Army Rumour Service

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

A400M

Yesterday, a journo was used as tandem passenger by a GCP (equivalent PF) team of the French 11th Airborne Bgde which jumped over Paris from an Atlas as part of the Bastille day events.

The GCP members belonged to the 1er RCP (infantry) and 17°RGP (Engineers)


In flight


The landing in front of the Invalides

Ec5M8ojWsAIuCxa.jpg


GCPs have clocked dozen of Op HALO jumps in the Sahel region since 2014.
 
The French air force will need to change its 14 C-130H and 27 Casa 235 by around 2030.

The various options are:
-C-130J: 4 are already operated but it's an expensive plane to acquire and operate and it is not European
-Airbus C-295: mostly OK but could be short legged and too small for some tasks
-KC390: a lot of uncertainty around this aircraft and it is not European
-the development of an A200M by Airbus IOT maximise the commonality of parts, training and maintenance.

No decision expected before many years.
 
The French air force will need to change its 14 C-130H and 27 Casa 235 by around 2030.

The various options are:
-C-130J: 4 are already operated but it's an expensive plane to acquire and operate and it is not European
-Airbus C-295: mostly OK but could be short legged and too small for some tasks
-KC390: a lot of uncertainty around this aircraft and it is not European
-the development of an A200M by Airbus IOT maximise the commonality of parts, training and maintenance.

No decision expected before many years.

C27 ? Not a bad aircraft, cockpit can be made to look like an A400 and European.
 

Bubbles_Barker

LE
Book Reviewer
Taken on a Friday afternoon obvs.
Thank God - because every other day they're dropping pallets on the DZ next door to me!
 
It would fit the bill but experience tends to show thay the FRA Gvt will prefer to support Airbus than a joint ITA/US program.

True, but let us increase the Airbus content.
The cockpit design and implementation, the DASS etc.
The engines are almost identical to those on the C130, so making use of existing FR spares and support personnel.
 
It would fit the bill but experience tends to show thay the FRA Gvt will prefer to support Airbus than a joint ITA/US program.
The French would buy below standard airbus airframes, EH90, Tigre, A400 rather than what’s better elsewhere.
 
True, but let us increase the Airbus content.
The cockpit design and implementation, the DASS etc.
The engines are almost identical to those on the C130, so making use of existing FR spares and support personnel.

That will depend a lot on the state of FRA/ITA relationship when the tender is issued. If a muppet of the Salvini kind is in power, there is very little chance for such a deal to go through.
 
That will depend a lot on the state of FRA/ITA relationship when the tender is issued. If a muppet of the Salvini kind is in power, there is very little chance for such a deal to go through.
So it’s on your terms.
 
Tigre is not a bad helo. The issues the Ozzie's had with it seem peculiar to them.
NH90? Oz and NZ seem to be keen on developing an SF variant with the French. TBF the French have gotten good mileage out of theirs in Mali and Afghanistan, so it does beg the question why them and not others.
A400? The RAF seem to be using it quite successfully. Much more than the Germans. Now, we've either got superior groundcrew to keep them running or the GAF hand picked the duff ones.
While there's options to the Tigre/NH90 the A400 is a bit on its own. The closest is probably KC390 but I'm not sure it quite meets payload/range.
 
@fantassin what FR needs to look at is heavy lift helicopters. A squadron on them in Mali would enable the "more and quicker" aspect of Barkhane.
 
Tigre is not a bad helo. The issues the Ozzie's had with it seem peculiar to them.
NH90? Oz and NZ seem to be keen on developing an SF variant with the French. TBF the French have gotten good mileage out of theirs in Mali and Afghanistan, so it does beg the question why them and not others.
A400? The RAF seem to be using it quite successfully. Much more than the Germans. Now, we've either got superior groundcrew to keep them running or the GAF hand picked the duff ones.
While there's options to the Tigre/NH90 the A400 is a bit on its own. The closest is probably KC390 but I'm not sure it quite meets payload/range.

Excellent summary.

PS: FRA forces only deployed NH90 in Mali, they were not ready to be deployed to AFG before the FRA pull out in 2013.
 
Excellent summary.

PS: FRA forces only deployed NH90 in Mali, they were not ready to be deployed to AFG before the FRA pull out in 2013.
Of course, I think you had Caiman?
NH90 had problems with the flooring described as not robust enough and the cabin ceiling being too low for troops. I never quite understood either. I thought the original mockup/demo shown to the customers would have made this obvious.
 
Tigre is not a bad helo. The issues the Ozzie's had with it seem peculiar to them.
NH90? Oz and NZ seem to be keen on developing an SF variant with the French. TBF the French have gotten good mileage out of theirs in Mali and Afghanistan, so it does beg the question why them and not others.
A400? The RAF seem to be using it quite successfully. Much more than the Germans. Now, we've either got superior groundcrew to keep them running or the GAF hand picked the duff ones.
While there's options to the Tigre/NH90 the A400 is a bit on its own. The closest is probably KC390 but I'm not sure it quite meets payload/range.
The NH90 has had many issues, not surprisingly a few users have chosen to bin them and Go with the MH60s, the A400 works for us, due to experienced ground crew, aircrew. It’s still not fit for purpose for delivering SF, hence why the RAF will be getting MC130J for that purpose, along with MH47G.

If Tigre was so good, why is the Apache out selling it?

France needs new MPA, Heavy SH, a replacement for the medium transports that @fantassin has alluded too, however I don’t see Airbus as the answer To any of those requirements.
 
@fantassin what FR needs to look at is heavy lift helicopters. A squadron on them in Mali would enable the "more and quicker" aspect of Barkhane.

The issue is known and acknowledged but nobody in the FRA POL establishment is too keen on pouring billions of Euros into US coffers while FRA and EU industries are reeling under the effects of the COVID crisis.

Barkhane is very happy with GBR CH-47 support but the Op would not stop if they were to go back to blighty. FRA forces have done without heavy RW for decades and it is unlikely to change soon.

Regarding MPAs, the modernized ATL2 is just entering service so no hurry.

In AFG, it was the Caracal (EC725Mkll), Cougar and Puma.
 

Latest Threads

Top