5 mile feeding rule

Discussion in 'Army Reserve' started by msr, Jan 4, 2008.

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  1. msr

    msr LE

    Is this just a myth, or can someone actually point me to the bit of the regulations which state that you have to be five miles from your TAC to get fed at the army's expense?

    msr
     
  2. Can we have a poll?

    Myth or Reality?
     
  3. msr

    msr LE

    If you are going to vote reality, then you need to provide the reference ;)

    msr
     
  4. Does this mean that the army owe me some money for buying my food in the service stations on the way to different training areas. Ive been mobilised and have actually posed this question to my platoon commanders and had a short sharp witty answer thrown my way?
     
  5. No, because you should have been provided with sufficient rations to cover your weekend on the training area.
     
  6. Hmm, it might be an interpretation of....

    Regulations for Army allowances and Charges (Army Code 10 Revised 1996 Chapter 20 ............see 007

    Section 1 - FOOD CHARGES

    GENERAL

    20.001 Aim. To raise appropriate charges against Service personnel who are liable to pay for their food when it is supplied either directly or indirectly by the Service either in kind or by payment of cash allowances.

    20.002 Liability. Unless they are exempt under paras 20.010 and 20.011 Service personnel are to pay a Food Charge if they are provided with food from Service sources or under an approved lodging scheme or by Special Messing Allowance, Meals Out Allowance or by the special ‘Finding Own Food’ rate of LOA, or other food allowance.

    20.003 Types of Charge. There are 2 types of charge, liability for which is dependent upon MARISTAT. A serviceman is liable as follows:

    a. The Single Food Charge (SFC). A Service individual of MARISTAT 3, 4 and 5.

    b. The Married Unaccompanied Food Charge (MUFC). A Service individual of MARISTAT 1, 1 s/c and 2.

    c. A Service individual in MARISTAT 5s/c is to pay the MUFC unless the 1s/1c spouse is also fed from Service sources. In this case, the 1s/c spouse is to pay the MUFC, and the 5s/c spouse is to pay the SFC.

    20.004 Period of Payment. The Food Charge is to cover a complete day from midnight to midnight. It is to be paid for the day of joining but not for the day of departure from the unit.

    20.005 Change in Personal Circumstances. Service personnel are to report immediately any changes in personal circumstances which may affect their liability for Food Charges. Changes in liability for Food Charges are to be effective from the date of change in personal circumstances.

    CASUAL MEALS

    20.006 Liability. Service personnel not held on unit ration strength are to pay Casual Meal Rates for occasional meals taken in a mess at their parent unit (except for Service personnel who are accommodated under an approved lodging scheme). This applies equally to units in Northern Ireland.

    20.007 Temporary Duty. Service personnel on temporary duty over 5 miles from their parent unit are not required to pay for meals taken at a Service mess, except that an officer, warrant officer or senior NCO may be required to pay extra messing charges.

    20.008 Fed from Service Sources. Casual Meal Charges are not to be raised against living-out Service personnel who are fed from Service sources at sea, in the field or on exercise, or when they are fed by other than normal catering arrangements in a permanent mess.

    20.009 Additional Duties. Living-out Service personnel in MARISTAT 1-5 who are nominated or otherwise ordered to remain on duty or to return to duty and who, as a result, take a meal or meals during their additional duty hours which would otherwise have been taken at home, are not required to pay Casual Meal Charges. Where, for duty reasons, the requirement is to live in, and the period of duty exceeds, or is expected to exceed 48 hours, personnel of MARISTAT 3, 4 and 5 will be required to pay Food Charges from the outset. This concession applies during periods of additional duty which are in excess of daily published working hours and includes weekday nights, weekends, public holidays and block leave. The concession does not apply:

    a. To meals taken in a mess by living-out Service personnel during the course of their normal daily working hours (eg lunch).

    b. To a shift worker during the hours of their shift of watch keeping duty.

    c. To a Service individual who for personal or other reasons decides to work extra hours outside of their normal working hours.

    d. Where any meal could have been taken at the Service individual’s living out place of residence (ie the duty does not prevent the individual from returning home for a meal).

    e. To Service personnel in receipt of LOA at ‘Find Own Food’ rates.

    EXEMPTIONS FROM FOOD CHARGES

    20.010 General. Food Charges are to be deducted on a continuous basis from the pay account of Service personnel unless they are exempt as follows:

    a. For each day for which pay is forfeited under the Pay Warrant 1964 (Code No 14173). These include:

    (1) Civil custody.

    (2) Detention.

    (3) Absence without leave.

    (4) A soldier under sentence awaiting repatriation.

    b. When in civil or military hospitals, medical reception stations or military rehabilitation units as an in-patient. Charges are to cease from the date of admission to such an establishment.

    c. When serving in Field or Shipboard Conditions (but see also Chapter 17), for a continuous period which includes 2 consecutive nights as follows:

    (1) A night is deemed to start before 0300 hours and to end after 0300 hours. The determining factor for establishing exemption is to be the application of Field or Shipboard Conditions at 0300 hours on each of at least 2 consecutive nights. Once exemption is established it is to be retrospective to the commencement of Field or Shipboard Conditions.

    (2) Field or Shipboard Conditions may apply to either Food or Accommodation:

    (a) Personnel living in Service Messes may receive a Food Charge waiver if feeding arrangements are substandard.

