Useful

**cernunnos** · 19-01-2012, 09:00

Has anyone seen my Bedford 4T MK with the moniker "Mal Oeuf?" The VRN escapes me but I'm certain to remember it at around 3 am tommorrow.

**Thai_exile** · 19-01-2012, 09:12

Originally Posted by Biscuits_Brown

Shir?

The original plan was for 750 Chieftain Mk5P' s, (the P standing for "Persia"), 300 (?) Shir 1's and finally 1500 Shir 2's to be sold to the Shah. UK was working on developing the MBT80 (?) or some such collaborative NATO tank at the time and were not intending to use the Shah's tank; it was solely for him. "It is nothing like we want or need" (as quoted by a very senior officer or civil servant when I asked the question.) Then the Shah was deposed during or close to the end of the Mk5P deliveries, and after that the collaborative MBT project fell through. ROF's said "Whoops! Help!" Suddenly Shir 1 was exactly what we wanted and met all our requirements, so it was called Challenger 1 and the planned Shir 2 became Challenger 2. The ROF's were very happy as they had tooled up and invested heavily for the Shah's contract. Incidentally, the Kuwaities also ordered 156 Chieftain Mk5K which were just about the same as the Mk5P's but painted a slightly different shade of sand.

In a TV interview, the Shah was asked; "What will you do with over 2000 main battle tanks?". His answer: "Anything I like!". Didn't quite work out that way, did it?

**Trackpen** · 19-01-2012, 09:18

Originally Posted by pandaplodder

FV 214 Conqueror was cancelled, there's one in the RAC museum and IWM Duxford

Do you mean the Vickers MBT which was an export version of a tank that used Chieftain parts but was lighter

There was the Vickers Mk3 and this was followed, in 1980, by the Vickers Valiant.

**Trackpen** · 19-01-2012, 09:24

Originally Posted by Iolis

I am sure there is, but I have never worked out, the reason why, our tanks are always named with a designation beginning with the letter 'C' - as in; 'Churchill', 'Conqueror', 'Centurion', 'Chieftain', 'Challenger'?

Can anyone enlighten me?

As an aside: back in the early 1980s, when the UK was looking at collaborative ventures for a future MBT, one of the possibilities under discussion was a joint effort with Giat in France.
Indeed, they actually got round to putting forward possible names for the new beast. It was a senior chap at Giat, who had been present at the "naming meeting", who told me the MoD rep, having pointed out that British tanks had names beginning with 'C', suggested "Crecy" as a suitable designation for the proposed tank.
This was not approved by his French counterpart!

**Thai_exile** · 19-01-2012, 09:28

See my post above. So that's why it was cancelled!! Yes, the project was called FMBT rather than MBT80 as I posted. The mists are clearing!

**soprano54** · 19-01-2012, 09:30

Originally Posted by pandaplodder

Slightly off topic

Chally 1 or 2?

CR1!

**BTDT** · 19-01-2012, 09:37

ISTR that some of the "failed export order" Shir were repainted and sold to Jordan?

**Trackpen** · 19-01-2012, 09:39

Originally Posted by BTDT

ISTR that some of the "failed export order" Shir were repainted and sold to Jordan?

Re-named Khalid, if memory serves.

**BTDT** · 19-01-2012, 09:43

Originally Posted by Trackpen

Re-named Khalid, if memory serves.

Thanks for that, I couldn't recall the name. A batch of about 400 rings a bell.

**Thai_exile** · 19-01-2012, 09:47

Originally Posted by Trackpen

Re-named Khalid, if memory serves.

I am not sure that the Shir 1 had actually started coming through before the Shah went. I may be wrong. The Khalid may well have been residual Mk5P' s in the pipeline or from the first batch of Shir 1's before they morphed into Chally1's. Probably the latter.