ARmy Rumour SErvice

**soprano54** · 18-05-2012, 15:44

Originally Posted by Trax2go

I'd pay to see the RTR do the changing of the Guard in black coveralls and oilly berrets doing the Tankie Shuffle outside BH and down to Clarence House etc. The tourists would not know what to make of it.

I'd also buy the video. Priceless

Go to facking Landan a few weekends after the 'March to the Cenotaph' and you'll see the RTR doing the same dressed in thier black denims and berets!

**QRK2** · 18-05-2012, 16:00

Originally Posted by brave-coward

I tend to agree with Jorrocks, in that either do ceremonial well or not at all. To my mind getting civvies (or the TA) to do ceremonial is not even worth considering.

It's obviously escaped your notice that 'the TA' has been doing ceremonial, including for state visits, in the City of London since before the Second World War. Since Guards Div have now got the LONDONS I'd put even money on them picking up some of the load in SW1 within a few years.

See also:

http://www.britishpathe.com/video/bu...kingham-palace

**brave-coward** · 18-05-2012, 16:26

Originally Posted by CaptainPlume

Wonder if the shapely filly from the QOY (?) will rock up this year, she looks most toothsome in her bowler hat & long skirt.

I remember seeing either this or another female yeomanry officer at the Cavalry Memorial Parade a few years ago, wearing a mens' bowler hat and carrying a mens' umbrella. She looked utterly ridiculous, the equivalent of a man wearing drag. A smart (female style) suit, either with a ladies hat and umbrella or none at all would have been suitable. Cav Mem is about remembering the fallen it is neither a circus nor the appropriate moment to make some sort of misguided political statement.

**elovabloke** · 18-05-2012, 16:29

Originally Posted by brave-coward

we cannot afford to give the "die in a ditch" regimental association types a vote.

I would guess that those who still support the Regimental Associations never have and never will have any say in who goes or who stays. More to do with the hoy paloy at the top who are busy protecing their little perks.

The amalgamation into cobat corps was strongly pushed for by those on the coal face back in the 80's during but the powers to be thought it was all pie in the sky. Until the Houshold Div come into play the infighting will continue.

**brave-coward** · 18-05-2012, 16:33

Originally Posted by elovabloke

I would guess that those who still support the Regimental Associations never have and never will have any say in who goes or who stays. More to do with the hoy paloy at the top who are busy protecing their little perks.

The amalgamation into cobat corps was strongly pushed for by those on the coal face back in the 80's during but the powers to be thought it was all pie in the sky. Until the Houshold Div come into play the infighting will continue.

Somewhat cynical perhaps, but I can't argue (especially with the HDiv point).

**mph1977** · 18-05-2012, 16:47

Originally Posted by Glad_its_all_over

Is there any particular reason why HCMR couldn't be manned by civilian horse-lovers, enlisted in the MPGS for the purpose of being exceptionally shiny and riding horses and so on?Just asking, like.

do they even need to be MPGS/ NRPS /FTRS ? while that's applealing to maintain the military ethos - is it necessarily military ethos that needs to underpin or just the ability to 'put on the show' ?

the same could be said of any of the 'mainly ceremonial' formations

**CaptainPlume** · 18-05-2012, 19:02

Originally Posted by brave-coward

I remember seeing either this or another female yeomanry officer at the Cavalry Memorial Parade a few years ago, wearing a mens' bowler hat and carrying a mens' umbrella. She looked utterly ridiculous, the equivalent of a man wearing drag. A smart (female style) suit, either with a ladies hat and umbrella or none at all would have been suitable. Cav Mem is about remembering the fallen it is neither a circus nor the appropriate moment to make some sort of misguided political statement.

Terribly sorry, but I think your post rather mean spirited. Aside from anything else a bowler hat on a lady is entirely appropriate dress for hunting which would seem to tie in well with the Yeomanry style.

The young lady I am thinking of looks, IMNSVHO, very elegant indeed and has adapted the traditional "uniform" in a thoroughly respectful manner. Feck me, I sound like Gok Wan!

**Sir_Sidney_Ruff_Diamond** · 18-05-2012, 19:55

The Canadians seem to manage with Stab cavalry

Welcome | The Governor General's Horse Guards | National Defence and the Canadian Forces

**brave-coward** · 18-05-2012, 21:39

Originally Posted by CaptainPlume

Terribly sorry, but I think your post rather mean spirited. Aside from anything else a bowler hat on a lady is entirely appropriate dress for hunting which would seem to tie in well with the Yeomanry style.

The young lady I am thinking of looks, IMNSVHO, very elegant indeed and has adapted the traditional "uniform" in a thoroughly respectful manner. Feck me, I sound like Gok Wan!

Ah yes, yeomanry style. Something our TA RAC officer brethren seem to spend a little too much time and effort thinking about rather than concentrating on delivering something militarily useful in a reasonably professional manner. "More Cav than the Cav" goes the old saying...

I think we will need to agree to disagree on the subject of female officer Cav Mem attire. While I'll concede that Hyde Park probably has its fair share of foxes (of both nature), I'm not sure that justifies countryside/hunting rig, particularly since all of the male officers are clad in city suits.

Out of mild curiosity, I didn't think the TA had females in the teeth arms any more; or does this just apply to the infantry?

**brave-coward** · 18-05-2012, 22:10

Originally Posted by Sir_Sidney_Ruff_Diamond

The Canadians seem to manage with Stab cavalry

Welcome | The Governor General's Horse Guards | National Defence and the Canadian Forces

Apparently not even "STAB" cavalry. Governor General's Horse Guards Cavalry Squadron says: "The Squadron is made up of both military and civilian volunteers"

The questions are:

1. Do we want a mounted ceremonial capability?
2. If yes, on what scale, in terms of unit strength and how often do you want to use it?
3. Do you want to man it with "real soldiers" (i.e. those who are actually members of the armed forces, be it regular or TA)?
4. Who should pay for it? The MoD? The Department for Culture, Media and Sport? Some sort of private initiative or charity?

The answers to the questions above should give you the optimum solution for the delivery of this capability. Possible COAs might be:

1. No change.
2. Reduction to one Sqn, with compensating reductions in taskings and commitment to the QBP, etc., but delivered in the same way by regular forces.
3. Delete all mounted ceremonial activity.
4. Some sort of system of sponsored reserves, where you employ the same number of personnel, but as civilians, which you mobilise as reservists when they don uniform.

The problem is that you can't really give the capability wholesale to the TA, because horses require feeding, exercising and generally looking after seven days a week, so unless you are going to employ a force of civilian stable girls in addition to the TA riders it is not really going to work. There is also the perpetual problem with the TA in that you can't rely on them all to turn up so you will always get the embarrassing gaps in the parade which rather defeats the object of the exercise. Also, an evening a week and a weekend or two a month is hardly sufficient to get people up to the required standard and on this I agree with the HDiv line on all ceremonial activity: "Either we do it well or we don't do it at all".