AFC Harrogate

#1
Just found out I might be getting a posting there soon. Anyone work/worked there? Is it as much of a **** about as I've been led to believe?
 
#2
Not Harrogate, but Pirbright and Phase 2 in the past (that entailed visits to and from Harrogate).

How have you been led to believe it's a ragging? You get a Phase 1 platoon/troop of slightly younger intake, as they do some quals as well as the military stuff. Your program will be defined by the course (42 weeks?) and you will add value in how you organise activities etc.

You will have a chance to influence basic training, to "mould" civvis into trained soldiers (of sorts) and get a sense of achievement from it. Downsides - it is a fixed program. I don't think harrogate is as bad as Pirbright or the other Ph1 schools, as the program is longer, but I found Pirbright to be like groundhog day...
 
#4
Thanks for the replies but realised I wasn't specific enough in my question. I won't actually be going as Pl training staff, more in an office role. I was interested in what people though of the posting as a whole. The **** about part of my question was related to something I was told a few years ago by a mate who was a full screw there, he implied that it was a shit posting full stop, not just the working with crows part...
 
#5
Well, a couple of things if I may.

You have posted this in the OFFICER'S area - I therefore gave you my opinion of the posting from an officer's perspective.

Secondly, a mate that told you it was a "shit posting" and not just because of "the crows" sounds a bit negative. I bet if you asked him why he responded "it just is". Because he didn't like the area? Because he didn't like the regime of Harrogate (in my opinion a mix of 6th form college and phase 1 school) or what? And using terms like "crows" will get you crucified. I don't know what the official title is at the moment, ubt I expect it's junior soldier or something politically correct - these things come down from CDS to prevent them all being "crows" which is one step away from "maggots" and then a general slide into useless individuals. Once labels are attached, mindsets alter and you get a bad product regardless...

And then you say you're going to do "an office job". What do you mean? Company clerk? Or are you not even military? Civil servant?

Perhaps consider posting this in another area.
 
#6
Well, a couple of things if I may.

You have posted this in the OFFICER'S area - I therefore gave you my opinion of the posting from an officer's perspective.

Secondly, a mate that told you it was a "shit posting" and not just because of "the crows" sounds a bit negative. I bet if you asked him why he responded "it just is". Because he didn't like the area? Because he didn't like the regime of Harrogate (in my opinion a mix of 6th form college and phase 1 school) or what? And using terms like "crows" will get you crucified. I don't know what the official title is at the moment, ubt I expect it's junior soldier or something politically correct - these things come down from CDS to prevent them all being "crows" which is one step away from "maggots" and then a general slide into useless individuals. Once labels are attached, mindsets alter and you get a bad product regardless...

And then you say you're going to do "an office job". What do you mean? Company clerk? Or are you not even military? Civil servant?

Perhaps consider posting this in another area.
SuT's - Soldiers Under Training
 
#7
Also i can't see an Officer being in the same boat as a Cpl, so I'd ring the Adjt and ask them for Officer advice
 
#10
Well, a couple of things if I may.

You have posted this in the OFFICER'S area - I therefore gave you my opinion of the posting from an officer's perspective.

Secondly, a mate that told you it was a "shit posting" and not just because of "the crows" sounds a bit negative. I bet if you asked him why he responded "it just is". Because he didn't like the area? Because he didn't like the regime of Harrogate (in my opinion a mix of 6th form college and phase 1 school) or what? And using terms like "crows" will get you crucified. I don't know what the official title is at the moment, ubt I expect it's junior soldier or something politically correct - these things come down from CDS to prevent them all being "crows" which is one step away from "maggots" and then a general slide into useless individuals. Once labels are attached, mindsets alter and you get a bad product regardless...

And then you say you're going to do "an office job". What do you mean? Company clerk? Or are you not even military? Civil servant?

Perhaps consider posting this in another area.
I am an Officer.

My mate wasn't talking about Platoon training, more about the general level of bullshit that is present.
 
#11
Well, it's a phase one training establishment, but more (maybe worse) they are junior soldiers - even more impressionable. This will mean more stringent rules to abide by, higher standard.

If you view this as "bullshit" then maybe you shouldn't go. If you view it as the necessary standards to present to impressionable youth, who will see everyone there as an advert for the Army first, then their capbadge/corps second and form an opinion of them and the corps/cap badge from that, then fine.

I haven't served at Harrogate, but as I said, at another Phase 1 school and at Phase 2 - standards required there will scare some off too.
 
#12
My other half is working at AFC and thoroughly enjoys the job. Two intakes a year, one of about 800 or more and one of about 300.
Nice part of the country too, 2 miles into town.
 
#13
Just finished 3 years at the AFC; I would say it's a good place to work, the amount of messing about tends to decrease the further from the actual delivery of training you work. The facilities are great and as a Junior Training Establishment & PFI the funding to keep things running is pretty much set in concrete.
I suppose the final thing to say as with all postings it's what you make of it.
 
#14
Well, it's a phase one training establishment, but more (maybe worse) they are junior soldiers - even more impressionable. This will mean more stringent rules to abide by, higher standard.

If you view this as "bullshit" then maybe you shouldn't go. If you view it as the necessary standards to present to impressionable youth, who will see everyone there as an advert for the Army first, then their capbadge/corps second and form an opinion of them and the corps/cap badge from that, then fine.

I haven't served at Harrogate, but as I said, at another Phase 1 school and at Phase 2 - standards required there will scare some off too.
Thanks for the condescending answer you belter, is your CO in this chatroom by any chance?

Pretty sure I won't be 'scared off' by the standards required. More worried about getting fucked around and missing every single weekend for no reason, or being picked up by some **** Adjt because my sidies are a millimetre to long.

I tend to find that about 80% of people who hide behind pointless bullshit like bulled boots and sidies are usually covering up for professional incompetence.