    (b) Personnel accommodated in Field or Shipboard Conditions but feeding in a standard Mess will be liable for Food Charges.

    d. When authorised by their Commanding Officer to live out of barracks, and they are so doing, and are not provided with food or an allowance in lieu. Individual meals taken on a casual basis are to be subject to repayment, in accordance with para 20.006.

    e. When in Receipt of Lodging Allowance. A Service individual who is accommodated under an approved lodging scheme is, however, to pay a Food Charge.

    f. When in transit by ship or aircraft on duty for a period exceeding 48 hours and Subsistence Allowance is not admissible. Exemption is to be retrospective to the beginning of the period of transit, ie to the day of departure from barracks or residence.

    g. When unable for Service reasons to remain with or return to the unit to which they are posted or attached and are not fed under Service arrangements or in receipt of Subsistence Allowance, for a period exceeding 48 hours. Exemption is to be retrospective to the beginning of that period.

    h. When on leave (including sick leave or when sick at home) for periods exceeding 48 hours. The waiver of charges and removal from ration strength is retrospective to the beginning of the period, ie the time of leaving barracks or residence. Shiftworkers absent for more than 48 hours in between shift cycles, other than when on approved leave are exempt from the third day of absence, at which time they are to be taken off ration strength.

    i. Upon enlistment for any day for which pay is received from the recruiting agency.

    j. When officially declared ‘Missing’ or a ‘Prisoner Of War’.

    k. When serving on loan to a force of a Commonwealth or foreign government and receiving free food or a cash allowance in lieu from the host government. The Food Charge is to be raised, however, if the special rate of LOA applicable to a Service individual purchasing their own food is in issue. (See the Loan Service Manual (Code No 14295).

    l. When staying in a transit mess when travelling on posting or temporary duty to or from stations abroad.

    m. When on approved Adventurous Training expeditions lasting for a period of more than 48 hours a Service individual is to be regarded as serving in Field Conditions. (As defined in Chapter 17).

    20.011 Temporary Duty. A Service individual who does not pay Food Charges on a continuous basis at their normal place of duty, who proceeds on temporary duty for a period of less than 30 days is not required to pay a Food Charge. For periods of temporary duty that will exceed 30 days, the Food Charge is payable from the 31st day. The rate payable will be appropriate to the Service individual’s MARISTAT.

    20.012 Payment of Subsistence Allowance and Meals Out Allowance. When a Service individual normally paying a food charge is absent on duty for periods when Subsistence Allowance or individual Meals Out Allowance is payable, Food Charges are to continue to be charged to the Service individual’s account but a Missed Meal Payment may be admissible in accordance with Chapter 8.

    20.013 Exceptional Circumstances. In exceptional circumstances when parties or individuals are detached for long periods on semi-official undertakings, eg as members of survey teams or expeditions, when food is provided from Service sources and exemption from Food Charges is considered justified, applications giving full details should be submitted through the chain of command to the MOD.

    RATES

    20.014 General. Food Charges and Casual Meal Charges are shown in Chapter 1.
     
  7. If I remember correctly its not 5 miles but 5 hours.

    When I visitied the workshops in Colchester - well over the 5 hour rule there and back from London - we weren't allowed to use the cookhouse even though we had ID (MoD 90/Chit in Lieu). It was different in Chelsea/Wellington/Regents Park Barracks where we were welcomed as long as we signed the roster - and they were just around the corner.

    For the Collie trips we had to put a claim in and see if it magically appeared on our pay slips - our PSAO was a mean c~nt and probably thought the money came out of his own pocket!
     
  8. Gents I suggest you do a search on this topic as it has been done quite a few times. I would look in Pay and Personnel as the rules completely changed for all personnel on 1 Jul 07. The regulations are in JSP 752 and the Defence Catering Manual neither of which I have to hand at the moment.
     
  9. I've not claimed myself, but I'd tend to argue "yes" depending on the circumstances. If you are Independent and you're travelling from your TAC to the training area, then no, unless you're obliged to set off before a reasonable evening meal time and don't have the opportunity to use service messing en route.

    If you're Specialist, the same criteria would apply, but with the addition that if your training area is at (or near - awaiting the answer to msr's post) your nominal TAC, then you wouldn't - even if this involves a journey of several hours. Having to depart before lunchtime may swing it for one meal, though.

    If you're in a position to claim for the meal, don't forget to claim for the parking meter while you're having your meal! :twisted:
     
  10. Failed the PFT ? :D [marq=down]Pie finding Test[/marq])


    You know the BQMS has access. :wink:
     
  11. msr

    msr LE

    BPC,

    The 5 hour rule is a separate one.

    Wingletang,

    I see your regulations and raise you this, from TA Regs:

    Messing
    3.415. Members of the TA are entitled to be provided with messing under collective arrangements, under the following circumstances:
    a. While attending annual camp.
    b. During whole time courses or attachments.
    c. While attending weekend training.

    (See also JSP 456, Vol 2, Chapter 5 and JSP 754, Chapter 3, Section 6.)

    msr
     
  12. in my TA unit it was 5 miles and it lead to all sorts of nonsense for training weekends where all our companies would waste a bloody fortune moving to each others company locations just to get enough money to feed the guys more than rats. I beleive that recently just before i started my FTRS that was dropped but I dunno for sure
     
  13. I raise you...um,

    I think it's all in JSP 754 (chapter 9/10) but can''t get access to it from here....
     
  14. Is that fed and charged the approrpiate daily rate, or fed for free?
     
  15. We always used to get free scoff when visiting our parent regiment (who are regular) as it was over the 5 miles. That all changed when they got PAYD though and we now have to pay.