Originally Posted by Darthspud

Has anyone asked the crabs what they think they will need?

Shouldnt the real question be..

Has anyone asked the Army what they need so they can tell the RAF what they need

MM
Interesting points as ever, will reply later

The German Transall are overally in very good condition and have much less flying hours than the French so much so that the French AF actually tried to buy some of the Luftwaffe some years ago.

What more they rarely use them out of rough airstrips while it's bread and butter for French air force crews who all have experience of operating "rough" everywhere in Afghanistan and Africa from Chad to Ivory Coast, Djibouti, Gabon, Senegal etc.

I wanted the G222 thirty years ago, so some C27J now would suit me. Add in some more C17 and possibly some more C130J and we would be sorted in the short term.

It is then politics to decide if we continue to support the A400M as an eventual C130 replacement or if we tell Airbus that we are not going to throw any more good money after bad.

Originally Posted by meridian

Originally Posted by Darthspud

Has anyone asked the crabs what they think they will need?

Shouldnt the real question be..

Has anyone asked the Army what they need so they can tell the RAF what they need

MM
Interesting points as ever, will reply later

No. Otherwise we'd end up with large amounts of Islanders, equipped for bde para assaults but with no thought given to AAR, DAS, manning or many other requirements! :D

Unfortunately, whatever the RAF or Army want is only a very small part of the debate in the real world, as bubbles has eloquently attempted to explain elsewhere.

Regards,
MM

Am I the only one who finds it strange that the A400 is talked about as a straight C130 replacement?

Last time I looked it was more IL76 load capable, C130 strip capable, ie a strategic/tactical mix with some really innovative cargo capabilities...

As for canceling the project... nah, too much heat for the politicians, it will arrive eventually...

Originally Posted by Bubbles_Barker

Originally Posted by DrStealth

so that means a few more C-17's and extra C-130j's to fulfil lift requirment then?

good. thats a better option for the UK, (and mybe a few of the C-27j spartans would be a good idea too?)

Have you been reading my work again? :D

It's the opinion of everyone who doesn't like the A400M much

Originally Posted by marble

Am I the only one who finds it strange that the A400 is talked about as a straight C130 replacement?

Last time I looked it was more IL76 load capable, C130 strip capable, ie a strategic/tactical mix with some really innovative cargo capabilities...

As for canceling the project... nah, too much heat for the politicians, it will arrive eventually...

It's the C-17 paradox: when it turns up it will be the best aircraft of its kind in the world, and we'll wonder how we ever it without it. Until then, we'll hate it, and cry out for more of what we already have in production. The truth though is that the C-130 has hit the buffers in terms of what it can be expanded into.

I was never a fan of the A400, yet another Political Aircraft fostered on the Armed Forces.
As long as Airforce's are Lead by Fighter Pilots, Trash Haulers will always be a second rate job.
My 'Hero' from WW II was Bill Slim and never was their a Commander in the field who thought so highly of the Supply System given to him by the Allied Airforce's, they enabled so many of his Victories.
The immediate problem now is the supply of the Afghanistan based troops.
The present RAF fleet is being worked to death at a far higher flying rate then was ever conceived.
In my Opinion the only sensible solution is to drop the A400 and go for what we know works.
C130J, C-17 and the only gamble on a smaller 'Feeder' C27J seems to be the recommended choice.
john
But Speed is needed and as several board members have pointed out it is now a Political Problem for an administration that will in practical terms soon be out of office.

sorry to derail the thread for a mo....................

Originally Posted by jonwilly

My 'Hero' from WW II was Bill Slim and never was their a Commander in the field who thought so highly of the Supply System given to him by the Allied Airforce's, they enabled so many of his Victories.

I'v just finished 'Slim, Master of War - Burma and the birth of modern warfare' by Robert Lyman

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Slim-Master-.../dp/184529226X

Slim states without doubt that it was the strategic and tactical air lift what won the campaign for 14th Army.

an excellent read.

Yes DR.
I have a copy on my Bookshelf and am just finishing off Bill Slims Defeat into Victory.
A marvelous read by a Master who who was humble yet so proud of the Men who served with him.
He gives credit where due and accepts his faults and failings in the most open manner.
john