Adv Trg Lord Lucans

I am well aware that Adv Trg is encouraged in the Corps and rightly so but are some people taking the p*ss. For example if someone wanted to take leave to pursue there chosen sport then good, well done, no problem. However if they were then to travel half way round the world only to find the conditions werent right should the Army pay for them to return to their unit?
Surely it is better to admit that conditions (I presume you mean the weather here) are too dangerous and to return safely rather than press on regardless...

IS Ski Geek

War Hero
Yeah i think your right its better to admit it thatn to stay away and not achieve your goal.

And at least the guy was dedicated to use his own leave most people that normally complain never seem to take part or initiate there own xped and then complain about others.

If people got of their own arrses to organise things and take part then as far as i am concerned i am all for it and if you can get a few bucks out of the army to help offset costs then crack on.

Its a big company and its sometimes good PR.
I have suggested on many occasion a golfing holiday for the guys in one of my troops but despite all of us in the head shed playing golf........can we get funding........can we fcuk............but those t@ats who pop of to everywhere in the world to do bugger all get all the cash..........dont ask me to sign your leave/cours pass..............GITS
I dont think I made my initial point very well so I will try again. The Hyperthetical person involved was not part of a team and did not take any soldiers, they only went to carry out some very specific training to further thier own sport. The conditions were not dangerous merely unsuitable for the training the individual wanted to carry out. The country in question was not some jungle backwater put an interesting part of the western world. The real issue is should the army pay so this person does not loose 9 days leave. I am very interested in other peoples opinions my view is slightly one sided.
I agree that Adv Trg has a valid place in military life, however, like every other secondary duty it cannot be allowed to have a detrimental effect on the core business of the individual.  I also agree that it often takes more balls to admit that the conditions are dodgy and turn back that to carry on.  Most adv trg incidents are caused by people failing to make exactly that call.

Worringly though, it would seem that 280brooklands is suggesting that this individual went on leave, not on duty, and when they found the conditions weren't right got the Army to pay for a return flight rather than out of their own pocket.  If that is what 280brooklands is saying it sounds like fraud to me! Wouldn't want to be the one who signed that one off when the audit comes round!
280, If the bloke went on leave and carried out official advtrg while on leave, i would wonder whether he had the proper insurance's in place while on that advtrg. If he was given funding to go away, and the training benefit to be gained depended on a very specific set of conditions, its surprising the funding was given. Shouldnt we all submit a "wet weather plan" when organising our training?

I do think its unfair how the current system works. If an individual excels in a particular sport, its very easy to get funding for training, and the majority end up with the usual week away hill walking etc. It would be nice to see the money spread around to make use of wednesday afternoons to allow the majority to get into the various sports.
What is stopping you from getting into "various Sports"?  

In answer to the original post, you cannot be on adv trg and on leave.  By definition you have to be on duty.  I do not know the facts of the case being reported but it really is that simple.  If you are on leave, the army is not duty bound to bring you home, being on leave makes it your responsibility to fund your own travel both to and from the destination of choice.

I hear winges about adv trg and sports gladiators all the time.  The simple fact is guys that if you don't want your week of "forced walking", take an interest, find something you like, get a course or two under your belt and start organising your own.  No 1, you get to do what you want to do.  No 2, it looks good on your ACR.

As for their being no opportunity to do adv trg that is a crock of crap.  Get your arrse down to the admin office/ trg office ask to see DCIs and look up the adv trg expeds that happen all the time.  I recently organised a trip and I couldn't get any soldiers interested in going....sound familiar, well stop winging about the lack of opportunity and start taking part.

A starter for ten for you:-

The website above has at least 8 expeds on it that require volunteers.  I happen to know that Ex St Petersburg 300 is well under subscribed.  

And another thing don't give me that old "well I don't think I'll like it" routine, try crossing the Atlantic, walk across the Andes, climb K2, kayak down grade 5 rapids, Bobsleigh in Norway, or just go for a gentle sail around the Canaries, stopping at every nightspot you can get your hands on and then tell me you don't like it.

