300 based on fact at all?

#1
As my ancient Greek history is shite, when I was watching the film for the first time last night, I was wondering if there is any truth in the story.
 

Alsacien

LE
Moderator
#3
allyjs said:
As my ancient Greek history is shite, when I was watching the film for the first time last night, I was wondering if there is any truth in the story.
Not much in the version they produced.

The phalanx tactic, professional discipline and superior personal body armour saw the 300 hold a small front against massive numbers - what you saw was a bunch of oiled up guys wearing only leather thongs, breaking ranks and swinging away like tennis players......

... if you liked it you must be a homo :wink:
 
#4
allyjs said:
As my ancient Greek history is shite, when I was watching the film for the first time last night, I was wondering if there is any truth in the story.
Try here: Battle of Thermopylae Thermopylae was referred to in the film as "Hot Columns" or some other rubbish (apparently the US audience might not have understood the Greek name, although there are ancient placenames in use in the USA (eg Syracuse))

Alsacien said:
Not much in the version they produced.

The phalanx tactic, professional discipline and superior personal body armour saw the 300 hold a small front against massive numbers - what you saw was a bunch of oiled up guys wearing only leather thongs, breaking ranks and swinging away like tennis players......

... if you liked it you must be a homo :wink:
I think the director took this statue too literally:



Although in reality the whole film was a means of increasing sales of Belgian chocolates: it was meant to be a viral ad, but it got out of hand.
 
#5
I think that film holds some kind of record for most amount of boobs (male and female) on screen...
 
#6
I was really disappointed with the film.

It had the groundings to be an epic, but someone say 'Spparrta' with a Motherwell accent was a bit pants.

Fcukin nails though, them Spartans
 
#7
300 is really a film version of the Frank Miller comic books (sorry graphic novels) of that title loosely based around the Battle of Thermopylae and the Spartan culture.

http://www.moebiusgraphics.com/comics/300.php

so it is fact based crap.

When it came to it there were 300 Spartans but also 700 Thespian volunteers, 400 Theban soldiers who were not entirely happy to be there and 900 Helots who as serfs of the Spartans did not really have a lot of choice. But 2300 does not have the same ring to it.

The critical flaw in the film though is that in reality the Spartans did not have chest and back waxing facilities available.
 
#8
there definately was a leonidas and a xerxes and a battle at hermopalae.
 
#9
there was a much earlier film, called the 300 Spartans with Richard Egan filmed in 1962, oldie but a goldie !.
 
#10
Blogg said:
300 is really a film version of the Frank Miller comic books (sorry graphic novels) of that title loosely based around the Battle of Thermopylae and the Spartan culture.

http://www.moebiusgraphics.com/comics/300.php

so it is fact based crap.

When it came to it there were 300 Spartans but also 700 Thespian volunteers, 400 Theban soldiers who were not entirely happy to be there and 900 Helots who as serfs of the Spartans did not really have a lot of choice. But 2300 does not have the same ring to it.

The critical flaw in the film though is that in reality the Spartans did not have chest and back waxing facilities available.
Also another possible flaw being, I don't think maximuscle and creatine was readily available in ancient Greece.
 
#11
It's loosely based on a quiet night out I had with a few mates. I say loosely because there was only about 20 of us, but hey, that's not what the police report or the defiled virgins said!

T C
 
#13
It's a loose portrayal of historic events according to the greeks. Ask the persians and I'm sure they have a different take on it.

One of the things the movie did do correctly is show that they were not alone and while the movie shows a handful, they had help from the thesbians, and other groups that fought alongside them.

I think the movie was sort of short on content but the visuals are spectacular. And I mean the effects, not the homo-erotic leather jockstrap wearing guys in capes.
 
#14
As well as being perhaps the gayest movie in years 300 is packed with historical errors but is fairly faithful to the comic it was based on.

