A credible way forward for Northern Ireland?

T

Taffd

Guest
#1
Firstly, let me state that my knowledge of things Northern Irish is minimal. I'm not pro-anything or anybody there. I'm merely wondering if there's any merit in the following.

It seems that problems are ongoing. Part of the population favours republicanism, in itself not intrinsically a bad thing. Part of the population wish to be British.

The idea.

The British government states that from x date, possibly in 6 months to a year, it will declare Northern Ireland an independent country, free to determine its own governance and destiny.

All people who wish to be British may emigrate to the mainland and must give up their NI citizenship. All people who remain become Northern Irish, free to govern themselves as they wish and to make treaties with whom they wish.

Britain embarks on a house-building programme to ensure all incomers are able to be accommodated.

Is this idea worthy of debate or should I just boil my head?
 
T

trowel

Guest
#3
Firstly, let me state that my knowledge of things Northern Irish is minimal. I'm not pro-anything or anybody there. I'm merely wondering if there's any merit in the following.

It seems that problems are ongoing. Part of the population favours republicanism, in itself not intrinsically a bad thing. Part of the population wish to be British.

The idea.

The British government states that from x date, possibly in 6 months to a year, it will declare Northern Ireland an independent country, free to determine its own governance and destiny.

All people who wish to be British may emigrate to the mainland and must give up their NI citizenship. All people who remain become Northern Irish, free to govern themselves as they wish and to make treaties with whom they wish.

Britain embarks on a house-building programme to ensure all incomers are able to be accommodated.

Is this idea worthy of debate or should I just boil my head?
Put the pan on.
 
#4
I vote that we give NI back to the Republic, make it a United Ireland and then unite Ireland and UK into the 'British and Irish Isles'.

That way, the Republicans get NI back and the UK grows into a stronger union.
 
#5
personaly i think the only cure is to give all of them 100k each, poke them out at bayonet point, nuke the place and then sow the ground with salt.
 
T

trowel

Guest
#8
personaly i think the only cure is to give all of them 100k each, poke them out at bayonet point, nuke the place and then sow the ground with salt.
Very generous with my tax money, aren`t you? What are you another bloody politician. By all means implement your plan but forget the financial nonsense.
 
#9
I vote that we give NI back to the Republic, make it a United Ireland and then unite Ireland and UK into the 'British and Irish Isles'.

That way, the Republicans get NI back and the UK grows into a stronger union.

For one thing, the republic don't want us. And although a new uk involving ireland is a good idea on the surface, it completely misses the point of republicanism .The irish dont want to be subject to the monarchy so making it part of the uk is definitely out.
Interestingly the census figures show that 30 something percent of people in northern ireland identify themselves primarily as 'northern irish' so there is some merit in the idea of making it an independent country, but thats really not what anyone wants is it? the whole point of the struggle over the last 30 years is that the population either want to be part of the uk or part of ireland. A random compromise is a bit of a non sequitur in that doesnt really address the grievances of either side, just ignores them and puts the popluation in their own wee playpen where they would be expected to play nice and not bother the rest of the uk even though its a solution no one asked for.
 

skid2

LE
Book Reviewer
#10
personaly i think the only cure is to give all of them 100k each, poke them out at bayonet point, nuke the place and then sow the ground with salt.
100k, great. Stick your bayonet and point me towards Prague or Barcelona. I take it the 100k is on top of our immoveable assets which can be bought off at market rate. That on top of the other stupid ideas I've heard is the stupidest idea I've heard in a while. The place would be empty.


Tit.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using ARRSE mobile app
 
#11
Ireland's already part of the British Isles, it's just not part of Great Britain.

Confused? You will be
Yes, I know that! The key point is a new name that includes Ireland in it, i.e. it's not merging Ireland into the UK, it's a new country called the "British and Irish Isles'.
 
