crime and disorder, and not the visible evidence of police action in dealing with them". Peel's 9th principle of policing.

True then. True now.

Not that anyone in HMG gives a flying.
 
#3
So basicallly after 12 years of New Liebour social engineering they're claiming it's not there fault?
 
#4
This is not the fault of the Police. Their hands have been tied.

It is also not the fault of the Courts, their hands have also been tied. Magistrates and Circuit Judges despair at what has been done to limit their sentencing powers.

The 'Tying of hands' has been done by the Government who for some inexplicable reason seem to find some sympathy (and perhaps, empathy) with the offending classes.

This is down to the Govt hands down.

End of.
 
#5
Wow!! Its like the Nues Arbeits blaming all the UK's social ills on the Tory's for the past 12 years. Typical Nues Arbeits response.... As has been stated, it was Nues Arbeits in government that have created the legal hoops that the Police and Courts have to go through....

"The Home Secretary today accused police officers of failing to deal with anti-social behaviour as the Government called for more offenders to be prosecuted for breaching Asbos.

Alan Johnson warned of a “mindset” among some officers who ignore families besieged by yobs as he set out a tougher approach to anti-social behaviour with new targets for councils and police forces."


How many Home secretaries, and Ex Home secretaries have there been in the past 12 years? "Not Fit For Purpose!" was stated by one of them.... :roll: .

F*ck Nues Arbeits..... and F*ck Mr Jolly-stone.......
 
#6
uncle_vanya said:
Wow!! Its like the Nues Arbeits blaming all the UK's social ills on the Tory's for the past 12 years. Typical Nues Arbeits response.... As has been stated, it was Nues Arbeits in government that have created the legal hoops that the Police and Courts have to go through....

"The Home Secretary today accused police officers of failing to deal with anti-social behaviour as the Government called for more offenders to be prosecuted for breaching Asbos.

Alan Johnson warned of a “mindset” among some officers who ignore families besieged by yobs as he set out a tougher approach to anti-social behaviour with new targets for councils and police forces."


How many Home secretaries, and Ex Home secretaries have there been in the past 12 years? "Not Fit For Purpose!" was stated by one of them.... :roll: .

F*ck Nues Arbeits..... and F*ck Mr Jolly-stone.......
Neues Arbeit :wink:
 
#7
LancePrivateJones said:
This is not the fault of the Police. Their hands have been tied.

It is also not the fault of the Courts, their hands have also been tied. Magistrates and Circuit Judges despair at what has been done to limit their sentencing powers.

The 'Tying of hands' has been done by the Government who for some inexplicable reason seem to find some sympathy (and perhaps, empathy) with the offending classes.

This is down to the Govt hands down.

End of.

Wot 'e said.

I used to have a lot of time for Plod, and a lot of Respect too, but, since the advent of "Yuman Rites innit" and the Risk Aversion syndrome practised by some Plodistas, I have come more and more to have neither time nor respect for them as a Force. Individualy I feel sorry for them, those that want to actualy BE Policemen that is, but sadly until things get back to the way they used to be when a Bobby was seen on the street and yobs vanishing from street corners at sight of him then my feelings of disenchantment will just simmer on.

My Grandkids Godfather is a Plod though, errrmmm! :wink: :wink: :wink:
 
#8
I am soooooooooo thick. I am soooooooooooo dopey.

Why?

Because I thought the stupid liberal attitude to criminals was the fault of the heavily politicised police.

Now, it has become clear that the problem is entirely the fault of the dreadful government that we have suffered for twelve and a half years.
 
#9
ZANU-Labour have been in charge for 12 very long years. The buck stops with them. End of.

As for the police, I've met some who were a waste of rations, others who were a credit to the Job. And the majority probably somewhere in the middle ground. All the good coppers I spoke to were of the opinion that anyone above the rank of Inspector was as much a politician as a copper, although there were exceptions to that rule.
 
#10
lsquared said:
I am soooooooooo thick. I am soooooooooooo dopey.

Why?

Because I thought the stupid liberal attitude to criminals was the fault of the heavily politicised police.

Now, it has become clear that the problem is entirely the fault of the dreadful government that we have suffered for twelve and a half years.
Ah well.

Now you know better.
 
#11
Werewolf said:
ZANU-Labour have been in charge for 12 very long years. The buck stops with them. End of.

As for the police, I've met some who were a waste of rations, others who were a credit to the Job. And the majority probably somewhere in the middle ground. All the good coppers I spoke to were of the opinion that anyone above the rank of Inspector was as much a politician as a copper, although there were exceptions to that rule.

The way our Police Farces are set up, you HAVE to become a politician when you get to Inspector.
 
#12
At the inquest into the deaths of Mrs Pilkington and her daughter Francecca, Supt Steve Harrod from Leicestershire Police said town halls and not the police should deal with “low level” anti-social behaviour.

The Home Secretary admitted that ministers had also “cruised” on the issue recently and that progress had stalled as the focus shifted to anti-terrorism

Tweedle Dumb and Tweedle Dumber. Pot..Kettle. Top cops and Politicians, is there any difference? Old time coppers must have ground their teeth down to stubs in the last ten years. Even the old time Specials were better than the new young breed of plod.
 
#13
Well Monty, that;s becuase Liebour sees the main duty of the Police as being to act as enforcers of social equality and diversity. They hold that crime is caused by a lack of those too, therefore, if you produce a totally equal and diverse society you will create a socialist heaven on Earth,
All b0llox I know, but that;s the way the left thinks.
 