As for sport if you've got one that you want to pursue get off your arrse, and pursue it!!  Organise it for wednesday afternoons and it will be.  These things don't just happen, someone has to get of their arrse and do the work.

Enough of a rant I wait with baited breath for your responses.
Sorry Bow_Man, didnt make my point quite as well as i should. Personally i'm more than happy with my lot in life. I've been in long enough to remember when budgets were not the problem they are today, and have had my "jollies". Climbing up Kota Kinabalu, a weeks surfing and sailing around the Scotish Islands are some of my favorites.

What would be nice is to have money, time and instructors available to do something different for the "week away". Getting a soldier motivated for a weeks rock climbing, walking and canoeing isnt easy - afterall they have done it all before. I would love to take our Troop away for a weeks surfing instruction in Cornwall or Wales, but i also know that the cost would be prohibitive and instructors would be hard to come by (i also appreciate thats not a reason for not trying!!). We also try to encourage our guys to apply for courses to qualify themselves and to go on advertised exped's, tho it has to be said most of the signals that come out are after instructors, not participants.

Lastly, i'd like to mention something worrying. Its the thinking of my last unit that to save travelling costs and overall costs that Adv Trg should be carried out locally. Is it just me that thinks this thinking is flawed? AdvTrg is one of the few times a year when the pads and singlies, and indeed the seniors and juniors socialise together. If the Trg is ran locally, everyone goes home at the end of the day, and an important part of the training benefit is lost. Any thoughts?
The type of training you have described can be done relatively cheaply.  Speak to 14 Sigs about the surfing (or any sea orientated Adv Trg) they run a trg wing specifically for that.  

As for travel, most COs don't mind providing unit transport for Adv Trg.  OK the ferry ticket may cost you a bit more if your going across the channel, but for a soldier I cannot see the cost being to prohibitive, you also get a grant from div to assist subsidising travel costs.  The last one I organised cost £650, (quite expesive) but if you look at how much it should have cost if we were civvies (minimum of £1500), soldiers soon see that with a little bit of cash they can have a good time.  Although in the end my last exped ended up all being officers going (I think primarily due to the cost), I did end up with three or four reserves too.

It is worth doing.  try a small surfing trip to 14 Sigs, take about 7 blokes with you, they will soon spread the word when they get back.  Number one thing I was taught was if the boys haven't enjoyed it, then you have failed.  It seems important when you battle to get these guys on stuff like adv trg that whilst it is supposed to be adventurous, if they don't enjoy it they won't come back..

As for the troop or sqn Summer Camp...theyb are always the bain of the life of the guy organising it...loads of soldiers, loads of activities loads of instructors.  Very difficult to orgnaise.  However they are supposed to be there for a purpose, firstly they usually are great for troop, sqn bonding (if done right). Secondly they are supposed to introduce individuals to the different disciplines, the idea being that they may like one of them and take it further.  

PM me if you want to know more about organising a trip to Cornwall or Wales, I have done both before, surfing, quad biking, we even through in some golf, sea fishing, go karting and ten pin bowling, and all for about £30 a head.

Agree about 14 Sigs adventure training, tried it, loved it and so has everyone else who had a go - it really can be the dogs cajones.  Surfing is great, coasteering is excellent as a matter of fact - it's all good (my fave is the powerboating).Give them a call, apparently there are plenty of vacancies at the mo' (can't think why).
Just thought I would add another link.

Another sailing one this time for the 2003 Tall Ships Race.  There is an application form online for anyone that might want to have a crack at this relatively cheap once in a lifetime experience.
I have to say that doing me JSMEL(S), Adv JSMEL and RLT was blooming marvellous. I had to put in a fair wee bit of work piling up the quality mountain days etc but since then I've been puffed out leading overseas expeds!

From an honest point of view it's a doddle. I get to go to nice places doing what I enjoy and, for some reason, CO's seem to love it!

My last OC refused to let me do RMQ and all the RD stuff as apparently my AT quals more than showed how driven I was.

Cheers easy 8)

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