Wiki has this:
...
Paul Cartledge, Professor of Greek History at Cambridge University, advised the filmmakers on the pronunciation of Greek names, and states that they "made good use" of his published work on Sparta. He praises the film for its portrayal of "the Spartans' heroic code," and of "the key role played by women in backing up, indeed reinforcing, the male martial code of heroic honor," while expressing reservations about its "'West' (goodies) vs 'East' (baddies) polarization."[75] Cartledge writes that he enjoyed the film, although he found Leonidas' description of the Athenians as "boy lovers" ironic, given his views on the institutional pederasty of the Spartan educational system.[76]

Ephraim Lytle, assistant professor of Hellenistic History at the University of Toronto, states that 300 selectively idealizes Spartan society in a "problematic and disturbing" fashion, as well as portraying the "hundred nations of the Persians" as monsters and non-Spartan Greeks as weak. He suggests that the film's moral universe would have seemed as "bizarre to ancient Greeks as it does to modern historians."[77]

Victor Davis Hanson, formerly professor of Classical history at California State University, Fresno, who wrote the foreword to a 2007 re-issue of the graphic novel, states that the film demonstrates a specific affinity with the original material of Herodotus in that it captures the martial ethos of ancient Sparta and represents Thermopylae as a "clash of civilizations". He remarks that Simonides, Aeschylus and Herodotus viewed Thermopylae as a battle against "Eastern centralism and collective serfdom", which opposed "the idea of the free citizen of an autonomous polis".[78] He further states that the film portrays the battle in a "surreal" manner, and that the intent was to "entertain and shock first, and instruct second."[79]

Touraj Daryaee, associate professor of Ancient History at California State University, Fullerton, criticizes the central theme of the movie, that of "free" and "democracy loving" Spartans against "slave" Persians. Daryaee states that the Achaemenid (Persian) empire hired and paid people regardless of their sex or ethnicity, whereas in fifth-century Athens "less than 14%" of the population participated in democratic government, and "nearly 37%" of the population were slaves. He further states that Sparta "was a militaristic monarchy with a council of elders which decided political matters, but it was not a democracy."[80]
VDH above offers a fair defense but the film is really doesn't do the Spartans justice. They were a dreadful lot that would have made the Nazis queasy.

One key scene that really disappointed me was the Spartan rights of passage ritual. The historical version is much more interesting.
...
Between leaving the agoge and joining the syssitia a select few young men were arranged into groups, and were sent off into the countryside with nothing, and were expected to survive on wits and cunning. It was assumed that they would steal their food, yet anyone caught stealing was severely punished. Many speculate that this was to teach the young Spartans stealth and quickness. If you were caught, it was concluded that you were not quick enough or silent enough. This was called the crypteia, secret (ritual). This was very probably, in origin, an old initiation rite, a preparation for their later career as elite soldiers. Other sources claim that the crypteia (or krypteia) was an "adolescent death squad" made up of the most promising young Spartans. Their job was to roam the countryside killing helots at night in order to instill fear in the slave population and prevent rebellion.
...
Comparisons have been made with the Salafi Jihadis and Spartans: fanatically religious, long haired, preening nonces with an often suicidal approach to battle.

I'd recommend Persian Fire: The First World Empire, Battle for the West. Holland rightly sees the Greeks as a very eccentric group on the fringe of a great hegemonic Empire that brushed off this particular series of scuffles largely unaffected. Rather like the Taliban confronting America today.

The Spartans eventually sided with the Persians to crush Athens. It would be centuries before the Macedonian conquered both Greece and Persia.
 
#16
Try reading Steven Pressfields excellent book about it called Gates of Fire. Slightly fictionalised but much more fact based than that crock-o-shite.
 
#17

Alsacien

LE
Moderator
#18
Cuddles said:
There probably was much more bum-love in reality than was implied in the film!

Check out Herodotus - I don't know, what are they teaching them in school these days? Tourism and media studies probably...

http://www.livius.org/he-hg/herodotus/herodotus01.htm
That Greeks were homos is not exactly a revelation now is it :wink:

Seems they have apparently kept by that tradition more consistently than that of exceptional military competence and bravery....
 
#19
bobath said:
Try reading Steven Pressfields excellent book about it called Gates of Fire. Slightly fictionalised but much more fact based than that crock-o-shite.
I would agree with that, it seems to give a fictionalised bue believeable view of the affair. At least you can believe it was researched;the same as Flashman and if you can find it Firelord (the Arthurian legend) you know it is fiction but it gives an impression of the facts.

300 reminds me of many othe rHollywood takes on history, U-571, The A-Team, Pearl harbour etc
 
#20
bobath said:
Try reading Steven Pressfields excellent book about it called Gates of Fire. Slightly fictionalised but much more fact based than that crock-o-shite.
Agree wholeheartedly - one of the best books I have ever read.
 

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