#14
Well Monty, that's becuase Liebour sees the main duty of the Police as being to act as enforcers of social equality and diversity. They hold that crime is caused by a lack of those two, therefore, if you produce a totally equal and diverse society you will create a crime free socialist heaven on Earth.

All b0llox I know, but that's the way the left thinks.
 
#15
LancePrivateJones said:
This is not the fault of the Police. Their hands have been tied.

It is also not the fault of the Courts, their hands have also been tied. Magistrates and Circuit Judges despair at what has been done to limit their sentencing powers.

The 'Tying of hands' has been done by the Government who for some inexplicable reason seem to find some sympathy (and perhaps, empathy) with the offending classes.

This is down to the Govt hands down.

End of.
My bold....

Oh how true..



Note to self,

Never sentence anyone to 42 days in prison on a Friday........

under our new laws...

42 days sentence is now 21 days sentence.

Less prison governors 18 allowance, is 3 days

Fist day of prison is today (Friday).

You can only release from prison Monday to Friday – can't release on a Sunday

Therefore prisoner is released same day as sentence. - 42 days served and £50 housing grant.
 
#16
I'd like a political party that has the balls to say.
[align=center]"The Regional Divisions of Police know what the problems are in their own areas so, we are going to leave them alone to do the job![/align]
 
#17
The Home Secretary today accused police officers of failing to deal with anti-social behaviour as the Government called for more offenders to be prosecuted for breaching Asbos.
Thats funny that - I thought it was the job of the Police to lock up and the job of the CPS to Prosecute?

Maybe I'm getting it all wrong but when I phone them up and ask them how they would like me to proceed with my prisoner it does feel a little out of my hands.

Even when The CPS do charge and we get to court its down to the courts to punish. Now if only Zanu Labour would let them we'd be getting somewhere.



So whats the new Labour response? Create More Performance Indicators which require the Police jumping through more hoops to make bosses/forces appear good.

My current Inspector has a tatty framed hand written note on his wall, it was written years ago and left in the parade room one morning when they came in. Its signed by his first ever Sgt and it reads as follows.

"I'm off until next week. Go out, find criminals, lock them up."

This sums up how policing used to be before Politicians got involved and made the whole thing complicated.

Enough with the daft targets, enough with performance indicators. Lets return to Peels Principles and in particular my favourite one:

The test of police efficiency is the absence of crime and disorder, not the visible evidence of police action in dealing with it.
 
#18
You're a victim? O.K.! CRIME SOLVED! YOU DID IT! You will go to jail for being at the scene of the crime, and because you attempted to defend yourself you will pay compensation to the poor instigater ,after all,you dirtied his boots and fists with your blood! Made him ill it did! He needs councilling,poor little sod. In fact,if it where within my power,I would double you're sentance for coming before this court and wasting it's time by claiming that your a VICTIM!
 
#19
WifeofPaulw531 said:
I'd like a political party that has the balls to say.
[align=center]"The Regional Divisions of Police know what the problems are in their own areas so, we are going to leave them alone to do the job![/align]
Would that be wise?

We've had 12 years of political appointees to the higher echelons of every police force in the country.

Round my way, the police have largely given up on drug crime because they don't have the resources to fight it, even when it involves dealers selling class A drugs to kids inside schools. Plenty of resources to fund last month's gay pride 'event' in the county though.

In Nottingham after the 7/7 suicide bombings in London, the chief constable issued green ribbons to be worn by all of his uniformed officers. This was to show solidarity with the Muslim community who were, somehow, the main victims of the atrocity.

The former chief constable of Dyfed Powys police infamously stated on live TV that men having sex with 9 year old girls should not be classed as paedophiles. He practised what he preached when he stopped his force investigating one of his mates who allegedly gave an 18 month old baby a dose of the clap. Chiefy resigned on a full pension as soon as the IPCC started an investigation.

It's going to take years to pension off all of the class warriors, lentil munchers and enviro-crime specialists. Do we really want them doing their own thing while they've still got a job?
 
#20
Ancient_Mariner said:
WifeofPaulw531 said:
I'd like a political party that has the balls to say.
[align=center]"The Regional Divisions of Police know what the problems are in their own areas so, we are going to leave them alone to do the job![/align]
Would that be wise?

We've had 12 years of political appointees to the higher echelons of every police force in the country.

Round my way, the police have largely given up on drug crime because they don't have the resources to fight it, even when it involves dealers selling class A drugs to kids inside schools. Plenty of resources to fund last month's gay pride 'event' in the county though.

In Nottingham after the 7/7 suicide bombings in London, the chief constable issued green ribbons to be worn by all of his uniformed officers. This was to show solidarity with the Muslim community who were, somehow, the main victims of the atrocity.

The former chief constable of Dyfed Powys police infamously stated on live TV that men having sex with 9 year old girls should not be classed as paedophiles. He practised what he preached when he stopped his force investigating one of his mates who allegedly gave an 18 month old baby a dose of the clap. Chiefy resigned on a full pension as soon as the IPCC started an investigation.

It's going to take years to pension off all of the class warriors, lentil munchers and enviro-crime specialists. Do we really want them doing their own thing while they've still got a job?
Sod the thread - thought you were dead old boy! :wink:
 

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