rifle upgrades

**HarryBosch** · 20-04-2008, 00:32

Originally Posted by EX_STAB

Originally Posted by HarryBosch

Originally Posted by ugly

Ok so at least they get to see that breeze blocks can be trashed by a GPMG!

Yep. The nods got to blast away at breeze blocks, baffle boxes, rover door panels, engines, tree stumps, brick walls, oil drums full of water, pigs heads against white sheets, ye olde flak jackets etc, using GPMGs, SLRs, 9 mils, 45s, 38s, AK47s, MG42, Uzi, M16s, MAC10, M1 Garand, M1 Carbine and even an old Thompson! So as well as the bullet pen lesson it also gave them experience of stripping, assembling and firing a variety of unfamiliar weapons, the rationale being, as you know, that they could (in principle!) quickly figure out how to load, fire or make safe virtually any small arm they might come across in future . Great fun. :D

Edited for biff spelling.

Christ! That's a bit progressive isn't it?

True, but you can see 'ops' in the demos i.e. in the 70s all the NI hands, me included, had the nods firing at the flak jackets, helmets, walls, vehicles, etc using US weapons and calibres known to be possessed by PIRA. When we came back from 82 we added bullet pen lessons around dug in or hardened positions and weight of fire.

If I remember correctly it was one of the course requirements that a young Cpl on his PW course modify, design or otherwise improve upon a weapon system, fieldcraft or Troop tactic. Mine was a simple alternative firing position for the 66. My best mate's was a checklist for Wessie Mk V pilots inserting troops because he was pissed off with them flaring all over the place and letting every fucker know where they were. Another lad designed a fighting trench based upon the experiences of US troops in Vietnam; it took a dozen of us a day to dig/build it. The nice thing was that we trialled it with the recruits on my first ever post on a training team.
Happy days!
Harry

**Mr Happy** · 21-04-2008, 08:56

Originally Posted by misterp

these rifle updgrade discussions always end up into a discussion of how 762 is better than 556!

True

Originally Posted by misterp

you can carry a lot less 7.62x51 than you can 5.55x45, i think thats one of the main reasons it was switched, 80-100 rounds isn't going to last very long and for the same weight you could carry more than double the 5.56.

Just under triple ISTR

Originally Posted by misterp

5.56 was adotped during the cold war when we wanted to make casualities and take as many people off the battle field as possible, which isn't really right for today.

No it wasn't. We adopted it because the FN FAL was old and everyone kept running out of ammo during the attack in FI. Also 556 was seen as more friendly for the house clearing in NI IIRC. Nothing to do with shoot 1, 4 to carry him. Just an urban rumour.

Originally Posted by misterp

the SA80 and the 5.56 nato round will be around for a long time!

True.

**winnfield** · 25-04-2008, 06:35

There was talk of mudbricks before ...

From Canadian TV news: (see last minute)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUe5kSYXa88

**EX_STAB** · 25-04-2008, 07:55

Originally Posted by winnfield

There was talk of mudbricks before ...

From Canadian TV news: (see last minute)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUe5kSYXa88

Looking at that blockhouse at 4:30 I think an AVRE would be the thing.
A Centurion AVRE that is!

**HE117** · 25-04-2008, 13:49

Originally Posted by EX_STAB

Originally Posted by winnfield

There was talk of mudbricks before ...

From Canadian TV news: (see last minute)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUe5kSYXa88

Looking at that blockhouse at 4:30 I think an AVRE would be the thing.
A Centurion AVRE that is!

Noooo

NOT the 165 AVRE.....

Whoever designed that thing had obviously come from submarine design and had a thing about flying torpedoes.

Interesting concept, but ferkin dangerous!

**ugly** · 25-04-2008, 14:02

Cant be as dangerous as candidates for a VC making mousehoules with barmines can it?

**EX_STAB** · 25-04-2008, 15:04

Originally Posted by ugly

Cant be as dangerous as candidates for a VC making mousehoules with barmines can it?

I wouldn't have thought so and I can't understand why it wasn't replaced. The argument that Fast Air can do the job with equal precision doesn't stack up to my mind.

1) Fast Air may not be available. (Weather, AAA etc.)
2) I wouldn't want to be anywhere near the bunker when it got bombed so the assault section would need extra time to get to the breach, time in which the enemy can re-org.

**Flying Felix** · 25-04-2008, 15:22

Originally Posted by HE117

Originally Posted by EX_STAB

Originally Posted by winnfield

There was talk of mudbricks before ...

From Canadian TV news: (see last minute)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUe5kSYXa88

Looking at that blockhouse at 4:30 I think an AVRE would be the thing.
A Centurion AVRE that is!

Noooo

NOT the 165 AVRE.....

Whoever designed that thing had obviously come from submarine design and had a thing about flying torpedoes.

Interesting concept, but ferkin dangerous!

That's why we gave it to the RE, couldn't risk using anybody important!

:P

**HE117** · 25-04-2008, 16:27

Originally Posted by ugly

Cant be as dangerous as candidates for a VC making mousehoules with barmines can it?

Ohhh Yesss it can....!

Actually running up with a breaching charge is not as dangerous as it sounds - the opposition has as much trouble getting through the walls as we have...

Last time I saw the 165 fired they tied a long long bit of D10 to the firing handle & hid in a trench

Apart from anything else, there is the problem of getting the 56T of scrap metal launcher into Helmand in the first place. Something a bit more man portable is much more likely to survive..

Worry not Ugs, the boys have got a number of quite successful (and tolerably reliable) ways of creating holes in walls. The 165 was never anywhere near reliable enough to be used up close & personal....

**ugly** · 25-04-2008, 16:40

I'll take your word for it!

**tangosix** · 25-04-2008, 21:17

Originally Posted by HE117

Worry not Ugs, the boys have got a number of quite successful (and tolerably reliable) ways of creating holes in walls.

Hello HE117,

are you talking about our secret weapon?

tangosix.

**HE117** · 26-04-2008, 20:08

Sh1t - rumbled....

**EX_STAB** · 27-04-2008, 14:05

Flash eliminators. This design has a "toothed" effect at the business end to improve its utility in "hand to hand" combat. I suppose it might do a bit more damage than an ordinary one if you hit someone in the face with it....

Worthwhile for those weapons that can't take a bayonet? Or perhaps just a bit of fantasy for the US survivalist market...

http://www.yankeehillmachine.com/store/muzzle.html