#12
For one thing, the republic don't want us. And although a new uk involving ireland is a good idea on the surface, it completely misses the point of republicanism .The irish dont want to be subject to the monarchy so making it part of the uk is definitely out.
Interestingly the census figures show that 30 something percent of people in northern ireland identify themselves primarily as 'northern irish' so there is some merit in the idea of making it an independent country, but thats really not what anyone wants is it? the whole point of the struggle over the last 30 years is that the population either want to be part of the uk or part of ireland. A random compromise is a bit of a non sequitur in that doesnt really address the grievances of either side, just ignores them and puts the popluation in their own wee playpen where they would be expected to play nice and not bother the rest of the uk even though its a solution no one asked for.
With my solution, I would be at pains to point out that Ireland is not subordinate to the UK, the UK and Ireland are equal partners in this union, governed both from Dublin and London.
 
T

Taffd

Guest
#16
For one thing, the republic don't want us. And although a new uk involving ireland is a good idea on the surface, it completely misses the point of republicanism .The irish dont want to be subject to the monarchy so making it part of the uk is definitely out.
Interestingly the census figures show that 30 something percent of people in northern ireland identify themselves primarily as 'northern irish' so there is some merit in the idea of making it an independent country, but thats really not what anyone wants is it? the whole point of the struggle over the last 30 years is that the population either want to be part of the uk or part of ireland. A random compromise is a bit of a non sequitur in that doesnt really address the grievances of either side, just ignores them and puts the popluation in their own wee playpen where they would be expected to play nice and not bother the rest of the uk even though its a solution no one asked for.
So if being part of the UK is important, is it important enough to become mainland UK, or is there an insistence that they must be Northern Irish and UK?

I was also not suggesting a united Ireland but a separate entity.

The little history I think I know suggests that the mainland sent people over there many moons ago to become Irish over time, in order to make it part of the UK, and this in part, led to the troubles. I can see that at various times they've had legitimate grievances however, history cannot be changed and has brought us to where we are.

If all the people who want to be British emigrate to the mainland, surely everybody who remains becomes the new Northern Irish, with nobody to have a grievance against, and can consign history to the books.

Everybody gets a bit of what they want but not everything that they want.
 
T

trowel

Guest
#17
Anyone who wants to live in an Irish Republic is free to do so. The border is open.
Yep, the road to Paddies Paradise is wide open to the N.I.malcontents. That rattling noise you can hear in the background is Dr. Stealth fannying about with his bayonet. Someone tell him to put it away, it`s not needed.
 
#18
Yeah the ulster plantation. Those who came over wanted to keep ties with Britain, and be ruled by it. Fair enough, but I can also see why the irish view this as an 'invasion' in the same way I can understand why Argentina gets pissy over the Falkland islands.

There is an insistence to be Northern Irish and part of the uk in the same way the Scottish still want to retain their national identity and be part of the uk. Simply saying 'you can hop over the pond or and that'll solve everything' just wont do because the Northern Irish want some self determination and to an extent have it, with devolved policing and education.
 
T

Taffd

Guest
#19
Yeah the ulster plantation. Those who came over wanted to keep ties with Britain, and be ruled by it. Fair enough, but I can also see why the irish view this as an 'invasion' in the same way I can understand why Argentina gets pissy over the Falkland islands.

There is an insistence to be Northern Irish and part of the uk in the same way the Scottish still want to retain their national identity and be part of the uk. Simply saying 'you can hop over the pond or and that'll solve everything' just wont do because the Northern Irish want some self determination and to an extent have it, with devolved policing and education.
I'm totally for self-determination but surely the make-up of the Northern Irish 'people', who have that right, is skewed because of history's immigration designed purposely to do so. The problem is, the descendants of those immigrants are now as much Northern Irish, as were the original people.

The question is, in order to solve the problem, are they prepared to become completely 'Britified' by emigrating to the mainland? Is British more important than Northern Irish? Is it possible for them to become one or the other?
 
T

trowel

Guest
#20
My sisters in-laws are from NI and I think Harry Enfield summed it up nicely.

Harry Enfield - Ulsterman - YouTube

I think with these people, any settlement that makes one side happy will make the other side doubly unhappy.

Can we not just give Argentina NI and in return they relinquish any claim on the Falklands?
Dublin is terrified of being lumbered with N.I. What would the argentinians know about controlling a bunch of surly, obstreporous, aggressive Brits on a cold wet island in the Atlantic?
 

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