AAC Helicopters in Brunei, Early 60s

#1
Just reading Allan Mallinson's book, "The Making Of The British Army". In the section on the Brunei Confrontation of the early 60s, he states: "By the end of 1964....forty observation and liason helicopters from the Army Air Corps, formed seven years earlier"

That seems rather a lot. Is he correct?
 
#2
I think he is counting RAF/RN aircraft as in 1964 was still useing the SARO Skeeter, and they only ever had about 75 totall , the Sioux was just coming intu service
 
#3
The Sultan of Brunei is quite well off, attended Sandhurst, has very strong links with the UK, pays for a resident ghurka coy, and AAC sqn.

Forty helicopters, sounds quite sensible considering what he was protecting.

Wikipedia states his personal collection of cars is valued at 4 billion US dollars
For personal use, the sultan has a Boeing 747-400 furnished with gold plated furniture with an estimated value of $233 million including $3 million on furniture, six smaller planes and two helicopters. He is trained to pilot the aircraft.

http://www.britains-smallwars.com/malaya/index.html

http://www.britains-smallwars.com/Borneo/index.html
 
#4
MightyGem said:
Just reading Allan Mallinson's book, "The Making Of The British Army". In the section on the Brunei Confrontation of the early 60s, he states: "By the end of 1964....forty observation and liason helicopters from the Army Air Corps, formed seven years earlier"

That seems rather a lot. Is he correct?
It's feasible. By 1964, the Brunei revolt was well over, and the Borneo Confrontation was well underway. It was quite a large front and if the battalion I was with was typical, each would have had two choppers each (ours were called Celer and Audax!)

I seem to recall AAC having a Wing based in Singapore and I'm sure if that were so, the aircraft in the wing would all have been employed in the Confrontation.
 
#5
The only AAC aircraft in the Smallwars site are DHC Beavers, fixed wing , there might have been AH1 Sioux later in the war but unlikly in 1964 as the AAC only got them about then
 
#6
As the order for the first 50 Sioux was only given to Agusta in March 1964 it is unlikly that there were any in Borneo that year
 
#8
tropper66 said:
The only AAC aircraft in the Smallwars site are DHC Beavers, fixed wing , there might have been AH1 Sioux later in the war but unlikly in 1964 as the AAC only got them about then
Sycamore were used also. One was lost in Sarawak in 63.
 
#9
tropper66 said:
As the order for the first 50 Sioux was only given to Agusta in March 1964 it is unlikly that there were any in Borneo that year
I can only speak from 1965 onwards but I'm sure any old AAC hand who can remember Major Markham being awarded his decoration (AFC?) for saving Col Brammall's life (and a major British embarrassment!) circa Aug 1965) by his exceptional piloting skills, will remember what aircraft type would likely have been flying.
 
#10
jinxy said:
tropper66 said:
The only AAC aircraft in the Smallwars site are DHC Beavers, fixed wing , there might have been AH1 Sioux later in the war but unlikly in 1964 as the AAC only got them about then
Sycamore were used also. One was lost in Sarawak in 63.
While searching for crashed Belverdere Sycamore XL822 hit a tree stump and rolled over at Long Mararup in Sarawak
 
#11
tropper66 said:
jinxy said:
tropper66 said:
The only AAC aircraft in the Smallwars site are DHC Beavers, fixed wing , there might have been AH1 Sioux later in the war but unlikly in 1964 as the AAC only got them about then
Sycamore were used also. One was lost in Sarawak in 63.
While searching for crashed Belverdere Sycamore XL822 hit a tree stump and rolled over at Long Mararup in Sarawak
yep, thats the one. There is a 'War Grave' site somewhere in Sarawak to another downed Helicopter. I forget the type and details now. We looked for it in 85, didn't find it though.
 
#12
jinxy said:
tropper66 said:
jinxy said:
tropper66 said:
The only AAC aircraft in the Smallwars site are DHC Beavers, fixed wing , there might have been AH1 Sioux later in the war but unlikly in 1964 as the AAC only got them about then
Sycamore were used also. One was lost in Sarawak in 63.
While searching for crashed Belverdere Sycamore XL822 hit a tree stump and rolled over at Long Mararup in Sarawak
yep, thats the one. There is a 'War Grave' site somewhere in Sarawak to another downed Helicopter. I forget the type and details now. We looked for it in 85, didn't find it though.
Could it be the one that got lost and went over the border and was shot down Whirlwind XR 480 17/11/65 still never been found as far as I know
 
#13
tropper66 said:
jinxy said:
tropper66 said:
jinxy said:
tropper66 said:
The only AAC aircraft in the Smallwars site are DHC Beavers, fixed wing , there might have been AH1 Sioux later in the war but unlikly in 1964 as the AAC only got them about then
Sycamore were used also. One was lost in Sarawak in 63.
While searching for crashed Belverdere Sycamore XL822 hit a tree stump and rolled over at Long Mararup in Sarawak
yep, thats the one. There is a 'War Grave' site somewhere in Sarawak to another downed Helicopter. I forget the type and details now. We looked for it in 85, didn't find it though.
Could it be the one that got lost and went over the border and was shot down Whirlwind XR 480 17/11/65 still never been found as far as I know
Maybe, my part in the search was a day out in the jungle with a couple of 45 gallon drums of AVTUR and a Jemini. The site was further than the enduance of a Scout.
 
#14
There would have been some Westland Scouts which were delivered to the AAC from 1961/62. Also the RAF had some Sycamores, Belvederes and Whirlwinds in Brunei at that time as well.

FC
 
#15
XP 165 the first Scout first flew on 29/8/1960, but I can only find referance to them being used on mainlans Malaya in late 64 no ref about Borneo, there were AusterAOP9s and Beavers used there I even found the RN useing a Hiller HT1 there, but no AAC Helicopters in 1964 as yet
 
#16
Before my time
Bit of Scout Porn http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN8-pV-rGik.
I known one was lost in Far East in late 60's due to the Power Turbine exploding.
Certainly used in Aden I joined 8 Flt after they returned from there and the Lads used to talk of the time RR bought them a crate of beer for getting the first Nimbus to last 25 hrs.
Sioux was strangely later into service then Scout.

john
 
#18
#19
Fatcivvy said:
There would have been some Westland Scouts which were delivered to the AAC from 1961/62. Also the RAF had some Sycamores, Belvederes and Whirlwinds in Brunei at that time as well.

FC
The Scouts were delivered but had so many problems they did not go into service untill the late 60s, I fact a number of Sud Alouettes were ordered as a stopgap in 1964, and in fact once in service proved to be first class aircraft, and so remained in service long after the original withdrawel date
 
#20
In 1964 The whole Army only had about 60 Saro Skeeters, which had come into service in 1957 and were so under powered they were just about useless, In 1964 there was a debate in Parliment about the lack of Helicopters and the fact that the replacement for the Skeeter, the Scout, although delivered, was having problems. two companys entered tenders to build a new light helicopter Shorts with the Hiller, and Westland with the Agusta/Bell 47G4, as the first 50 could be bought initially off the shelf from Italy. And a number of Alouette were obtained as a stopgap, the first Scout went to the Far East in 1965 but tthat I believe was for hot weather testing in Malaya.
The very first Scout XP165 is still around and is in Weston Super Mare although XP 166 is the older airframe but it had been registered as a civilean aircraft and is now in New Zealand
The first recorded Scout to crash in Borneo was XR599 on 20/9/65 which crashed into the sea killing three on a night flight from Lunda to Kuching
 
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