878,300 disabilty claiments fail to attend medical checks.

T

Taffd

Guest
#2
And a further, similar amount found fit for work upon assessment. About 1.7 million people extra, now seeking work.

If we're next told that the number of people out of work has not increased by this amount, or the number of people in work has increased by this amount, we can assume that someone, somewhere, is lying about something.

Interestingly, in the telegraph article, it was stated that the benefit bill would not be reduced a a result of this.

As clear a case of obnubilation as I've ever seen.
 
#4
Do ATOS get more money if they fail you?
As the % is high of those claimants that are failed at the ATOS medical but win on appeal!
 
#5
Is it better to have these people on disability benefit or on JSA, competing with everyone else? Surely the last thing the job market needs is millions of extra people.
 
#6
its amazing who they have got to work,, downs syndrome are now working at our asda,, they have to be walked around on a one to one so that will not last long,,
 
T

Taffd

Guest
#7
Do ATOS get more money if they fail you?
As the % is high of those claimants that are failed at the ATOS medical but win on appeal!
Supposedly about 60% win on appeal, which would equate to about 480,000. Which changes the figures significantly yet again.

More obnubilation.
 
T

Taffd

Guest
#8
Is it better to have these people on disability benefit or on JSA, competing with everyone else? Surely the last thing the job market needs is millions of extra people.
Well according to some, there's plenty of work about, if only they're prepared to look for it.

So why any government should wish to 'massage' the figures is beyond me.
 
#9
[h=3]Atos Healthcare in the UK[/h] Atos Healthcare's has a contract believed to be worth £400 million with the UK's Department for Work and Pensions (DWP), under which it "conduct disability assessments for people claiming a range of disability benefits including Employment Support Allowance, Incapacity Benefit, Disability Living Allowance and Industrial Injuries Disablement Benefit."[SUP][25][/SUP][SUP][26][/SUP]
Atos has been criticized in the media,[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][28][/SUP] in Parliament,[SUP][29][/SUP] by the medical profession,[SUP][30][/SUP] and by protest groups[SUP][31][/SUP][SUP][32][/SUP][SUP][33][/SUP] regarding its disability programs.
A government study published in 2012 found that half of the people identified as "fit for work" by Atos Healthcare's Work Capability Assessment on behalf of the Department of Work and Pensions in the UK, remained unemployed and without income.[SUP][34][/SUP][SUP][35][/SUP]
In 2012, 43 complaints against Atos doctors and nurses were being investigated by the General Medical Council or Nursing and Midwifery Council.[SUP][26][/SUP] Criticism has been directed at Atos over the ability of its staff to deal with complex mental health problems and conditions whose symptoms vary with time.[SUP][36][/SUP] In August 2012, Atos Healthcare claimed they had appointed 60 Mental Function Champions to provide additional training.[SUP][26][/SUP]
Atos assessors have found patients with terminal cancer or severe multiple sclerosis to be fit for work.[SUP][37][/SUP] 1,300 people died shortly after being declared fit for work by Atos.[SUP][38][/SUP]
In August 2011, twelve doctors working for Atos as disability assessors had been placed under investigation by the General Medical Council because of allegations of misconduct in relation to their duty of care to patients.[SUP][39][/SUP]
MP's first debated Atos Healthcare and the Work Capability Assessment in Westminster Hall on 4 September 2012.[SUP][40][/SUP]
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#10
when there were claims in for blisters and such its hardly surprising that the nu labour way of massaging the jobless figures by removing the cant be arsed onto something else would eventually fail.

the tories are stuck with trying to hide them somewhere else now. if they are no longer disabled but not jobseekers then they just get income support or whatever they call it nowadays.

its not all scrounging though - when I was on incapacity benefit for my broken wrist it paid me just enough to keep my bills paid and do the food shopping so I didn't try for anything else. when I got shafted by the medical and appeal before I went back into hospital I was not impressed as they thought I could work in a call centre. pain induced anger, agoraphobia and ptsd were not it seems a hinderance to me being able to work in a non existent call centre as I hadn't bothered to hit anyone recently. the magistrate who did the appeal didn't answer whether he would give me an extra point for throwing him out of the third floor window.

if they want to reduce the benefits bill then capping rents, bulk buying sky tv for claimants along with govt issue tax free fags and white cider would save billions.
 
#11
[h=3]Atos Healthcare in the UK[/h] Atos Healthcare's has a contract believed to be worth £400 million with the UK's Department for Work and Pensions (DWP), under which it "conduct disability assessments for people claiming a range of disability benefits including Employment Support Allowance, Incapacity Benefit, Disability Living Allowance and Industrial Injuries Disablement Benefit."[SUP][25][/SUP][SUP][26][/SUP]
Atos has been criticized in the media,[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][28][/SUP] in Parliament,[SUP][29][/SUP] by the medical profession,[SUP][30][/SUP] and by protest groups[SUP][31][/SUP][SUP][32][/SUP][SUP][33][/SUP] regarding its disability programs.
A government study published in 2012 found that half of the people identified as "fit for work" by Atos Healthcare's Work Capability Assessment on behalf of the Department of Work and Pensions in the UK, remained unemployed and without income.[SUP][34][/SUP][SUP][35][/SUP]
In 2012, 43 complaints against Atos doctors and nurses were being investigated by the General Medical Council or Nursing and Midwifery Council.[SUP][26][/SUP] Criticism has been directed at Atos over the ability of its staff to deal with complex mental health problems and conditions whose symptoms vary with time.[SUP][36][/SUP] In August 2012, Atos Healthcare claimed they had appointed 60 Mental Function Champions to provide additional training.[SUP][26][/SUP]
Atos assessors have found patients with terminal cancer or severe multiple sclerosis to be fit for work.[SUP][37][/SUP] 1,300 people died shortly after being declared fit for work by Atos.[SUP][38][/SUP]
In August 2011, twelve doctors working for Atos as disability assessors had been placed under investigation by the General Medical Council because of allegations of misconduct in relation to their duty of care to patients.[SUP][39][/SUP]
MP's first debated Atos Healthcare and the Work Capability Assessment in Westminster Hall on 4 September 2012.[SUP][40][/SUP]