The other 20% are competent, just *******.

Those kind of details were the insight I was after, sorry if I didn't make myself clear enough in my first post.
 
#15
Thanks for the condescending answer you belter, is your CO in this chatroom by any chance?

Pretty sure I won't be 'scared off' by the standards required. More worried about getting fucked around and missing every single weekend for no reason, or being picked up by some **** Adjt because my sidies are a millimetre to long.

I tend to find that about 80% of people who hide behind pointless bullshit like bulled boots and sidies are usually covering up for professional incompetence.

The other 20% are competent, just *******.

Those kind of details were the insight I was after, sorry if I didn't make myself clear enough in my first post.
Are you ******* 5 years old? If you're not mature enough to tow the party line, don't bother
 
#16
I'm being honest pal - the standards required to work in a training establishment are not for all - they would rather hang out being "ally" and never go near a HQ or trg post - that's fine. Horses for courses.

On the flip side, if everyone steered clear of those jobs by claiming they only joined the army to be an operational killing machine, no-one would ever get trained, no staff work would get done etc. I think, personally, that those with recent operational experience have more to offer the training world - more to add to the program to keep training relevant. Without that input, the field army very quickly berates the new in soldiers as being crap and unfit for purpose.

Sadly (or not) standards are enforced from the top down - the ruling on sideburns came from CDS if I'm not mistaken, not just a thrusting RSM with time to spare. If you view all of that as something that interferes with your social life, then should you be in green at all? I don't know about weekend working, but I didn't at Pirbright - some of my Troopies had to - the SuTs don't get weekends off and they can't be left to their own devices. Whether you'll need to work weekends in your office capacity (perhaps if you elaborate on what role you're going for?) I don't know.

Equally, you'll not usually go far if you choose to buck dress regs (not just for **** adjutants), QRs and the like. Don't know what cap badge you are, but where I come from (and have been) Officers have standards. Being one is not a licence to look like a tramp and hide behind your pips. Unless of course you're SF and are lining me up with a laser sight right now...
 
#17
Thanks for the condescending answer you belter, is your CO in this chatroom by any chance?

Pretty sure I won't be 'scared off' by the standards required. More worried about getting fucked around and missing every single weekend for no reason, or being picked up by some **** Adjt because my sidies are a millimetre to long.

I tend to find that about 80% of people who hide behind pointless bullshit like bulled boots and sidies are usually covering up for professional incompetence.

The other 20% are competent, just *******.

Those kind of details were the insight I was after, sorry if I didn't make myself clear enough in my first post.
The Adjt is a very pleasant chap and comes round for dinner sometimes. Why not give him a ring, I'm sure he'd love to fill you in?
 
#18
Are you ******* 5 years old? If you're not mature enough to tow the party line, don't bother
I think you've missed my point somewhat. I was after an 'unofficial' insight into quality of life at AFC Harrogate, eg how many weekends do you get off, is it relaxed or does it have high levels of bullshit. Hence my reason for posting my question anonymously on an unofficial website and not calling my soon to be new Adjt and asking him 'will I get messed around, are overly rigid rules enforced on members of staff pointlessly, will I be talked to like a twat or treated like an adult, etc?'

What I actually got was the kind of DS answer that I'd give to my CO if he asked me why I wanted to go to Harrogate, accompanied by an overt implication that If I was asking questions like that I shouldn't be posted there as the standards required would be beyond me.

Just to make it clear I’m not an ‘ally’ star. I polish my boots daily, iron my kit, get my hair cut and turn up on time. I also do my job to the best of my ability all of the time. I agree about basic standards, however many incompetents hide behind the rigid adherence to rules and try to imply that anyone who develops a bit of common sense is trying to be ‘ally’ or ‘different.’ In my experience of phase 1 and 2 training establishments it seems they attract a disproportionate amount of these type of people, hence my questions.

This has diverted my thread somewhat from the original question, I was hoping a Mess member at Harrogate at the moment might see it and give me the unofficial gen.

Any takers?
 
#19
I expect they're all at work. so you've got us. I last worked in a Phase 1 ATR 15 years ago. There is weekend work, of course, on exercise or on duty as the JS don't get to go home often. Since they are 16 and 17 years old you are in loco parentis and you'll find alot of duty of care goes on. The working day can be long.

That said, the young officers have a good time judging by the parties I go to in the Mess. You may get an inside view later. It's probably a good idea to ring one of the chaps doing the same job for a warts an' all briefing.
 
#20
I actually volunteered for the post but reading things like this from a 2005 thread answering the same question ive just asked arent filling me with confidence.... (I dont know how to do the little quote bubble thing from other threads)

'Run Like Feck! It is a morale hoovering let down of a hell hole. If all you're bothered about is staying in the UK, with no decent exercises, career progression, or Op tours for 12 or 24 months, then fine. Oh, and just 'cos you're in the UK don't think that you'll have much of a life outside the college, since they'll work you into the ground and you get eff all thanks for it at the end of it all. There is so much petty minded and TRULY unnecessary red tape that you will despair. The only light at the end of the tunnel in that place is a muzzle flash!

Embittered I admit, because I never wanted to serve there in the first place (Hence my glee to be back at RD). However, I have never encountered an establishment which values or supports it's instructors less! There are a few new faces at the top, but from what I've heard from friends still stuck there, the changes have been fo the worse.

It comes to something when you have Coy Cdrs sitting with a couple of the Senior Subbies in the ante room agreeing that they hate the place, and the job's arrse!

PM me if you think any of this is out of line, but after 2 years there I know whereof I speak, and I am most certainly not alone...

Rant ends. Have a nice day!'

Wondered if someone fancied giving me some information about what it was really like in case my mate (and this poster) are wrong...
 

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