Thanks for that, I didn't know how to use Wikipedia.
 
#14
After 19 years on IB (only paid some of it due to WP overlap) I recived my ESA50 filled in and sent off to atos sent special delivery so they could not claimed lost. (post office did lose it for a time ) I called atos they looked for it and called back when found. Then told no need for medical they sent form back to DWP a couple of weeks later got call telling me in support group for 3 years. Time from getting form to transfer less than 6 weeks . Many people transfer no problem.
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
#16
Here is the Telegraph article.

900,000 choose to come off sickness benefit ahead of tests - Telegraph

Nearly 900,000 people who were on incapacity benefit dropped their claim to the payments rather than undergo a tough medical test, latest government figures show. The 878,300 who decided not to have an official assessment of whether they were fit for work was more than a third of the total number of people claiming sickness-related benefits.

The statistics also revealed that some claimants cited conditions such as “blisters”, “sprains and strains” and “acne” as preventing them from having a job. More than 46,120 people claimed incapacity benefit because of “behavioural disorders due to the use of alcohol” while 29,130 claimants cited drug use.
There are blacks, whites and shades of grey in this. At one end of the spectrum will be the deserving cases who are fully entitled to incapacity benefit. At the other end of the spectrum will professional scroungers who see claiming incapacity benefit as another way of getting more money out of the state to fund their lifestyle on the dole. And in the middle with the the grey area with people with a disability a little too minor to claim, who have exaggerated it to get a higher level of benefits.

The system that got us to this stage is the joint fault of the Conservatives and Labour. It started under the Conservatives who saw it as a convenient way to massage the unemployment figures down by a few hundred thousand. And it really accelerate under Blair/Brown who used it both to camouflage worsening unemployment figures and to created a client state on benefits more likely to vote Labour.

And now we can't afford to throw the money away any longer.

There are two aspects to this: theft and fairness.

Theft

If you falsely claim benefits to which you are not entitled you are stealing from me and every other tax payer who funds your lifestyle. I resent every penny you steal from me because I would like that money to fund a better lifestyle for the genuinely incapacitate. If you steal my money, it can't be spent on the deserving.

Fairness

Any system that has to week through two and a half million claimants of disability benefit in short order is going to result in mistakes. I want the thieving scumbags falsely claiming incapacity benefit to have it removed as soon as possible, but I do not want the genuine cases to have it incorrectly removed.

I am worried that the incentive scheme given to ATOS is fuelling wrong assessments and heartily wish that there was a penalty clause in the contract so if the number of incorrect cases went over a certain limit, they would be hit by fines. Only then will they balance of the need for a rigorous examination of claimants against financial penalties for getting too many assessments wrong.

Wordsmith
 
#18
Does this mean there were 878,300 claiming that should not have been,or did the reports of the ATOS testing make them think it was not worth bothering to attend?

Benefits Shake-Up 'To Cost Families Hundreds'
No, it clearly means that because they are disabled they were NOT ABLE to attend. Hence they were claiming disability benefit in the first place.

Every shake up of the the system is always just to masage figures and try and save money. Even if it costs loads to audit claims and make changes, and results in a NET LOSS, they will always claim otherwise and the foolish sheeple will fall for it every time.

I know of a severely disabled child also with severe learning difficulties; with every agency going knowing her situation. Along comes a new so-called "agency" appointed to investigate claimants. She was interviewed and "examined" to see if she was fit for work. The woman dealing with her case file wanted to get her to repeat just three simple words, and that was it. If she could understand and repeat the three words then she would have been declared fit to work. Fortunately, she didn't like the look of this woman and clammed up, thereby failing this so-called test. The kid's parents, teachers, care workers and social workers, et all were disgusted by this stupid measure, as you can imagine.

There's no chance of the girl being employed to do a job, but no doubt the "figures" would have shown her as a false claimant.

The simple moral to this tale is: Don't believe such crap headlines, or Government spouting "facts-and figures" as there's always much more to it than a headline or a sound-bite.
 
#19
Is it better to have these people on disability benefit or on JSA, competing with everyone else? Surely the last thing the job market needs is millions of extra people.
Whatever your views on ATOS and Disability payments, are you seriously suggesting that it's better to pay people to sit around doing **** all than have them looking for work?
 
#20
As with so much of the benefit system, it is often those most in need who do not get, do not claim their due it or even apply for it at all eg the acutely mentally ill, wheras the benefit cheats/schemers know the system inside out, know what to say, how to act and what to claim.

If you can work then yes you should, but hearing of the utter lunacy regarding some of the ATOS decisions after assessment, does not fill anyone with hope.
 

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